Flaming Star, HH

[jetstream]

One of my goals is to use the SW120ED on some difficult targets now that I've seen many through larger scopes. Conditions tonight included varying transparency, ranging from excellent to below average and coming in "waves".

The Flaming Star area provided a good test bed for the 120ED/UHC/Hb and in actual fact this object was easy and showed its typical shape but in much smaller form through the refractor.The 42mm LVW and 30mm ES 82 performed very well as usual leaving the variables down to my eyes and sky transparency. Encouraged by the views of this object I moved to Alnitak and the Flame nebula (no filter), which showed as a segmented structure with 2 mottled pillars with a bit of a cross member across the end of it- again typical. For this use a 25mm-6.7mm zoom was used with a helpful small TFOV keeping Alnitak at bay.

With the eyes warmed up and having a measure of hope the 120ED/42LVW/Hb slid a bit down to try to see the Horsehead in the 120mm which I hear is do able. I will say this- no HH tonight.

However- I did pick up IC434 as a for sure seen- the first step in the HH quest. I watched as it came and went out of view with the transparency all over the place. Both the UHC and Hb showed the neb as did the 30mm ES 82 with the UHC. An interesting thing has come to light- many objects appear different in smaller telescopes and IC 434 is one of them it seems. Tonight it did not display its funnel shape but looked like a large longish streak and very faint. My 15" will show a relatively bright edge along its course with a distinct notch out of it- the HH.

Tonight was a bit of a swing and miss on the HH but hunting down the nebula its in was a big step forward, I need better conditions to "lock" on to this object in this telescope.

[alan potts]

Nice report Gerry, The HH with a 120mm, If I can't do it with a 18 inch this year I think there will be a bonfire in the garden. I have not tried so far, the night before last would have been good but it was just too windy to get a scope out. I spent time outside last night but it was so cold and I am only a Brit with too much blood in the alchol stream.

Alan

[YKSE]

very nice try Gerry I'm kind of positvie that it's doable with 120ED under right conditions. A 40mm monocentric (with 30° AFOV), if there's one, might be more suitable for that scope for the target.

[scarp15]

Interesting report and description accounts Gerry and good that you got an opportunity to get out if you have snow forecast. I was hoping for an opportunity to explore the Flaming Star and Flame regions again last night and headed to a spot due West on Hadrians Wall where there was promise of clearing starry skies and plunging temperatures. The dense blanket cloud did not pay heed to the weather forecast on this occasion. Look forward to further reports.

[Davesellars]

Interesting report!  I think you must have some decently dark skies!  A great read and looking forward to nabbing some of these objects.... I'm still after the Flame nebula which is proving problematic but the transparency has been rubbish to give it a really good go.

looking forward to hear more of your quest for the HH!

[cotterless45]

Love the dark sky report, aperture isn't king , just lovely transparency and super contrast ,

old Nick.

[John]

Great report Gerry - especially in the light of my session last night

While newtonians have the aperture, refractors have bags of contrast. I'd not rule out seeing the HH through one.

One of the things I've learned about hunting down this target is the importance of these building blocks which gradually ease you into both the right place and the right mind set. 

 

[jetstream]

Thanks John,

Yes the building blocks are really important IMHO and sharing information greatly increases our chances for success. I'm still trying to see the Cone nebula and hopefully this refractor ( small image scale) work will help my object recognition skills and increase the odds. A small TFOV eyepiece would help the HH quest in the 120mm as YKSE rightly points out, there seems to be too much "information" visually with the wide FOV at this point.

[Beulah]

Another inspiring read, thank you.

Please let us know if you see the Cone Nebula through the 120 - I managed it with a 200mm primary under 5.5 NELM skies but it's easy to miss as it's so compact! Very much like a well defined comet...larger scopes reveal a brighter stellar core at the tip of the Cone.

Might make it a challenge to bag the HH this year.

[clarkpm4242]

Hi there

Are you sure you are not mistaking Hubble's Variable Nebula?  Which is exactly as you describe.

The Cone is very, very difficult..?  See example attempts below...

http://www.deepskyforum.com/showthread.php?678-Object-of-t-he-Week-January-25-2015-NGC-2264-the-Cone-Nebula

Cheers

Paul

[jetstream]

I am finding the Cone very difficult in my 15" and I hope that the experience of viewing faint objects through various scopes increases the odds of seeing it. I'll not hold my breath though. The skies here are typically 21.8 mag and with bouts of great transparency, I have also been told what to look for visually in the Cone but nothing yet, mind you I have only been trying for 2 years so far lol!

[PeterW]

Not giving me much hope then...

 

Peter

[jetstream]

4 hours ago, PeterW said:

Not giving me much hope then...

 

Peter

Lots of hope Peter!

