Time to get a 4” APO?

[KP82]

If I were to get a Tak, the primary objective wouldn't be for its superior optical quality (the difference is only marginal compared to the other 4" f/7 fpl53 like others have said) but its portability. If you were thinking of mounting a 4" apo on the AZ mini, the FC100DC would probably be the only valid option that's currently available.

One of the reasons you get so many suggestions on Tak in any refractor discussions is that it IS the only premium APO brand which you can easily buy off the shelf (relatively speaking). The others such as AP, TEC, LZOS and CFF are basically either locked behind a long waiting list/time or obtainable by luck through used markets.

Edited February 7, 2023 by KP82

[Sunshine]

23 hours ago, Littleguy80 said:

If you base it on the numbers it's a close call:

Secondhand Tak FC100DC £1400 (Based on ABS ad). Can work as Travel scope allowing sale of Equinox for say £300(?). Lighter than Starfield for perhapa plays more happily with the mini AZ so need to spend £200 on a new mount. Total cost £1100.

(Tak will give some improvement over the Starfield and a lot of improve over the Equinox for travel. Higher upfront cost for a secondhand scope)

New Starfield 102 £900. Too big for airline travel so need to keep Equinox 80. Heavier so maybe does need a new mount for £200. Total cost £1100.

(Brand new  scope with warranty for less. Performance still very good. Not suitable for airline travel so the 80mm scope remains as travel scope)

Maybe it's an oversimplification but I started this thread to test my thinking on the Starfield and see what other options  there were  

 

How often do you intend on taking your 4" on airplanes? that would be a consideration as well, If it was often enough to justify spending more then it makes sense. If it was a once a year thing then maybe I would opt for the less expensive option and just travel with my 80.

[FLO]

On 06/02/2023 at 13:35, Littleguy80 said:

@FLO Do you guys know if the Focuser and Dew Shield can be removed from the Starfield 102, similar to the Tak FC100DC? This is to shorten it for airport travel rather any sort of telescope vandalism. 

They can be removed, but only because what is assembled can be disassembled. Removal of the focuser and dew shield for travelling isn't a feature. 

HTH, 

Steve 

[Littleguy80]

10 hours ago, jetstream said:

Given equal optics a 4" scope will show more detail (planets, moon) than an 80mm scope, seeing considered. Many consider the 4" APO the " goldilocks" scope and with good reason as it can provide excellent views through many conditions that might limit larger scopes IMHO.

With regard to WL solar, aperture rules IMHO but seeing and thermals will hurt relatively minor aperture increases ie 100mm vs 120mm. Under top conditions the 120mm is king- however- there is more time the extra aperture hurts than helps (my thoughts).

Day in and day out a 100mm frac is the best option for WL solar, giving incredible views.

The Quark likes a short FL scope but around f7... this really needs a separate thread to discuss and there are many advanced Ha imagers and viewers here that could offer excellent advice on observing in Ha.

Many good refractors out there and the consistency of many are solid. It appears Tak owners demand performance with little to no sample to sample variation- what I see through mine, you will see through yours, conditions considered. To me a Tak is just a scope, its not magic but it does deliver excellent views of everything, from Barnards Loop to the planets.

Some AP and Tec owners might considered a Tak a bit lower on the food chain... but who cares. Good views are good views, regardless of the name on the telescope.

Gerry

 

Great to hear from you, Gerry!!! Glad the snowmonile and hot tub are keeping you happy  

Thank you, that definitely helps! WL and planets are definitely  the priority for this scope so I think I'm on the right track. Good shout on raising a new thread on the Quark. That's one for further down the road I think. 

Hope you've managed some observing  

[Littleguy80]

1 hour ago, Sunshine said:

How often do you intend on taking your 4" on airplanes? that would be a consideration as well, If it was often enough to justify spending more then it makes sense. If it was a once a year thing then maybe I would opt for the less expensive option and just travel with my 80.

Fair comment. It's probably only an annual thing at best. Someone keeps spending my money on astro gear so I can't afford holidays abroad 😂

[Littleguy80]

35 minutes ago, FLO said:

They can be removed, but only because what is assembled can be disassembled. Removal of the focuser and dew shield for travelling isn't a feature. 

HTH, 

Steve 

Thanks Steve. Makes, perfect sense  

[Sunshine]

2 minutes ago, Littleguy80 said:

Fair comment. It's probably only an annual thing at best. Someone keeps spending my money on astro gear so I can't afford holidays abroad 😂

Don’t fret, a scope lets you travel through space and time! it’s a win win.

[jetstream]

7 hours ago, Littleguy80 said:

Hope you've managed some observing  

Actually I have, intermittently, in between snowstorms and frigid weather. I just concentrated on some bright favourites like Pickerings Wisp and the Veil etc. I'm excited to say that the 15" now shows that bulge feature in the Wisp much better now, with some fine detail. No doubt this comes from observing it with the 24" so often- quite an interesting effect.

Eagerly waiting your reports!

And your scope choice!

 

 

 

[badhex]

Hello @jetstream and welcome back!

@Littleguy80 as Gerry says above, will be interested to hear what you go for in the end. FWIW I never take my TS102 (Starfield equiv.) on a plane, it's too large for hand luggage even with the dewshield retracted. When I travel with a scope I take my WO ZS73 which is a great little RFT and I can fit everything in a backpack, but obviously this is not comparable to the TS102.

