My struggle with grab and go.

[Gonariu]

16 hours ago, Sunshine said:

My Celestron 8” dob is not overly heavy but it is not really considered a grab and go, my FS128 is by no means a grab and go. A grab and go would be a telescope one can lift in one piece, mount and all and easily walk out with it. This is an appealing idea but! I struggle with the thought of using a small scope when I have larger ones available, I find accepting less aperture a mental struggle. Of I were to buy a small 80mm refractor I can just see myself asking why am I using this when I have larger scopes inside, how could I be happy? has anyone ever thought this way about their smaller grab and go’s?  does anyone ever say “ill use my less capable set of golf clubs today” or “today I will use my slowest car at the racetrack” no.

Many of us have more than one optic and I am no exception. The one I use the most is a vintage 80/400 achromatic, the Konus Vista 80 that I keep mounted in my room on the azimuthal mount of a Celestron Newton 76/700 and that I also use for grab and go observations; I am very happy with it, my Nexstar 8 SE is used by me much less. I have seen that in the USA the Orion ST80 or similar optics are very popular (always achromatic 80/400). The idea of a table reflector is also good, if it is a Newton make sure that the mirror is parabolic and not spherical.

[Scosmico]

Nowadays, I rather spend my money travelling to a dark sky location than buying the best kit that I am not going to use very often.

For this reason I divide my kit this way:

Ultra grab and go:  2x40mm binoculars - going somewhere, not sure about light pollution, or if I am going to have time to look at stars.

Grab and go: 80mm frac, doubles a solar telescope during the day. Used as grab and go to places where time for observing is available but carrying is an issue. the whole kit contains a zoom eyepiece, a Zero month, and a light photo tripod. All fits in a back pack Rayan air type.

Dark sky Grab and go: 100m frac, for travels where there is still a limit in carrying but dark skies are guaranteed. Better selection of eyepieces (BGOs, etc) orthos are great grab and go.

At home I have a 12" dob that in the last 6 months did not see much of the clouded sky.

 

 

[Paz]

I've been thinking about this a lot the last few months and my views on this have changed. Historically I have not preferred small apertures, I thought why take out a small scope if you've got a bigger one, I found going under 100mm to be a point below which I wasn't so happy, and I concluded there's something about my eyesight that means what I can see falls behind what most people can see when exit pupils get smaller. I've used small scope grab and go set ups but never really give them much of a chance other than when I have to if I'm on holiday. 

I've refined how I use my scopes to be able to set any of them up (relatively) quickly if I want but the weather in recent years plus work/life squeezed the enjoyment out of observing with anything that was much of a challenge to set up and I wasn't doing so much observing and I decided to work on a set up with the aim of making it as fast and easy as possible to get out and observe, I thought about it along the lines of if I decide to go out and observe, I can be doing it just as fast as I could start watching something on TV. 

I've been doing much more observing as a result and have noticed a few things in the process. The first is that I think one reason why I didn't like small scopes was because I never gave them a chance and wasn't bringing my best observing efforts to the table. In the last few months I've been trying my best and there is a lot more to be been in small scopes than I was achieving before.  One other point is that I will go out for very short sessions and still enjoy them, and I mean I might be observing for a few minutes and that's all, say observing how a sunspot is changing or going straight for a new double star and only having a look at that and coming straight back in, or being clouded bout soon after going out, etc. Here's the set ups that have seen the most action through a process of natural selection:

Porta 2 and TS Photoline 72mm f6 refractor - this has been the most used by far - for solar white light, solar Ha, DSOs, lunar/planetary, doubles, everything. So easy to use and some targets I think are actually better in this little scope - e.g. large DSOs, brighter double stars, etc. Being a small short scope the eyepiece height stays high and the eyepiece position doesn't swing around a lot.

Porta 2 and Bresser MC127 f15 Maksutov - used for solar white light and dark and bright night time targets, this is better for DSOs and outright resolving power on small objects but it is more stressful to lift out and double stars and brighter / higher contrast DSOs are not as pretty as in the 3" refractor. 

8x42 bins and Neewer carbon tripod - not a great tripod but it does the job, this is the simplest fastest set up I use short of hand held bins.

In April I had 4 sessions but since May doing the above its been May 20 sessions, June 28 sessions, July 23 sessions, August 26 sessions (but remembering many are short), despite the lack of darkness, work, clouds, other commitments etc. I feel like I am relearning the sky and various observing skills that I had lost.

