Revelation 16inch Dobsonian

[Astronolee]

Well after being distracted from Astronomy for a bit I am now seriously considering buying the Revelation 16" f/4.5 M-CRF Truss Dobsonian...Does anyone have any experience of this one?...For £1299 it seems so cheap for such a big mirror...Would I be better off though getting say a smaller Skywatcher/ Orion Dob etc...I dont really want to spend anymore initially than this price but willing to spend more on accessories later...I want to learn more about the sky so am not bothered about goto systems and I am moving very soon to a house in the country backing onto miles of farmland with very little light pollution...It's for that reason alone a 16 inch is tempting me so much...Storage is not a problem and i intend to fit wheelbarrow style wheels on such a large scope so movement is not an issue either...Any advice will be much appreciated :-)

[algol]

Holy hell, that would be a big scope, kudos if you go for it

[laser_jock99]

Just do it.

Any advice will be much appreciated :-)

Do it.

[John]

I'd try and see one for real before you make the decision. 8" and 10" dobs are easy to manage and the 12" ones are quite OK if moved in 2 sections even though they are physically quite large. When you get to 16" you are in another realm again and even in 2 sections the scope becomes massive and heavy to move about - 2 people ideally would be needed although I'm sure some owners manage "solo".

These images might help:

[Mike73]

Without a doubt I would say the same as laser jock ....just do it!

[Mike73]

I'd try and see one for real before you make the decision. 8" and 10" dobs are easy to manage and the 12" ones are quite OK if moved in 2 sections even though they are physically quite large. When you get to 16" you are in another realm again and even in 2 sections the scope becomes massive and heavy to move about - 2 people ideally would be needed although I'm sure some owners manage "solo".

As always John this is good advice but I'd much prefer to move a 16" with wheel barrow handles than a 12" without.

[Paul73]

Obviously the OP should go for it. Maybe with a 10" grab and go for the shorter sessions.

But, there doesn't seem to be much in the way of comparative reviews for the bigger Dobs. For instance is it worth spending429657 a bit more for the SW version? Is the money better spent on a slightly smaller but "allegedly better quality" offering?

As you may have guessed, appature fever has taken hold in these parts as well......

Paul

[John]

As always John this is good advice but I'd much prefer to move a 16" with wheel barrow handles than a 12" without.

And I'd rather have a 12" 1/9th wave PV mirror in a scope that I can set up in 30 seconds than a 16" 1/4 PV (at best) one in a scope that's inconvenient for me to use to be honest Mike   

Each to their own though

[Astronolee]

Wow...i think i would try to put wheelbarrow handles on straight away so i am really not too concerned with movement...i also think once on wheels this rules out the need for a 8 or 10 inch grab n go surely....Also does anyone know much about the actual performance of this scope...seems so far general consensus is go for it...Exactly what i wanted 2 hear :-)

[Astronolee]

And I'd rather have a 12" 1/9th wave PV mirror in a scope that I can set up in 30 seconds than a 16" 1/4 PV (at best) one in a scope that's inconvenient for me to use to be honest Mike

Each to their own though

John interesred to know what specifically you are referring to within that price range?

[Mike73]

And I'd rather have a 12" 1/9th wave PV mirror in a scope that I can set up in 30 seconds than a 16" 1/4 PV (at best) one in a scope that's inconvenient for me to use to be honest Mike   

Each to their own though

Sure John.

The one thing the OP doesn't mention is what then scope will be used for mainly, if its for an all rounder so for DSO's and planetary then I'd tend to agree with you but if its for DSO's then light grasp and image scale means the bigger mirror will show more.

You cant get more of a convent set up than a scope with wheel barrow handles....Wheel it out of your shed, take the handles off and start observing. 

[ronin]

Be careful. Of two people I know and have met that went to 14" and 16" scopes both found them too much trouble and both stopped doing any form of astronomy. Also the time between getting the wonderous big scope and giving up was quite short.

