Deep sky observing tips please

[nightfisher]

Cor, i feel like a newbie asking this but here goes:

I dont do a lot of DSO.........i am not very good at finding things, but i want to get more out of the 120ED/giro combo rather than just pointing it at the moon!, so if you please lets have tips and pointers for deep sky viewing, anything you feel might be relevant like what eyepiece size, how to find and so on

this will not only help me, but should stand newcomers in good stead 

[Timebandit]

 

Hello nightfisher and welcome to SGL (sorry I could not resist that?)

 

With limited aperture then most DSO can be difficult to locate with limited aperture. But the brighter ones can be located with the 120ed. A good star map certainly helps. But most importantly with the DSO are atmosphere and especially"Dark site" conditions . Therefore if you are in a light polluted area then do travel to somewhere  darker to get the best possible conditions for DSO

With regards to eyepieces then a nice wide angle eyepiece in around the 82d range will help you locate those faint fuzzys. I use a nagler 20mm which seems to help.

If you really cannot get on with finding things by star hoping, then the answer needs to be a good goto mount, and this will take you to the correct location. But dark sky's are the number one requirement for DSO IMO

I hope the above helps☺

[Size9Hex]

I hope you get some great use from the new scope - looks an absolute beauty. Here's what I've learned in a year or so of DSO hunting. Looking forwards to reading how you get on! 

Dark skies generally trump pretty much anything else.

Be patient at the eyepiece. Detail can slowly reveal itself over many minutes. Return to the same target to see more and more each time.

In terms of technique/kit, listen to the advice of others but also experiment to see what works for you.

Enjoy hunting and observing any DSOs you like, whether easy or tough, and don't be deterred that a target might be hard/impossible without a bigger scope, better eyepiece, better filter etc. You never know until you check!

 

[Timebandit]

 

A Great book and information source for the newbie into DSO , and especially those with limited aperture is the book " Turn left at Orion" .   This book is full of information on finding DSO and also gives you star hoping advice and diagrams to help the novice find DSO . It also shows you what you can expect to look for and find with DSO .   I purchased a copy of this book when first starting DSO and I can highly recommend it.

 

[Pondus]

Just a personal, highly subjective and of course amateurish suggestion for a session,
10 or so targets, none of them are dependent on new moon or big aperture. Hence no galaxies or nebulas.
~2 hrs session, use low power for finder eyepiece  20mm upwards.
Start in the west, work your way eastwards.

 

Starting point : δ Cas -Delta Cassiopeiae - Ruchbah.
If you look at Cassiopeia as W-shaped, its the second star in the W.

 

1. ET Cluster
Just 2 degrees south of Ruchbah you will find the open cluster NGC457, the ET cluster.

2 of the stars in this cluster are quite bright, (ET`s eyes.) Once you located Ruchbah it is an very easy find.

 

2. Messier 103
Going back to up Ruchbah and just a tad north you will see M103. A small cluster where the 3 brightest stars
make a triangle. You will see a binary, Struve 133, and a bright red giant in the field of view.

 

3. NGC 654,659, 663.
Just north of M103 you have a chance of getting 3 clusters in the same fov : ngc 654 659 663. Low power.

 

4. The double cluster
Going eastwards, maybe 8 degrees and slightly north you have the famous Double cluster in Perseus.
You will be looking at the best open clusters you can see from planet earth.
It is located between the starting point Ruchbah and Eta Persei.

This area of the sky is covered in stars, not all clusters are easy to pick out from the background stars,
But you will know when you have located the Double cluster!

 

5. Gamma Andromedae
The easternmost star in Andromedae Gamma Andromedae-  Almach/Almaak -  is a beautiful double star.
Use Low power to get Almach in the centre and then increase power.

 

6. Messier 45 Pleiades
Pleiades in low power, gorgeous, look for 'Allys braid' the chain of bright stars in pleiades. Beautiful!

 

7. Hyades
Large open cluster with Aldebaran located in front of it.

 

8.The open clusters in Auriga M36 M37 M38
M37 is the most dense of them, and probably the prettiest, its almost globularlike, with a red central star.
Personally I find 60x a good magnification for these fine objects.

 

9. Messier 35
Located at the western footend of Gemini.

 

10. Messier 44
The beehive in Cancer can finish off a nice session without any observation of nebulas and galaxies.

So mostly open clusters, good in any telescope, with a handful of Messiers within them.
You will find some of the great being objects, and maybe some of them not so remarkable. (It is not a Top 10 list.)
This is just a novice suggestion for a night out, I am pretty sure alot better suggestions will come around.

 

Rune

 

 

[JOC]

Hello Rune, I like that - I haven't had a session with any structure yet and I know where Cassiopeia is - I get about 2 hours when I go out and maybe I can borrow your suggestions to nightfisher and try it myself (assuming that we ever get a cloud free night again).