My other scopes, that at the moment are getting beaten by the above options are a 14" newtonian, 8" SCT, and 125mm, 120mm, and 102mm refractors.  As well as not using these scopes much I'm also not really using my binoviewers or equatorial mount.

I will soon enough get the bigger scopes out again but I don't think I will go back to using those exclusively, I think its likely that my new normal will be small scopes will be used more often and larger ones less often.

[Gonariu]

I observed one of the last transits of Mercury on the sun thanks to a grab and go optic, the Celestron Travelscope 70 (achromatic 70/400). That day in Nuoro I had meetings at school in the afternoon and a free hour in between one meeting and the next, I had brought the Travelscope to school with a photographic tripod, a full aperture glass solar filter and some eyepieces, thus observing the transit at X100 during that free hour. Returning to my home in Orotelli 20 km (about 13 miles), observing the transit with a better optic and returning to school on time would have been impossible for me due to time constraints. Alongside the "large" telescope it is always better to have a grab and go optic, then one decides what to buy based on his needs and how much he can spend. Being a teacher of mathematics and physics, almost 10 years ago I bought the Travelscope to show something to my students, with the sun then you can introduce some things of modern physics, students need to touch with their hands to motivate them for what I explain in class, this was my personal need in buying this cheap optic.

[Second Time Around]

Below is what I posted on a similar topic.  As you can see I chose a 72mm f/6 ED as my grab and go scope.  I use it a lot more than my 4 inch f/6.5, though to be fair this is only an achro.  Having said that the 4 inch is actually lighter as it has a plastic tube and a single speed focuser.  A better quality 4 inch would weigh more and so would need heavier mounts than my Scopetech Mount Zero and my Solarquest.  Both my refractors are on Berlebach Report 112 Astro tripods.

'My 10 inch Dob is easily my most used scope. However, it wouldn't be the one I'd choose as a sole scope.

That would be my 72mm f/6 ED for the following reasons:

1) It's grab'n go, not needing any cool down time.

2) It's lightweight so easy to carry outside.

3) It's easy to move round the garden to different positions to avoid trees.

4) It's sharp on the moon and planets, although I'm mainly interested in DSOs.

5) It's great on DSOs with my night vision eyepiece, and equivalent to a much larger scope without night vision - especially on globulars and nebulae.

6) It's great for wide field views.

7) It's just about the longest focal length to get whole disc views of the sun including prominences with my Quark.

😎It's great for terrestrial use.

9) It's compact enough to go as cabin baggage in an aircraft.

10) It would be easy and relatively inexpensive to replace if it got lost or damaged.

Having said all that, I'd not like to be restricted to just 1 scope. However, I'd happily be restricted to 2, and would add my 10 inch f/4.8 OOUK Dob. This is the biggest I can take in and out the house.'

Edited September 3 by Second Time Around

[Littleguy80]

For me it’s about finding the happy medium. When I had my 10” dob and Equinox 80 then I nearly always went with the dob over the frac unless I specifically wanted widefield views. Now it’s the 10” dob and Tak FC100DF, I tend to use the Tak the most despite knowing the dob is better for DSO’s. The Tak is barely grab and go on the Berlebach tripod with Rowan AZ75 but it gives great views and is an excellent all rounder, needing little cooldown time for short sessions. I still chose the dob if I’m being more serious about my DSO targets but the Tak definitely allows me to observe more often. 

I should add that there are plenty of other 100mm scopes for much less money that would also tick the box!

Edited August 31 by Littleguy80

[F15Rules]

Littleguy (Neil) said:

"I should add that there are plenty of other 100mm scopes for much less money that would also tick the box!"

I agree, Neil..

Like this one, for example:

Vixen ED103s F7.7 apo..very light, c3.6kg, on Vixen Porta II altaz mount.

Superb grab and go setup which delivered me many memorable views and short but rewarding sessions on my then tarmac drive back in the Midlands.

