Time to get a 4” APO?

[Littleguy80]

The astronomy bug is biting again which of course means I’m thinking about buying new astro gear! My current setup is:

SkyWatcher 10” Dob - My most used and most loved scope. Despite it’s size, it’s nearly always this scope that I bring outside at night. 

SkyWatcher Equinox 80 - Purchased as a travel scope. Nice for wide field. This gets the most use for white light Solar.

DayStar Solar Scout 60mm - My first Ha scope. Have been very happy with it though I have no basis for comparison with other Ha scopes. 

I’ve been greatly entertained by reading a  number of threads on reflectors vs refractors. There’s no denying that @mikeDnight makes a very strong case for a 4” APO. As does @Stu for the white light solar views. All this has led me to formulating the following plan. 

New scope - Starfield 102mm F7. I believe this is the same as the Technosky scope which @Victor Boesen reviewed really nicely. It may not be a Tak but I think it’s close enough for the money. 

Mount - I originally planned to get an AZ4 but after some research I a found my Altair Starwave Mini AZ is rated up to 6kg with the counter weight so I think this will be fine for the Starfield. 

Quark Chromosphere - Out with the Solar Scout and in with the Quark. It should be work with both refractors. I believe I’ll need a UV/IR filter for it though. To get full disc views, I’ll probably need a focal reducer. 

I’m expecting the new scope to give me improved planetary views on most occasions. My initial impressions of my 80mm frac was that is show less detail than the dob. Recent comparisons, based on short sessions show the frac giving better views when the seeing is average and nicer colour rendition  

For solar viewing, I want to see more detailed granulation in white light. As for Ha, again, hoping to improve surface detail and be able to throw more magnification at it. The Quark option seems to give the most flexibility.

At this point, I’m just looking for thoughts on whether this makes sense. The dob will always be the DSO king but I’m sure the Starfield will be well used for shorter sessions or widefield on things like the Veil. 

[domstar]

Nice to see you've got the bug again. Not expert enough to advise you but I think you should go for it anyway.

[Sunshine]

Go for it! get that 4" APO that is just calling your name! the Starfield is a great scope from what I hear, and coupled with a quark you'll have a fantastic time. Everyone needs a 4" frac! and it doesn't have to be a Tak, it just has to be yours, you'll love it! It's a wonderful scope as many here who have one would agree.

Edited February 2, 2023 by Sunshine

[Ricochet]

59 minutes ago, Littleguy80 said:

Mount - I originally planned to get an AZ4 but after some research I a found my Altair Starwave Mini AZ is rated up to 6kg with the counter weight so I think this will be fine for the Starfield.

Do you use the equinox 80 on the starwave mini? I wasn't happy how mine held my 72 ED. I've not used an AZ4 but having looked at one in a shop, I think it is clearly a much more capable mount.

[RobertI]

1 hour ago, Littleguy80 said:

The astronomy bug is biting again which of course means I’m thinking about buying new astro gear! My current setup is:

SkyWatcher 10” Dob - My most used and most loved scope. Despite it’s size, it’s nearly always this scope that I bring outside at night. 

SkyWatcher Equinox 80 - Purchased as a travel scope. Nice for wide field. This gets the most use for white light Solar.

DayStar Solar Scout 60mm - My first Ha scope. Have been very happy with it though I have no basis for comparison with other Ha scopes. 

I’ve been greatly entertained by reading a  number of threads on reflectors vs refractors. There’s no denying that @mikeDnight makes a very strong case for a 4” APO. As does @Stu for the white light solar views. All this has led me to formulating the following plan. 

New scope - Starfield 102mm F7. I believe this is the same as the Technosky scope which @Victor Boesen reviewed really nicely. It may not be a Tak but I think it’s close enough for the money. 

Mount - I originally planned to get an AZ4 but after some research I a found my Altair Starwave Mini AZ is rated up to 6kg with the counter weight so I think this will be fine for the Starfield. 

Quark Chromosphere - Out with the Solar Scout and in with the Quark. It should be work with both refractors. I believe I’ll need a UV/IR filter for it though. To get full disc views, I’ll probably need a focal reducer. 