[Scott]

I think that people are getting blinded by the 16". Does anyone actually have experience with this scope? If it's got a good mirror (I don't know) and if it's well constructed (again I don't know) and you are sure a 16" scope will be comfortable to use then sure, go for it. But if the answer to just one of these questions is no then it's probably not for you. It really is worth seeing one in the flesh and seeing reports on the mirror. I wouldn't be happy spending that sort of money on something without documentation

just my viewpoint

[scarp15]

I would have liked to have got my hands on this scope myself, at that price bracket it is very interesting.There is some scant information if you trawl through an internet search, in particular a quite positive and interesting Cloudy Nights review from a few years back. You will probably need to make or have a shroud made for it. So on balance and based on your brief I would also say consider going for it. Alternatively, in your budget terms, keep a look out on the second hand listings, occasionally lots of good things to be had.

Edit

And if you do decide to 'go for it', please report back here.

[timwetherell]

Lot's of wise words already given here!

Myself, I wouldn't underestimate the hassle factor. My crazy big scope eventually fell out of use because it was such a hassle to set up. It only took about 10 mins but what I was finding was that I'd cut an observing session short simply because I was dreading the hassle of pack down and wanted to get it over with before I was too tired. On the other hand, aperture is aperture. My all singing all dancing fancy 7" refractor doesn't show spiral arms on galaxies like my friends 24" dob does. In terms of quality, I suspect that with a lot of these less expensive mirrors, there's a considerable shot-to-shot variation so one person may get a beauty and the next guy a dog. Friend of mine had the mirror tested on his 16" Chinese made dob because he couldn't get a clear image over 50x, turned out it was 3 wave out of figure!

[timwetherell]

I meant to say "Wise" words - not "wide" words. - need to work on my typing

[swamp thing]

No experience with the revelation 16" myself.id certainly like to try one though.

My thoughts wiould be: Are you just buying the mirror set at this cost, if so what kind of mechanics are you getting? If you're prepared to work on improving the scope then, go for it. If not I'd hold off buying until I'd tried one first. We're getting near to star party season again (late summer/fall ) get yourself to as many as you can, try as many larger scopes as you can, talk to their owners. Most are pretty open about their scopes shortcomings. Use this time as a learning curve.

Big scopes are as much about mechanics as optics. Good optics in a flimsy scope are useless. Try, try, try, before you buy is my advice.

[quaoar]

I agree with Swamp Thing. Having trodden this path myself my advice is to say don't do it. It's very tempting I know but unfortunately there is no free lunch here. At this price point the mechanics, amenity and particularly the optical quality is too compromised, you will end up being disappointed. I would suggest that if you really want a 16" or bigger then buy a premium secondhand one or invest in something like an Astrosystems telekit.

https://www.astrosystems.biz/

http://www.dobstuff.com/

[Charic]

Thats a huge amount of money just for the scope? Not only that, a 16" Dobsonian will come with a whole host of issues to overcome, weight, portability, storage, eyepiece selection, collimation the list goes on!  I'm certain my 8" Sky-watcher would give you all you need to see from your new darker site. Your 16"  would provide a  larger  image  due to aperture , but  doubt much  more under the same conditions, and your saving a grand to boot. yet you may need to spend that sort of money on correcting the more noticeable coma, with selective eyepieces?

[jetstream]

Wow...i think i would try to put wheelbarrow handles on straight away so i am really not too concerned with movement...i also think once on wheels this rules out the need for a 8 or 10 inch grab n go surely....Also does anyone know much about the actual performance of this scope...seems so far general consensus is go for it...Exactly what i wanted 2 hear :-)

I would step back and think about the purchase for a while.Is your main interest DSO,planetary-both?What eyepieces will be used? etc etc.The mechanics of the scope are hugely important as some experienced guys mentioned and then there is the quality (consistency) of the optics-will it meet your needs?

John has hit a sweet spot in telesope selection with his OOUK 12" f5.3 dob-great on DSO,planetary,fairly forgiving of EP selection and nicely portable.This is just my opinion however.

[Bart]

Just my experience.

