This will upset some

[boabsta]

But I freaking love goto :grin: :grin:

Finaly managed a couple of hours outside last night with the new setup and was blown away.

It wasn't even fully dark but still managed to be blown away by Andromeda as well as m13 and m57.

After doing a 2 star align the mount got everything in the centre of my ep everytime. Sooooo impressed.

Even managed to see milky way with naked eye when it got a bit darker and that was very impressive.

Heres to many more goto nights

Sorry star hoppers but until I learn more about what and where I'm looking goto shall rule.

Any suggestions for what I should be asking it to show are welcome

[Cornelius Varley]

The Synscan handset has a tour function which will send the mount to a series of objects that should be visible to you.

Peter

[Moonshane]

I have nothing against goto and it is a great tool when it works well. my issue is that for a fixed budget it robs you of aperture which is for me what's important for visual observing. I can find familiar objects quicker than any goto system but accept that faint stuff sometimes has me scratching my head and wondering if I am in the right place in the sky. on balance I'd always sooner have more aperture.

[boabsta]

I started using the tour but some things just weren't that obvious to me so quickly moved on. I'm sure if it were darker then I might have seen more easliy.

I can find familiar objects quicker than any goto system.

I have no dount that someone who is experienced with the sky will be able to straight to most common veiwing targets but for myself, I know nought of the sky and goto shall be my teacher. I have had a few scopes now and 1 previous celestron goto which I never got to work and all I have realy viewed is the moon and planets and orion neb as thats the only things I knew how or could find.

I have seen the future and hold it in the palm of my hand, Hail to the goto

[Beulah]

Good for you!

I have tried GoTo but don't like the sound of the motors - neither do my neighbours! Plus I can get to my targets a lot quicker through my own organic GoTo computer.. Part of the fun for me is the hunt - with the satisaction of finding the object a worthy reward.

When everything is aligned and it's working properly GoTo with tracking is fab - but as Moonshane has already said, I'd rather my hard earned went towards APERTURE!

It's a great time for astronomers as there is something for everyone.

[boabsta]

I understand the aperture point and if i had a garden then I would have the fever worse than when I got my 76mm newt.

The 200 is about as large as I can go for portability as I live in a flat and have to carry it up and down stairs so any larger and I realy would start to struggle.

My mount and accessories all live in the boot of the car and only the scope and leisure battery come back up the stairs with me.

In an ideal world I would have a monster dob still with goto but thats not be.

[Moonshane]

thank goodness there's room for all points of view in astronomy! enjoy your scope and what it gives you. this is far more important than worrying about what a scope does not give you!

[Andrew INT]

I love my Goto. I have a few streetlights near by which makes is hard to find objects such as M51. However, I can still slew the scope around and know that I'll be able to image it ok. For a few short seconds I turn on my green laser so that I can learn the locations too. Its good to star hop and I think Goto systems can help with this too if you so wish.

[sunshine185]

I had goto with a mak 127, cracking little scope but paid more for it than an 8" dob. Did the aligning procedure and started to search for objects, Jupiter,moon, and other bright objects it was great but then I searched for some dim fuzzies, searched for m81, m82 and saw nothing from my lp garden, was the same with a few other objects . I upgraded to a standard 8" dob and although some objects were hardly visible with the bigger aperture they were at least visible. Now upgraded to 10" , which, if bought new, would only cost £100 or so more than the goto mak, the only thing I miss is the tracking. There is also a dob mod that can be done to enable you to"pushto" an object if your star hopping skills are not very good ( like mine) goto is wonderful if you know its limits, as long as people don't believe the 42,000 odd objects in its database will all be visible, because most won't. If I was starting again from scratch I would agree with the old saying, get the biggest aperture you can afford.

[stevetynant]

You won't upset anyone with this. It does polarise opinions but there's no right or wrong answer, just what works for you. I've fitted push to with my dob so I suppose have a foot in both camps. Whatever works for you is good.

[Darkstar_1]

One question here, people say goto helps you to learn the night sky and star hop: How the hell can goto help someone learning to star hop? The only way is to do it and practice and learn.

[cantab]

It wasn't even fully dark but still managed to be blown away by Andromeda as well as m13 and m57.

This is probably why you love the GoTo - you've got a scope with the aperture to bring the objects alive. Spectacular objects are worth looking at, faint fuzzies are worth looking for. From my own point of view I don't have the funds for a scope with good aperture and GoTo, I have to pick one or the other, and I plan on picking the aperture (thinking of a Skyliner 200 when I've got the funds).

