Poll: GOTO / Push To or Find it yourself ?

[niallk]

I chose to get push-to on my 15": to try to see more on the nights I can get out.  I traded the weight of a magnifying optical finder for an AN unit by the EP.  It works very well indeed!

However, on my 10", it was find myself - and yes it sometimes very frustrating, but when I got a new target there was a sense of exhilaration and achievement that is lacking with push-to.  There was also more of a sense of accomplishment in learning my way around the sky over the seasons.

When I started it took me 5 nights to find Andromeda 🤣🤣  But wow... when I did!! 😉

[Andy ES]

I Use CPC Sky Align all night every night. Its quick and easy to set up.

The accuracy has always been superb and gives  quicker access to more targets.

I do how however review the stars used in the set up process, once the computer has told me what they are, so I’m getting more familiar with the sky.

Tracking is also great, especially if you want to show the same object to a few people.

I do sometimes just push the scope around manually, normally for lunar observation.

Also As a devout GOTO user I don’t mind “Real Astronomers” looking down their noses At me! 😂 

 

 

[AstroKeith]

Goto is not cheating.

How many professional astronomers now push their telescopes. None unless they are using a heritage instrument.

So using goto (if you want to) is being professional! It can give you more time on target, especially when conditions are harsh

[Knighty2112]

Use three different kinds of mount combinations options when observing;

1. For small/mid range scopes & for quicker set up I use AZ5 with slow motion controls on Berlebach Report tripod, or if using a heavier/longer ‘frac I’ll use my Skytee ll with slow motion controls on a Berlebach Uni-28 mount. 
 

2. If I don’t feel like lugging out the heavier Skytee ll but want to use one of my longer ‘fracs I will sometimes use my AA Sabre push to mount.

3. If I feel like a really good, longer session under the stars I have a choice of using either my Celestron SE8 goto mount which I can use my C8 SCT on, or again if I want to use one of my longer ‘fracs I’ll get out my HEQ5 Pro goto mount. 
 

If I were to break that down in percentage for usage  I guess it would be close to 60% for option 1, and then an even split of 20% each for options 2 & 3. 

[Froeng]

I used to use the manual setting circles on my Super Polaris DX for about 25 years, with starhopping "the last mile" with an Atlas. Often struggled under my sky conditions (has anyone heard about lightpollution?) Switched to GOTO with SkySafari about six years ago and I would NEVER go back. What a revelation!

[johnturley]

I don't usually use GOTO for the simple reason that my main scopes (14in Newtonian with Esprit150 piggybacked) are mounted on fork equatorial mount made by Astro Systems (Luton) in the 1980's, which doesn't have GOTO, and it would either not be possible, or prohibitively expensive to install it. 

It does however have a meridian pointer and large setting circles, which in conjunction with a sidereal clock (actually use an app on my phone now), I use to locate objects not visible to the naked eye, or Mercury and Venus in daylight. 

John 

Edited February 25, 2023 by johnturley

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

I often but not exclusively use GoTo. Why not if the technology is available? Hands free tracking is a huge bonus when you're writing notes or having a tea break...

Shorter observing sessions of less than an hour then I'll use a manual az mount with slomos.

Star hopping doesn't require mystical trickery, just some practice matching dots on a map with what you see in the sky. Admittedly when starting out I struggled for several weeks then the penny dropped.

Living on the outskirts of a city, the extra few minutes setting up a GoTo system overall speeds up target acquisition and is invaluable during those few and far between longer sessions. I spend less time finding & keeping targets in view and more time observing.

[Louis D]

1 hour ago, AstroKeith said:

How many professional astronomers now push their telescopes. None unless they are using a heritage instrument.

Most professional astronomers request time on large scopes by submitting imaging proposals that are graded and either approved or rejected or perhaps tabled.  The imaging request is then added to the telescope's imaging schedule if approved.  Sometime in the future, the data is gathered and sent in raw format to the astronomer who then processes it (or possibly sends it to a processing expert).  Regardless, the professional astronomer never actually travels to the telescope.  Almost no professional astronomers own their own equipment these days.

[DaveS]

100% GOTO plus plate solving. Imaging time is too precious in this dank swamp of a country to waste any of it faffing around trying to find your target.

The "thrill of the chase" come later when the data is on the computer and you're trying to tease out faint tidal tails from the background.

[Alkaid]

In two minds....

I once had GOTO but it got poorly, lost all accuracy and I kind of lost faith (plus I didn’t want to shell out for a new mount).

Now use simple tracking, perfect for the brighter targets, I am mainly lunar & planetary.   Bombproof, nothing to go wrong....

However on a recent DSO evening in relatively light polluted skies, I couldn’t find anything.  I remember muttering ‘wish I had GOTO’!

Edited February 25, 2023 by Alkaid

[John]

Thanks to the 49 people who felt they could cast a vote and I can also quite understand why others felt that they could not. The process has reminded me that a poll is a rather blunt tool on a forum.

 

 

[Mr H in Yorkshire]

I tend mostly to use large binos (100mm objectives) - my binochair is equipped  with encoders (from Astro-Gadgets in Ukraine) which work with PC and Android tablets. Given the chair is motorised I'm 'drive-to'. I also have Ioptron cube pro and Minitower for use with 6" MaK and PST. I do like the speed that these systems enable target finding but I am NOT an imager.

[Mr Spock]

17 minutes ago, John said:

The process has reminded me that a poll is a rather blunt tool on a forum.

Polls can be effective, but, there are so many ways to enjoy this hobby a poll can't accommodate everyone. Some good responses though.