The whole setup in excellent used condition cost me less than £800..I wish I still had it now!😊

Dave

[JeremyS]

Sorry @Sunshine, some clear patches appearing so can’t answer properly atm. Grabbing my Tak FOA 60Q on its ScopeTech Zero mount and CF tripod in one hand whilst typing this with my other hand. This will be the only scope I’ll be using tonight and it will be completely engaging 😊

[GTom]

Ever since I saw the seestar, I am dreaming about an instrument that stands fully assembled in its cabinet inside when raining, cloudy or both (90% up here) and when the clouds clear up, I can put it out in the garden or in the car trunk in a single move. Ready to make two compromises: the OTA+camera duo can be stored separately from the mount+tripod, just as well the battery. BUT it must be possible to move everything in a single trip.

Ideas here:

I do have a Lightrack, really great kit with ~2" PE, so I may go down that road. However, I don't like missing all the modern goto, fine dec movement, etc goodies...

[GrumpiusMaximus]

I do feel quite passionately about this, as a 'minimum faff' kind of person.

Being very prone to being tired of an evening (I blame the overawing mass of my person) and having limited opportunities, I want to maximise the opportunities that I have.  I have a Nextstar5SE - which is a decent set up and I also have a 70mm ED refractor on an alt-az, fully manual Giro mount.  For the fifteen minutes that it would take me to set up and pack away the Nexstar5SE (once I dealt with alignment), I would instead have the 70mm set up in less than twenty seconds.  I just keep it on the tripod in my outdoor office.

Fifteen minutes isn't much to some people but to me fifteen minutes might be all I get or want, so instant set up and tear down is important.  I might not see as much through a 70mm refractor but I am seeing something and I enjoy what I see enormously.

The middle ground is my AZ-GTI, which takes a couple of minutes to align.  I am working on getting my C5 mounted to that and then I can have a fully manual, wide field and a GOTO narrower-field setup.

This all came home a few weeks ago when I went to see my Dad.  He has a C8 and an 80mm ED refractor.  I was quite keen to grab the refractor and do some visual observation but he wanted GOTO and spent a full hour troubleshooting his guide scope, ASIAir and camera setup which wasted a significant portion of quite a good night.  Once I figured out what was going on we were up and running in about ten minutes and had a nice evening.  He spent twenty minutes assembling everything from the individual parts that were stored in the conservatory, so in all of a three hour session we spent an hour and a half observing and much of that was him wanting to flick between targets.

He's an astrophotographer really so I should have expected the above...

[Captain Scarlet]

The OP’s problem is one that I have wrestled with too, to the extent that often when an unexpected or so-so night has happened, “what scope?” indecision has prevented me from getting any scope out, resulting in me sulking inside and regretting it.

My solution has been two-fold. A pair of 18x70 binoculars, which I hand-hold from a garden chair; or my Kowa 88mm spotting scope with either Delos 4.5 or 3.5 eyepiece pre-inserted on a photo tripod and Gitzo video head, giving me 113x or 146x and an easy hand-carry of the whole thing. Especially useful now that Saturn is handy.

Magnus 

Edited September 11 by Captain Scarlet

[Mr Spock]

My 100mm was my grab and go. But in adding an extension to make observing easier, I've turned the mount heavy and bulky 

I don't know whether to put up with the bulk for observing convenience, or go back to awkward eye positioning.

[omo]

1 hour ago, Mr Spock said:

My 100mm was my grab and go. But in adding an extension to make observing easier, I've turned the mount heavy and bulky 

I don't know whether to put up with the bulk for observing convenience, or go back to awkward eye positioning.

 

Making the pier shorter may help reduce the awkwardness.

With 2 flights of stairs between my spare room (where the fracs hide) and the garden, an attempt at grab and go is likely to end in grab and go to hospital 😭

The 12" dob does live in a outdoor shed, but it's hardly in the spirit of the thread

[Elp]

All my equipment packs into backpacks (other than the 100mm refractor which is awkward to carry outside even in its bag, I'm sure I can find a backpack long enough if I wanted to), with a long enough one it'd be easy to pack scope, tripod (bearing in mind the ones I use the most are CF and not bulky) and mount into the bag, sling on back and carry outside. Would take seconds to rig up once outside and you save massively on any hassle carrying it out.

[lunator]

This has been an interesting topic with the variety of options being discussed.

I have a permanent set up but still use grab and go sometimes. Where it really works for me is when I get back from work at 10pm and I am too tired to go for a long viewing session, I use my 15x70 Binos and enjoy star clusters etc. Or trying to spot a variable ( I'm looking at you T CrB..... 😀) I may only be out for 20-30 mins  but that is enough to give me stellar photon happiness and feel I am not missing out on a clear night.