[nightfisher]

@Pondus Great little list, i will give it a try when i can, many thanks

[cotterless45]

Easiest way to find stuff is to get a red dot finder or Telrad. Then download some clear charts and star hop using bright stars. Hop using angles and shapes. Here's a few to kick off,

http://avila.star-shine.ch/astro/messiercharts/messierTelrad.htm

The Pocket Sky Atlas has most other observable targets , with Telrad circles inside the cover. In addition you can make your own circles in clear stuff to overlay the charts. Star hopping is actually easier with the few stars that we have in light pollution.

For a super  refractor ( proper scope )  , you really need the Cambridge Double Star Atlas. These binaries are mostly the brightest in the fov at x50. It's a great way to know the sky. The easiest way is to concentrate on one constellation at a time . Get to know it's stars, once you've hunted and found targets, they come much easier to find again, under 

clear skies !

Nick.

[swamp thing]

1st tip for deep sky......

Use the money you get from selling that 120ED to buy yourself a nice big Newt  

Seriously; Dark skies are the best tip I can give you. If you're going to do deep sky you may as well do it right.  
Have fun Jules 

[Moonshane]

Here's my guide to star hopping which will help. Look at a few brighter galaxies or globs first and get an idea what to expect in the eyepiece.

 

[Paul73]

I find that Sky Safari Pro on a tablet in invaluable. It can overlay your eyepiece FOV & Talrad circles on the fully zoomable maps.

[jetstream]

The SW120ED will give amazing DSO views from dark skies.

You can see everything from Barnards Loop ( a small section) to many faint galaxies. Leo's Triplet is a piece of cake and rewarding in this scope. I use the constellations as markers to find DSO, very fast using a Rigel Quickfinder- you can pull off huge numbers of objects quickly this way when in the "count them mode".

I use 30mm-42mm 2" widefields for finders and some large nebula and a 16mm-18mm widefield is very useful on the galaxies, and once found a bit more mag can be nice, object dependent.

For an early reward from dark skies view the Triplet first-easy to find and great to see then head over to UMA to find M109, M108 and M97- and rest of the Messiers in the area including the easy to see M51. These scopes will show an amazing number of objects with well matched eyepieces and in dark skies and don't be surprised if you don't see many more galaxies when looking for M109 in UMA...

Gerry

[nightfisher]

I think the big issue with me is relative distance, knowing how far to travel the scope from a marker star

@swamp thing there will be no newts big or small 

Taking the ED120 to a proper dark site will be a great move, hope to take it to Mukar next month

[Paul73]

11 minutes ago, nightfisher said:

I think the big issue with me is relative distance, knowing how far to travel the scope from a marker star

 

That is where the Telrad comes into its own.? I believe that the three red circles are 0.5°, 2° and 4°.

[jetstream]

9 minutes ago, nightfisher said:

think the big issue with me is relative distance, knowing how far to travel the scope from a marker star

This is an issue for me as well-I'm a poor star hopper. I just go by constellation shapes, "real" shapes ie Leo's triangle or the "W" of Cass etc and concentrate on these areas. The "open arms" of Virgo is an excellent area to hunt. The point and shoot method does work and espc for the brighter objects. M109 right near Phecda in UMA is a great place to start. I agree with Paul about the Telrad or Rigel, they greatly assist this type of finding.

There is no doubt that experienced star hoppers will find really faint objects easier and faster however, IMHO.

[Size9Hex]

57 minutes ago, nightfisher said:

I think the big issue with me is relative distance, knowing how far to travel the scope from a marker star

Paul mentions Sky Safari above and I'm a huge fan of it too. I enter my scope focal length, eyepiece length and eyepiece field of view, and it simulates the eyepiece view very well which is superb for star hopping. In terms of how far to travel, I find the answer for me is frequently to hop to a landmark that can be seen in the same field of view as my current landmark but no further. That way, I'm never lost in no-mans-land between two landmarks. The exception might be when hopping a couple of eyepiece diameters straight up/down/left/right (AZ mount) to something that's going to be absolutely unmistakable. Star hopping gets easier with practice so don't lose heart if it's tricky at first. 

[John]

1 hour ago, jetstream said:

This is an issue for me as well-I'm a poor star hopper. I just go by constellation shapes, "real" shapes ie Leo's triangle or the "W" of Cass etc and concentrate on these areas. The "open arms" of Virgo is an excellent area to hunt. The point and shoot method does work and espc for the brighter objects. M109 right near Phecda in UMA is a great place to start. I agree with Paul about the Telrad or Rigel, they greatly assist this type of finding.

There is no doubt that experienced star hoppers will find really faint objects easier and faster however, IMHO.

I follow the same approach Gerry. I tend to move from object to object within a constellation, usually with the aid of the S&T Pocket Sky Atlas. I had a very nice session once just picking up all the galaxies that the PSA shows in the "bowl" of Ursa Major, hopping from one to the next and so on.