I’m expecting the new scope to give me improved planetary views on most occasions. My initial impressions of my 80mm frac was that is show less detail than the dob. Recent comparisons, based on short sessions show the frac giving better views when the seeing is average and nicer colour rendition  

For solar viewing, I want to see more detailed granulation in white light. As for Ha, again, hoping to improve surface detail and be able to throw more magnification at it. The Quark option seems to give the most flexibility.

At this point, I’m just looking for thoughts on whether this makes sense. The dob will always be the DSO king but I’m sure the Starfield will be well used for shorter sessions or widefield on things like the Veil. 

The Altair Astro 102ED-R is another version of the same scope. I’ve been extremely happy with mine after two years. My initial assessment was that I was amazed by its solar system capabilities (especially with binoviewers) but slightly underwhelmed by the DSOs it showed, I guess 4” is 4”. But it is so versatile, going from razor sharp views of planets and the moon at 200x to super wide views of 4 degrees and more. So alongside your 10” it should be the perfect companion. 

I have mine on an AZ4 which I bought specially for it as my Skytee on a 2” tripod is heavy and overkill for a 4” scope on its own, and my Mini-giro on a heavy duty photo tripod is more ‘delicate’ to balance and doesn’t do the scope justice.  

[Littleguy80]

32 minutes ago, Ricochet said:

Do you use the equinox 80 on the starwave mini? I wasn't happy how mine held my 72 ED. I've not used an AZ4 but having looked at one in a shop, I think it is clearly a much more capable mount.

It’s the only mount of it’s type that I’ve used but I’ve gotten on well with it. Even without the counterweight I’ve found it quite usable. I do loosen and tighten the az motion as I move between targets to keep it stable. 

Interesting comment on the AZ4. I noticed it’s only rated to 5kg which is what led me to look up the specs on starwave mini

[RobertI]

1 minute ago, Littleguy80 said:

Interesting comment on the AZ4. I noticed it’s only rated to 5kg which is what led me to look up the specs on starwave mini

I would say, with the 1.75” steel tripod, 5kg is very conservative. It holds my bulky C8 without problems, though not really designed for such wide scopes. It appears to be designed for 4” F7 refractors! 😆

[mikeDnight]

Hi Neil,

 I'm glad you're keeping your 10". It will go places the 102 can't, however, I'm completely confident the Starfield 102 will compliment the 10" very nicely. The Starfield should give you razor sharp views of the Moon and planets, as well as double stars, and also some nice wider field views of the brighter DSO's. Who knows, you may even fall in love with it. 💘

Edited February 3, 2023 by mikeDnight

[Littleguy80]

4 minutes ago, RobertI said:

The Altair Astro 102ED-R is another version of the same scope. I’ve been extremely happy with mine after two years. My initial assessment was that I was amazed by its solar system capabilities (especially with binoviewers) but slightly underwhelmed by the DSOs it showed, I guess 4” is 4”. But it is so versatile, going from razor sharp views of planets and the moon at 200x to super wide views of 4 degrees and more. So alongside your 10” it should be the perfect companion. 

I have mine on an AZ4 which I bought specially for it as my Skytee on a 2” tripod is heavy and overkill for a 4” scope on its own, and my Mini-giro on a heavy duty photo tripod is more ‘delicate’ to balance and doesn’t do the scope justice.  

Nice. I do really enjoy planetary. The dob is great for it but does need the cooling time, collimation to be spot on and decent seeing. I think a 4” APO will probably deliver good results more often.  I was kind of expecting that DSO’s would be disappointing compared to the dob but then that’s not really its specialty. 

I guess I’ll have to see how it goes with the mount. The AZ4 isn’t mega money if I do need something more. 

[Littleguy80]

3 minutes ago, mikeDnight said:

Hi Neil,

 I'm glad you're keeping your 10". It will go places the 102 can't, however, I'm completely confident the Starfield 102 will compliment the 10" very nicely. The Starfiels should give you razer sharp views of the Moon and planets, as well as double stars, and also some nice wider field views of the brighter DSO's. Who knows, you may even fall in love with it. 💘

Thanks Mike. I think the Starfield and Dob could become good friends. I used to wonder why people had so many scopes and eyepieces. I’m now seeing it more as having the right tool for the job.
Thanks for all your posts on this subject in various threads. They’ve been a big help in getting me to this point and raised more than one chuckle along the way 😊

[Littleguy80]

19 minutes ago, RobertI said:

I would say, with the 1.75” steel tripod, 5kg is very conservative. It holds my bulky C8 without problems, though not really designed for such wide scopes. It appears to be designed for 4” F7 refractors! 😆

Haha sounds like it would be ideal. I’m definitely not against a new mount but figure it’s worth trying out what I’ve got first. Plus I can spread my purchases out to stop the family accountant asking any awkward questions 😂

Edited February 2, 2023 by Littleguy80

[Mr Spock]

No need to ask what I think 

Everyone should have one  Perfect on an EQ5 too.