Cheers

Ian

[Captain Scarlet]

3 hours ago, Mr Spock said:

My 100mm was my grab and go. But in adding an extension to make observing easier, I've turned the mount heavy and bulky 

I don't know whether to put up with the bulk for observing convenience, or go back to awkward eye positioning.

I have the same pier and concur it really adds to the weight. I've thought of ordering a carbon tube from Klaus Helmerich to replace the steel one.

M

[Dave scutt]

I only have an 8" one but it seems ok.

[Grump Martian]

Believe it or not,I would consider my Celestron C6 Nexstar SE grab and go. I have taken it with me in the car on holiday and weekends away.It can be moved by hand easily. The mount would take my Equinox 80 mm ED. The C6 has good apature

Edited September 11 by Grump Martian
Spelling

[tomato]

Grab and Go is all relative to the individual’s needs and physical capabilities. I wanted plenty of aperture for DSO observing but my 16” SW flex tube Dob was just too much even with the addition of a 4 wheel trolley. However with the optics transferred to a more compact and lighter truss tube Dob, I can move it easily from the garage with the wheel barrow style handles and be observing in under 10 minutes. This will be fine until my advancing years make this just too much to move, then I will probably just stick with a permanent set up for imaging and some bins.

[Elp]

4 minutes ago, tomato said:

Grab and Go is all relative to the individual’s needs and physical capabilities.

Technically my desktop pc and everything connected to it is grab and go, doesn't mean it is.

I'd define it as something you can carry some distance (like over 100M+) without needing to put it down (IE carry it in a bag easily).

Maybe the term should be changed to "grab and step outside" to give it more context.

[John]

My definition of grab and go has changed over the past few years. I used to consider my 12 inch dob as close to grab and go because the setup time was just a few minutes. It did benefit from 30 minutes or so of cool down time though and setup involved splitting the instrument into 2 sections so that would push it out of what I now consider as grab and go which is an instrument that can be carried in one piece outside without any particular effort and one that is ready for observing just a few minutes after doing that.

It really does not matter that we have varying personal definitions of grab and go though, as long as we can get our hands on kit that is used often without particular frustration or strain and delivers astronomical pleasure, in whatever form we choose to take it, relatively rapidly 🙂

 

Edited September 11 by John

[Saganite]

6 minutes ago, John said:

 

It really does not matter that we have varying personal definitions of grab and go though, as long as we can get our hands on kit that is used often without particular frustration or strain and delivers astronomical pleasure, in whatever form we choose to take it, relatively rapidly 🙂

 

This should be in The Amateur Astronomers Handbook......

[Captain Scarlet]

Further to my earlier comments, when I “submit” to GnG I have to suppress resentment that I’m not using my very best scopes: the SV140 or the 12” newt, and the fear that by taking the very easiest option, I’m starting on a slippery slope of laziness and might never use the more-involved-to-set-up scopes.

[bosun21]

I resisted putting together a grab and go setup until relatively recently. I opted for a Skywatcher ED80 on a Porta 2 mount and tripod. I haven't used it as much as I initially thought i would due to various aspects. For those nights of patchy clouds or to check on sunspot activity etc it's called into service every time. Other than that I far prefer my larger scopes. I see no point in pretending that I prefer the images from the smaller scope when I simply don't. For wide field vistas and large open clusters etc sure the smaller scope is great. For everything else I will go for the larger scopes every time. Planets for example. Sure the image looks nice and sharp but I can't see any proper details as it's simply too small in the eyepiece and the scope doesn't have the necessary resolution. The price i pay for this is the setup and cool down time. For my AZ-EQ6  using my 180 Maksutov this is considerable, my 120ED refractor not so much and my 10" Synscan dobsonian somewhere in between. This price I am more than willing to pay. I'm 64 this month so I may feel different about this as I get older although I can't see it.

[Mr Spock]

1 hour ago, Captain Scarlet said:

Further to my earlier comments, when I “submit” to GnG I have to suppress resentment that I’m not using my very best scopes: the SV140 or the 12” newt, and the fear that by taking the very easiest option, I’m starting on a slippery slope of laziness and might never use the more-involved-to-set-up scopes.

Same here. I really aught to use the 12". It's so much better for observing, but at the moment, it just sits there in the shed.