 

[scarp15]

A good approach towards easing into star hopping, is to sit (or stand) and permit time to relate and take regard of the constellation patterns to that of a star chart. Whilst your eyes gradually adjust to become more fully dark adapted, so far as your observing location will permit, you will be able to pick out fainter finder stars, so a period of 'dead reckoning' prior to with a degree of confidence, you aim to point the Rigel (which might be best applicable to your scope tube diameter) to hit on a location. Once there you may have gained the target in an instance, or you just may require to gently nudge and drift a little with your widest field lowest power eyepiece.  From home with some light pollution, open and globular clusters can still be great, at a dark site well anything really.  Just a footnote, I particularly enjoy planetary observing at a dark site - no roof tops, no thermals just seems to create a crisper cleaner image, at least compared to my enclosed backyard.

[popeye85]

2 hours ago, Paul73 said:

That is where the Telrad comes into its own.? I believe that the three red circles are 0.5°, 2° and 4°.

Is this diameter or radius? Always worried that I am doing it wrong!

[cloudsweeper]

48 minutes ago, popeye85 said:

Is this diameter or radius? Always worried that I am doing it wrong!

Popeye - it's diameter.

Doug.

[cloudsweeper]

FWIW - I know there are lots of objects under the heading of DSOs, but faint galaxies and nebula are I reckon the trickiest to locate, and in most need of dark skies.  Open and globular clusters are more manageable, and very rewarding.  And some planetary nebulae like M27, M57 are fairly easy targets, much like the brighter galaxies.

Doug.

[popeye85]

I agree with @cloudsweeper. I started off with a goto so never really learned my way around the sky very well and when I got a manual I was lost. I tried finding galaxies with a star atlas but was hopeless! Aiming for clusters was much easier and a great way to build up your skill base at star hopping-and the views are stunning! (The double cluster of Perseus just can't be put into words)

[cloudsweeper]

1 hour ago, popeye85 said:

I agree with @cloudsweeper. I started off with a goto so never really learned my way around the sky very well and when I got a manual I was lost. I tried finding galaxies with a star atlas but was hopeless! Aiming for clusters was much easier and a great way to build up your skill base at star hopping-and the views are stunning! (The double cluster of Perseus just can't be put into words)

Double Cluster - yes!  Just been looking at it a few minutes ago, fabulous!

I like GoTo with the 8SE, and also hopping with the frac.  And I usually have Stellarium out there with me, since it confirms the GoTo, and helps enormously with hopping by using the  "circles" and star pattern recognition.

Doug.

 

[subhas barma]

On 09/03/2017 at 01:33, Pondus said:

Just a personal, highly subjective and of course amateurish suggestion for a session,
10 or so targets, none of them are dependent on new moon or big aperture. Hence no galaxies or nebulas.
~2 hrs session, use low power for finder eyepiece  20mm upwards.
Start in the west, work your way eastwards.

 

Starting point : δ Cas -Delta Cassiopeiae - Ruchbah.
If you look at Cassiopeia as W-shaped, its the second star in the W.

 

1. ET Cluster
Just 2 degrees south of Ruchbah you will find the open cluster NGC457, the ET cluster.

2 of the stars in this cluster are quite bright, (ET`s eyes.) Once you located Ruchbah it is an very easy find.

 

2. Messier 103
Going back to up Ruchbah and just a tad north you will see M103. A small cluster where the 3 brightest stars
make a triangle. You will see a binary, Struve 133, and a bright red giant in the field of view.

 

3. NGC 654,659, 663.
Just north of M103 you have a chance of getting 3 clusters in the same fov : ngc 654 659 663. Low power.

 

4. The double cluster
Going eastwards, maybe 8 degrees and slightly north you have the famous Double cluster in Perseus.
You will be looking at the best open clusters you can see from planet earth.
It is located between the starting point Ruchbah and Eta Persei.

This area of the sky is covered in stars, not all clusters are easy to pick out from the background stars,
But you will know when you have located the Double cluster!

 

5. Gamma Andromedae
The easternmost star in Andromedae Gamma Andromedae-  Almach/Almaak -  is a beautiful double star.
Use Low power to get Almach in the centre and then increase power.

 

6. Messier 45 Pleiades
Pleiades in low power, gorgeous, look for 'Allys braid' the chain of bright stars in pleiades. Beautiful!

 

7. Hyades
Large open cluster with Aldebaran located in front of it.

 

8.The open clusters in Auriga M36 M37 M38
M37 is the most dense of them, and probably the prettiest, its almost globularlike, with a red central star.
Personally I find 60x a good magnification for these fine objects.

 

9. Messier 35
Located at the western footend of Gemini.

 

10. Messier 44
The beehive in Cancer can finish off a nice session without any observation of nebulas and galaxies.

So mostly open clusters, good in any telescope, with a handful of Messiers within them.
You will find some of the great being objects, and maybe some of them not so remarkable. (It is not a Top 10 list.)
This is just a novice suggestion for a night out, I am pretty sure alot better suggestions will come around.

 

Rune

 

 

Great list. Thank you.