I hope I see this object every time I look

Seriously though this is a pretty tough object I think, for me anyway. My new strategy is back to the 25mm TV plossl/15" and the Astronomik Hb which outperforms my Lumicon, the narrow FOV and the easily seen FS might help perceived contrast, and yes go into the thousand yard stare in averted vision lol! They say eye movement can cause lowered seen contrast...

 

[PeterW]

... but bashing the scope so your brain can pick up movement is also a known trick too. Throw everything you got at it!

 

Peter

[alanjgreen]

 -

[YKSE]

On ‎2016‎-‎12‎-‎04 at 10:29, YKSE said:

very nice try Gerry I'm kind of positvie that it's doable with 120ED under right conditions. A 40mm monocentric (with 30° AFOV), if there's one, might be more suitable for that scope for the target.

Actually, there're someone making 40mm monocentric

http://www.siebertoptics.com/Mono.html

or Russell optics, I hear that they do customized EPs which don't cost a fortune, a 40mm plossl with extra small FS might be a way too.

http://www.russell-optics.com/quarter_inch.html

[jetstream]

I think first try will be with the 25-6.7 zoom/reducer/Hb, but I will keep looking at these other options, thanks for the info Yong.

[estwing]

On 12/5/2016 at 16:20, jetstream said:

I am finding the Cone very difficult in my 15" and I hope that the experience of viewing faint objects through various scopes increases the odds of seeing it. I'll not hold my breath though. The skies here are typically 21.8 mag and with bouts of great transparency, I have also been told what to look for visually in the Cone but nothing yet, mind you I have only been trying for 2 years so far lol!

well i saw less of the cone at Skye that Elan.....still not bagging it yet...

[faulksy]

On 04/12/2016 at 06:29, alan potts said:

Nice report Gerry, The HH with a 120mm, If I can't do it with a 18 inch this year I think there will be a bonfire in the garden. I have not tried so far, the night before last would have been good but it was just too windy to get a scope out. I spent time outside last night but it was so cold and I am only a Brit with too much blood in the alchol stream.

Alan

alan, when we were at the isle of skye last week the HH was a easy catch in all scopes, you could nearly see it in the finder . but thats what you get with the darkest skies around

[mapstar]

3 minutes ago, faulksy said:

alan, when we were at the isle of skye last week the HH was a easy catch in all scopes, you could nearly see it in the finder . but thats what you get with the darkest skies around

Could just see the contrast difference without a filter and popped with the very dark H beta filter I have.  

Shame we didn't get to use any other filters though 

[jetstream]

6 hours ago, estwing said:

well i saw less of the cone at Skye that Elan.....still not bagging it yet...

I guess this is the next challenge Calvin! ( can I borrow your scope?)

[alan potts]

7 hours ago, faulksy said:

alan, when we were at the isle of skye last week the HH was a easy catch in all scopes, you could nearly see it in the finder . but thats what you get with the darkest skies around

Mike, I sometime wonder if I am looking in the right place because though my sky is probably not as good as Skye, it is still very good indeed.

Alan

[alan potts]

On 5.12.2016 г. at 18:20, jetstream said:

I am finding the Cone very difficult in my 15" and I hope that the experience of viewing faint objects through various scopes increases the odds of seeing it. I'll not hold my breath though. The skies here are typically 21.8 mag and with bouts of great transparency, I have also been told what to look for visually in the Cone but nothing yet, mind you I have only been trying for 2 years so far lol!

Gerry with my luck on these objects I feel the only cone I am likely to see would have ice cream on the top. Oddly going back I managed to split near by sigma which is no mean feat, so it is just a matter of time. I am really beginning to think I am looking for something believing it to be small, a few have said they were taken by how big it was.

Alan.

[jetstream]

8 hours ago, alan potts said:

Gerry with my luck on these objects I feel the only cone I am likely to see would have ice cream on the top. Oddly going back I managed to split near by sigma which is no mean feat, so it is just a matter of time. I am really beginning to think I am looking for something believing it to be small, a few have said they were taken by how big it was.

Alan.

you have some great one liners Alan! actually I feel the same way about the Cone right now.

The HH will look big in your scope Alan, and bigger again if you use a narrow TFOV eyepiece. Your scope is perfect for this object as the FOV with the great 21E will be narrow enough to keep Alnitak out of the way. To me it looks like a thumbprint out of the grey funnel of IC434 in my 1828fl 15". Some good dark neb practise is up around the NAN and also Aquila which I do regularly now. In reality look for a thumbprint out the straight edge of IC 434, not the dark neb itself.

You will see this object.

 

[mapstar]

We all used the 13E for the horse head. Frames it nicely. 

Fills about 1/3 the eyepiece in my scope and even with the skies not fully transparent was easy to pick out of the filtered view.