[Littleguy80]

9 minutes ago, Mr Spock said:

No need to ask what I think 

Everyone should have one  Perfect on an EQ5 too.

I should have mentioned you too! I read more than one post about your lovely Starfield 😁

[Grump Martian]

I have the Starfield 102 mm f7 from FLO. A fabulous refractor. I also have a matching Seymour white light solar filter. The views of Sol are great. Get one.

[Mr Spock]

A few accessories, some a bit of a luxury, but all make the scope beyond perfect.

Baader clicklock to replace the fitted twist grip. And a lovely Baader diagonal to match.

A Herschel wedge for solar.

[Sunshine]

I knew there were others here happy with their sweet Starfields, I handled the 115 star field at a star party and was doubly impressed with it. 👍

Edited February 3, 2023 by Sunshine

[Glenbo]

Nice piece of art! i just bought a TS Optics Photo line 102 APO, same scope as the Starfield.

Edited February 3, 2023 by Glenbo

[LDW1]

If I didn't own a Televue NP101 and was younger I would buy a Starfield, hands down. They are a pretty nice scope for the price.

[Littleguy80]

7 hours ago, Mr Spock said:

A few accessories, some a bit of a luxury, but all make the scope beyond perfect.

Baader clicklock to replace the fitted twist grip. And a lovely Baader diagonal to match.

A Herschel wedge for solar.

I recently picked up a Clicklock diagonal which seems fab based on a couple of usages. I do like the idea of replacing the twist lock with Clicklock too. I think that also falls into the category of see how I go. 

One thing I’ve found is that, for me at least, I to build a setup over time if possible. Each upgrade adding little improvements. 

[ollypenrice]

12 hours ago, Littleguy80 said:

 

Quark Chromosphere - Out with the Solar Scout and in with the Quark. It should work with both refractors. I believe I’ll need a UV/IR filter for it though. To get full disc views, I’ll probably need a focal reducer. 

It should work but, being a Quark, it might not!   

The 4 inch refractor, though, is a very fine thing.

Olly

[mikeDnight]

7 hours ago, Glenbo said:

Nice piece of art! i just bought a TS Optics Photo line 102 APO, same scope as the Starfield.

Don't look!  I think your refractor is being assimilated by the Borg. 

Love the mount!

[Skyline]

11 hours ago, Grump Martian said:

I have the Starfield 102 mm f7 from FLO. A fabulous refractor. I also have a matching Seymour white light solar filter. The views of Sol are great. Get one.

You caved in.

[Grump Martian]

Total collapse. Could not resist

[Stu]

A four inch apo is something every astronomer should have. I’m sure you won’t be disappointed with the views; it will complement your 10” very nicely whilst being a step up from the 80mm too. There is a noticeable increase in resolution which you will enjoy for white light solar, planetary and doubles I’m sure.

They are so capable, and as others have said can range from 4 degree fields for the Veil and NAN up to lovely high power planetary and lunar views.

In my experience the Lunt Wedge is excellent value for money but the Baader CoolWedge has the edge for detail and contrast at higher powers.

Not sure if you’ve bought the scope yet, but do go ahead! 👍👍

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

On 02/02/2023 at 23:04, Littleguy80 said:

Nice. I do really enjoy planetary. The dob is great for it but does need the cooling time, collimation to be spot on and decent seeing. I think a 4” APO will probably deliver good results more often.  I was kind of expecting that DSO’s would be disappointing compared to the dob but then that’s not really its specialty. 

I guess I’ll have to see how it goes with the mount. The AZ4 isn’t mega money if I do need something more. 

At a dark site I've enjoyed impressive views of DSOs with my 4". Although I'm easily pleased... 😀

At my urban home I'm mostly limited to solar system, double stars and the brighter Messiers.To be fair my 8" dob at home didn't do much better.

Two years on I don't regret the purchase.