[Alastair Rae]

I had goto with a mak 127, cracking little scope but paid more for it than an 8" dob. Did the aligning procedure and started to search for objects, Jupiter,moon, and other bright objects it was great but then I searched for some dim fuzzies, searched for m81, m82 and saw nothing from my lp garden, was the same with a few other objects . I upgraded to a standard 8" dob and although some objects were hardly visible with the bigger aperture they were at least visible. Now upgraded to 10" , which, if bought new, would only cost £100 or so more than the goto mak, the only thing I miss is the tracking. There is also a dob mod that can be done to enable you to"pushto" an object if your star hopping skills are not very good ( like mine) goto is wonderful if you know its limits, as long as people don't believe the 42,000 odd objects in its database will all be visible, because most won't. If I was starting again from scratch I would agree with the old saying, get the biggest aperture you can afford.

That is depressing. I've seen goto advocated as the solution to the urban astronomer's inability to star hop. And I've seen recommendations of aperture to bring out features in LP skies. But now it looks like I need both! I'm not sure I've got room in the flat for an SE8 or equivalent ....

[Ant]

Without a doubt there are people on both sides of the camp.

For me, I lived in a very light polluted area. Everything was orange!

What really swayed me to go GOTO, was several nights on the trot failing to find my target. I couldn't see it in the finder, couldn't see it in the main scope. I couldn't get it onto the chip... But once I had GOTO and it was on the chip the LP filters / NB filters did their job and I started seeing images...!

GOTO meant that every night out with the scope enabled me to find my target - often other stuff went wrong - but that's a whole other thread

Cheers

Ant

[scarp15]

Personally in terms of visual astronomy, I enjoy building up a knowledge and empaphy with the changing night sky through studying sky charts and applying my own intuition in finding objects, which can be satisfying and a bit frustrating in almost equal measure, taking more time to search out some objects and making plenty of mistakes is (for myself) the point of it all, and I probably wouldn't bother otherwise, even though I might not find everything, it wont be as rewarding and I enjoy evaluating the session afterwards - less can mean more (except perhaps in aperture terms).

I think that you are either (paper) map and compass or sat nav / GPS minded, and I think that I am the former.

[ronin]

One question here, people say goto helps you to learn the night sky and star hop: How the hell can goto help someone learning to star hop? The only way is to do it and practice and learn.

Actually they say you will never learn the sky with a goto, which is really one of the most strange things I keep reading. Star hoping is a necessity with a dob, not with goto.

Decide what you want to look at.

Set up the goto,

Look up and try to identify what it is you expect to see and where it should be and tell the goto to go.

If the goto aims at what you expect than you have learnt.

As in I want to see M51 and I think it should be there.

If it doesn't you may have to decide if you or the goto have lost the plot.

If you thinlk about it a Dob owner isn't learning from scratch, they are using previous work by Messier, Cadwell etc to know where to look. Just a different reference.

Read a book to identify M31, ask a goto to identify M31.

Same data different source.

Another aspect is that a goto needs to be set up but after that you can manually move the scope. So you can star hop, you do not need to use the goto functionality.

[sunshine185]

I am still rubbish at starhopping, if I didn't have my dob set up with a wixey and setting circle I would have no chance whatsoever of finding anything, I know where polaris is and that's about it. The point I make is that there are other ways of finding your way around the sky than "goto" I have skEye on my phone, I looked at the messier list, clicked " ease of viewing" then matched my scope to the alt/AZ readings on skEye, I hit everything I aimed for although some things just couldn't be seen due to the lp. Goto is good but there are other options that don't cost as much but work perfectly fine.

[chrisshillito]

One question here, people say goto helps you to learn the night sky and star hop: How the hell can goto help someone learning to star hop? The only way is to do it and practice and learn.

A goto system linked to planetarium software is certainly a great aid to learning the night sky. The planetarium can present what you're actually looking at with greater clarity than your own seeing conditions might permit. Whenever I goto a target I am therefore made quite aware of its position and context. What is more I can manually slew around and casually 'browse' the sky whist always being shown exactly where I'm pointing.

If you wanted to practice your star hopping skills, using a goto connected planetarium, just to confirm you're on the right track, is and ideal method.

So, using a goto can both help you learn the sky, and, if you so wish, learn to star hop.

Chris.

[boabsta]

I feel I am learning the sky whilst using my goto. It point somewhere and that somwhere has a name or number. I can see where that is relative to where the scope was pointing previousley. I also feel I am more likely to survive in this hobby (and it is just that, a hobby where a few hours grabbed here and there are all I can manage) if I continue to have wow moments rather than frustrations of knowing its there but not finding or seeing it.