 

[Deadlake]

19 hours ago, jetstream said:

Actually I have, intermittently, in between snowstorms and frigid weather. I just concentrated on some bright favourites like Pickerings Wisp and the Veil etc. I'm excited to say that the 15" now shows that bulge feature in the Wisp much better now, with some fine detail. No doubt this comes from observing it with the 24" so often- quite an interesting effect.

Eagerly waiting your reports!

And your scope choice!

 

 

 

Good to hear from you again Gerry. M

[Deadlake]

10 hours ago, badhex said:

Hello @jetstream and welcome back!

@Littleguy80 as Gerry says above, will be interested to hear what you go for in the end. FWIW I never take my TS102 (Starfield equiv.) on a plane, it's too large for hand luggage even with the dewshield retracted. When I travel with a scope I take my WO ZS73 which is a great little RFT and I can fit everything in a backpack, but obviously this is not comparable to the TS102.

 

Yes, needs something more compact like this:

[Cjg]

On 02/02/2023 at 21:15, Littleguy80 said:

Mount - I originally planned to get an AZ4 but after some research I a found my Altair Starwave Mini AZ is rated up to 6kg with the counter weight so I think this will be fine for the Starfield. 

 

Neil, 

4 inches of 'frac is just delightful, not unwieldy like a 5 inch, much more portable, and the are views terrific. 

You've had a look through my 'nearly 4 inches" of A-P?

Chris

 

[mikeDnight]

 Sometimes it's good to see a size comparison to help us realize what we are getting ourselves into. Here are two great refractors, a 5" F8.1 and a 4" F7.4. To give you an idea of scale, I'm 6ft tall.

My FS128. Definitely a two handed job to carry just the tube assembly. 

 

Here with my FC100DC. The whole set-up, scope, mount & tripod can be carried with one arm.

[badhex]

4 hours ago, Deadlake said:

Yes, needs something more compact like this:

Lovely! Needs the industry standard banana/ bean can for scale 🙂

[badhex]

2 hours ago, mikeDnight said:

 Sometimes it's good to see a size comparison to help us realize what we are getting ourselves into. Here are two great refractors, a 5" F8.1 and a 4" F7.4. To give you an idea of scale, I'm 6ft tall.

My FS128. Definitely a two handed job to carry just the tube assembly. 

 

Here with my FC100DC. The whole set-up, scope, mount & tripod can be carried with one arm.

Great pictures and great scopes @mikeDnight! I can see why you are smiling so much 🙂

[JeremyS]

3 hours ago, badhex said:

Great pictures and great scopes @mikeDnight! I can see why you are smiling so much 🙂

Not sure he was after he let that beautiful FS 128 go 🤔

[badhex]

12 hours ago, JeremyS said:

Not sure he was after he let that beautiful FS 128 go 🤔

😂😱

[Littleguy80]

22 hours ago, Cjg said:

Neil, 

4 inches of 'frac is just delightful, not unwieldy like a 5 inch, much more portable, and the are views terrific. 

You've had a look through my 'nearly 4 inches" of A-P?

Chris

 

I’m not sure I have. I’ve definitely looked through your baby Tak. I particularly remember the swan and eagle in the same FOV. Stunning!

Really must get out to Seething again soon. Been far too long. 

[Cjg]

59 minutes ago, Littleguy80 said:

I’m not sure I have. I’ve definitely looked through your baby Tak. I particularly remember the swan and eagle in the same FOV. Stunning!

Really must get out to Seething again soon. Been far too long. 

The baby Tak went to an accomplished observer that we both know. The Stowaway is something else. Had a few memorable nights last year https://www.facebook.com/groups/479353680354/posts/10166985478450355/

Chris

 

[Littleguy80]

21 minutes ago, Cjg said:

The baby Tak went to an accomplished observer that we both know. The Stowaway is something else. Had a few memorable nights last year https://www.facebook.com/groups/479353680354/posts/10166985478450355/

Chris

 

Sorry I missed out on that. Great report. Would love to have a look through the Stowaway!

[jetstream]

30 minutes ago, Cjg said:

The Stowaway is something else

Geeze, now you have me wanting one!😳

😀

[Cjg]

1 hour ago, Littleguy80 said:

Sorry I missed out on that. Great report. Would love to have a look through the Stowaway!

Am not at Seething so often now (long story, not for here) but let me know when you're next headed there, if not on a Friday then as a keyholder, and I'll try and swing by with it!

[Cjg]

1 hour ago, jetstream said:

Geeze, now you have me wanting one!😳

😀

For a long, long time, I swore that the Tak would have to be prised from my cold, dead hands...but that extra 16mm...as the highly experienced dude on FB said;

"The view was 3D like with huge detail in its letter box core, suspended in space above pinpoint diamond like stars." 

The Feathertouch focuser, although is a joy to use too.

If you're heading to Cwmdu for the AstroCamp, I'll have it with me there.

Chris

[Littleguy80]

52 minutes ago, Cjg said:

Am not at Seething so often now (long story, not for here) but let me know when you're next headed there, if not on a Friday then as a keyholder, and I'll try and swing by with it!

Sounds great. I’ll drop you a message next time I head there  

[jetstream]

1 hour ago, Cjg said:

If you're heading to Cwmdu for the AstroCamp, I'll have it with me there.

I'll start saving for it now- we're only about 6000km apart 😀

 

1 hour ago, Cjg said:

The view was 3D like with huge detail in its letter box core, suspended in space above pinpoint diamond like stars." 

It was this statement that caught my attention actually...this sounds like a wickedly good telescope