[Dave-P]

Purely manual at the moment, still quite newly into the hobby (visual only). Learning the relationship between the constellations and the objects is at least half the fun at the moment.Think I'm learning a lot more through star-hopping and paper atlases than I would via goto. I will use Starmap on my phone very occasionally if I get totally confused. Using 7x50 binoculars to get the hang of new "routes" before using the scope. I find that I'm starting to pick out some fainter objects with the naked eye now (beehive cluster, double cluster, etc) just because I've learned where they sit in relation to brighter stars. Think I've still got a few years to go building up a decent working knowledge of the northern skies.

Although I can see the obvious benefits of goto for people tracking down faint galaxies with massive focal length scopes, or astrophotographers who are impatient to gather as many hours of data as they can.

[scarp15]

Have not thought about this for years, since completely conditioned to manually operating. Reasoning being for simplicity of approach and to keep in check complacency, in plotting where things are.  

[Moonlit Knight]

Interesting, more people use goto that bother to learn the night sky.

A couple of years ago I was doing an outreach, loads of astronomers there too, some of whom brought their scopes with them. While I was locating a target a couple of the group made a comment something like "Oh, he's one of those blokes who knows where everything is " like taking the time to learn the night was a bad thing, showing off even. When I think about it now lots of people have been surprised when I was able to locate something quickly. I had always assumed that the most be visitors or not into the hobby very long. It seems I was wrong, it looks like most people don't bother to learn the first place. That's come as something of a revelation.

I am not knocking goto btw, live and let live.

Clear skies...

 

 

 

 

 

[Ricochet]

19 minutes ago, Moonlit Knight said:

it looks like most people don't bother to learn the first place

I'm not sure that you can take that from the results of this poll. The options are never use goto and often use goto. How often is often? Perhaps always, sometimes and never would have been better poll options. Often includes anyone who owns both goto and manual mounts and presumably does know the sky at least at some rudimentary level. Of course if you do have goto on all your mounts you won't learn the sky to the same degree because it is simply not necessary. Once the mount has put the scope on target you might have a cursory look through the RDF to see where an object is in the sky but it's not going to stick as well as if you're manually having to find the object each time. 

[adyj1]

35 minutes ago, Moonlit Knight said:

Interesting, more people use goto that bother to learn the night sky.

Be wary of confirmation bias... 

[bosun21]

For myself it’s a mix of both. When using my 8SE it’s go to as I have found that the narrow FOV and large focal length makes star hopping difficult. On the other hand I do enjoy the hunt when using my dobsonian and star hopping my way to the target. Each to their own and I think that both are dependent on what equipment you are using and individual preferences. Horses for courses as they say.

[Moonlit Knight]

2 hours ago, adyj1 said:

Be wary of confirmation bias... 

Confirmation bias occurs when one is actively looking to find a particular outcome. The evidence demonstrate a clear preference for the use of goto over traditional methods of finding astronomical targets. What the research doesn't show, without a thematic analysis of why this appears to be the case. As John said it's a blunt tool.this poll.

There is a paper in this for someone, but not from me, I am up to my neck in it as it is, and I have a deadline too.

It's a symptom of a culture that wants evening now, instant gratification at the experience of experience and rote learning. The different between Stargazing and Astronomy...

Hey Ho

Edited February 26, 2023 by Moonlit Knight

[cloudsweeper]

GoTo:

1. is easy to set up.

2. puts you on target quickly.

3. provides tracking - very helpful, esp. at high mag.

4. does not detract from familiarisation of the sky if you also get the target on Stellarium for example.

.........which is why I use it a lot. 

But I also use a widefield grab 'n' go frac as well as the large frac and Dob.  It all depends on target and mood!

Doug.

 

[jetstream]

4 hours ago, Moonlit Knight said:

It seems I was wrong, it looks like most people don't bother to learn the first place. That's come as something of a revelation.

I can rip off 50 or so DSO manually using my 15" faster than most people could get their goto functioning.

The GOTO, well push too in my case, can help one learn the sky- I know more objects to find now, not using it from using it.

In reality, espc with my 24", trying to find tiny PN,that the 24" then "enlarges" is a main use for the Sky Commander. It also helps me identify the myriad of galaxies this scope shows...

When manual sky cruising, grabbing all those DSO, I dont star hop...  I just point and shoot... using the constellations as my map. GOTO maximizes objects seen for people, many with limited chance to see things because of sky conditions. I think its a good option.

[Louis D]

9 hours ago, Moonlit Knight said:

A couple of years ago I was doing an outreach, loads of astronomers there too, some of whom brought their scopes with them. While I was locating a target a couple of the group made a comment something like "Oh, he's one of those blokes who knows where everything is " like taking the time to learn the night was a bad thing, showing off even.

I've done that too, simply sighting along people's scopes that they brought, shooting from the hip, so to speak, to put them on target.  If you don't know the sky and the scope doesn't have goto, DSCs, setting circles, or even a decent sighting device, what other choice does one have?

[Franklin]

I learnt the constellations (Northern skies) when I was 10, got my first scope (60mm Dixons special) at 11 and have star-hopped ever since (now an old git). I have recently acquired a goto mount, it's an SXD2 with SB10 and it's amazing. Rough eyeball on Polaris, a two star alignment and it just finds stuff, absolutely brilliant. Will I use it? I doubt it, if I ever try my hand at imaging then yes but for the visual only stuff I enjoy star-hopping too much. By star-hopping you get to see so much more and sometimes the things you come across accidentally are more interesting than your original target.

[mikeDnight]

Am I missing something with the vote questions John? Q) I often/always use go-to or push to.

Q) I do not use go-to / push to. 

I'm not sure if that answers how many do and how many don't use one or the other. If the latter question is ticked, doesn't it imply the scope doesn't move at all? Surely one or the other must be used, even when dialling in coordinates using setting circles? 

 

Edited February 26, 2023 by mikeDnight