Got a 6" and realised I wanted more. Got a 10" GSO (practically same as Revelation) and loved it. Still do, the movements are excellent and holds Collimation well. Did want to go bigger again so went Meade lightbridge 16". For dso's it's just great. I put wheelbarrow handles on it and wheel it out of the garage into position. I also live in the country with pretty dark skies. At that cost I'm sure there are better mirrors, but have to say, as a window into deep space, it's great. With the wheels, I don't break it down and so am set in position in about 2 mins, with seats and EP case taking another 2 mins. I love my 10" and my 16". The 16" probably involves more standing and physical movement, the 10" can be used more with a small stool. And yes, balance must be managed on the 16" changing from heavy to lighter EPs, but to be fair, that can happen on the 10" as well.

The 16" shows more on common items and finds some items the 10" struggles on. I should say I am a big galaxy and faint nebula kinda guy and so the extra aperture is worth it for me.

I can only say go for it, but maybe others have had different experiences. Good luck with it

Barry

[cotterless45]

That level of spending should be able to get you first class optics and either a stable mount or a Dob mount. I'm not won over having had a look at the 16" at IAS. You're going to pay 20% vat = £260 for starters.

From what I've seen there's a bit of refining to be done. This'll then give you a 16" questionable mirror.

I can understand the gap in the market and appealing to the wish for more aperture. I've heard of folks with impulse buying fever and experienced (on a small scale!) second thoughts.

The amount of pre loved gear is continually impressive. A trawl through classified, Telescope Outlet and Astro Buy and Sell will show you what can be inspected and bought. Unless you know what you're doing , I'd be wary of ebay.

A most useful excercise is getting to a club or star party and actually looking through as many scopes as you can. You might not like what you see in your weapon of choice.

Before jumping off the deep end, I'd make a list of what you'd like to observe with your scope as there are very few "do it alls". As you get more interested you're going to be asking a lot of your gear and a good investment will grow with you. You might consider, for instance , a sturdy mount first, then scope(s) to go on it,

Nick.

[alan potts]

I do not have a Dobsonian and many a time wish I had taken this route. The cost of this GSO made one is tempting and I have thought long and hard about it. I though would prefer quality over quantity and a 16inch made by a quality outlet with a high quality mirror and goto syatem is about 6000 pounds give or take. I have asked similar questions on site to yourself and have now made up my mind not to buy one of these scopes.

Alan

[Stu]

Thats a huge amount of money just for the scope? Not only that, a 16" Dobsonian will come with a whole host of issues to overcome, weight, portability, storage, eyepiece selection, collimation the list goes on! I'm certain my 8" Sky-watcher would give you all you need to see from your new darker site. Your 16" would provide a larger image due to aperture , but doubt much more under the same conditions, and your saving a grand to boot. yet you may need to spend that sort of money on correcting the more noticeable coma, with selective eyepieces?

One thing Charic, a 16" under dark skies will provide quite a dramatically better image than a 8", otherwise people wouldn't bother! It has twice the resolution and four times the light gathering area. It will be brighter at the same scale allowing more detail to be pulled out of fainter galaxies and spiral arms, whilst allowing smaller objects to be magnified more whilst maintaining the same brightness.

[swamp thing]

I'm certain my 8" Sky-watcher would give you all you need to see from your new darker site. Your 16"  would provide a  larger  image  due to aperture , but  doubt much  more under the same conditions,

Don't underestimate the importance of image scale. This is the prime reason for using a telescope in the first place.

All extended objects in the night sky are at their maximum surface brightness when viewed with ones naked eye alone. Their surface brightness can never increase regardless of what size scope you use. All you can increase is image scale. This is how the telescope works it makes small objects bigger. The bigger an object, the better we see if.

The difference in image scale at each exit pupil between an 8" and a 16" is huge. The 16" will offer an image twice the size of your 8" for each exit pupil. This is a massive difference.

From urban LP locations this difference is less pronounced as most fine detail is hidden by LP anyway, but get out under dark skies where a 16" can stretch its legs..........I'm afraid your 8" is eating dust my friend.

The darker the skies the further ahead the bigger scope pulls. I never missed my 16" after I sold it when using my 10" from LP locations. From dark skies it was another matter I was climbing the walls with aperture fever.