I have said "I" quite a lot there as this is my personal take on my hobby. I also titled this thread as I knew it would start a fair wee debate. I am also enjoying everyones input and theyre take on goto/no goto. This actualy helps me to enjoy this hobby more as it is so varied yet we are all basicly looking for and seeing the same thing.

How many different ways is there to look at the telly?

The sky for me is always different and my combination of mount and scope are (for the moment ) perfect for me. It has taken 5 different setups to arrive where I am now and I can finaly start my journey properly.

As for the expense of goto, I got lucky. I won at poker at a time a mount was being offered for a no too bad price. The scope I had wanted was the 200p but for the difference I thought it would be silly not to get the pds instead of wishing I got the pds.

I am sure 1 day that I too when in a better house/location will get a monster dob with a telrad and star hop like a celestial frog but until then I honestly couldnt be happier

[Marki]

I started with a go-to (Nexstar 8SE). When I could get it aligned it was great, and gave me a good start, especially in the heavily light polluted location I lived in before. However, I soon found the noise a bit irritating and then the random directions it would go in for no explicable reason to be annoying - realise this was probably power related now. Anyway, my point was it got me going for my first month or so and I sort of picked up where stuff was almost accidently. Because it helped keep the enthusiasm going, I wanted to learn to hunt stuff on my own and expand my knowldege. Now I almost never use the go-to, but feel the frustration when searching for something and the reward when I find it on my own too. I must admit though, I might never have got this far without the kickstart that go-to gave me in the first place. I must admit that I do like the tracking that a go-to can provide...I alway seem to lose stuff really quickly when clumsily waving my EQ5 mounted refractor about .

Each to their own .

[Pete Presland]

If you thinlk about it a Dob owner isn't learning from scratch, they are using previous work by Messier, Cadwell etc to know where to look. Just a different reference.

Read a book to identify M31, ask a goto to identify M31.

Same data different source.

not that i have a particular liking for one over the other (i own both goto and non-goto mounts) this post for me is spot on!

[cotterless45]

I held out ,until I got to the stage of having so much to look at whilst not getting much time. We use a goto with a laser pointer mounted on the ota. Anyone can then view where the laser ends in the fov.

Nick.

[Mr Q]

One question here, people say goto helps you to learn the night sky and star hop: How the hell can goto help someone learning to star hop? The only way is to do it and practice and learn.

I agree - the only way a goto can help you learn the night sky is AFTER you tried to locate an object by star hoping and can't detect the object. Then you can do a goto and verify (if the system is working properly) if present conditions allow the object to be seen. That's of course if the goto scope has the capability to detect said object.

Otherwise, starting with a goto is like using a calculator in a school math class. Sure you get the right answer but HOW ? There is nothing wrong with learning the night sky by traditional methods. In fact, when your goto fails, your night is over unless you have the skill to locate an object manually.

Personally, I would like to own a goto and get that instant gratification but I never will since I know how to find any object within my 10"'s grasp by star hoping - and that's thousands of objects.

One last point. Just browse through any astronomy forums site and look at all the goto questions about setting up, operation, etc. Where are all the star hoping questions? I bet the answer is that the skill is so easy to master, it never fails once learned...unlike a goto that often does.

[Dunkster]

Enjoy your scope - that's what it's all about

Who's to say there isn't a level of skill involved in getting the perfect alignment??? It's just different. Some folk are in it for the journey, some for the destination... some a bit of both

Personally, a GOTO fits my circumstances nicely. Lots of LP here on a half-decent night, and I'd rather spend time struggling to see an object through the LP than struggling to find it at all. Viewing time is precious, especially in the UK's climate

I don't subscribe to the school of thought that you don't learn anything. You can't help but notice where your scope is pointing, and get a general feel for what+where. Then there's the planning. On cloudy nights, I find I enjoy spending time researching a patch of sky and collating a list of things I'd like to see, and when is a good time to see them from my vantage point. I call it efficient use of non-viewing time And when the weather is iffy, I use my bins. No goto on them

[Matt Scunthorpe]

Like others have said, it depends on how you use it in my opinion. I havent got goto as the cost was just too much for me. If its just being used to locate objects without you really taking notice, id find that a bit boring, you wouldn't really need to touch the telescope between setting it up and putting it away, as all you need is the handset to turn to object after object.

I'm not too great at star hopping, but i am still finding DSO so it cant be that tough if i can do it