Dark sites in the UK

[sorrimen]

Hi all

Hoping those of you in the UK can share some experience and expertise with me. For those of you in a hurry, the short question is where is the best dark site in England and Wales? 

Now the slightly longer version. I live in the outskirts of London in a bortle 7/8. I purchased my 8” dob about 6 weeks ago and would like to get to some darker skies. The caveat is that I don’t drive. I’ve managed to get my friend excited and on board to camp out somewhere to get a couple good nights with the scope in darker skies. So far, we’ve thrown about the idea of the lake district. My question for you guys is what you would say is the best dark site in England and Wales, or even better a little ranking list of a few dark sites! Another factor is weather, so if you guys have experienced, for example, the lake district always being too cloudy then this would be great information to have. Additionally, I haven’t looked into parking and places that allow tents etc. so any information regarding logistics like this would be valuable. One final point may be the interest of the place. As I’ll be with two friends who enjoy the scope, but likely aren’t as interested as I am, somewhere like exmoor may be harder to convince with than somewhere like the lake district, as during the day there’ll be more to see etc. 

Apologies for the wall of text, and look forward to any responses!

Ross

P.s. how do you guys go about planning trips a long drive away i.e. weather checking and moon cycle etc.? Any advice is strongly welcomed!

[Alan White]

How about dark skies nearer to home, The South Downs for instance or North Norfolk?
Just a thought.
Lake District etc. has Lakes for a reason, the water fall from the sky regularly.

Edited July 11, 2022 by Alan White

[Rustang]

I've experienced dark skies in Norfolk and the south coast, near Lulworth Cove and down in Cornwall, both areas have plenty to do during the day. I image but also enjoy just looking up and these coastal skies are amazing.

Edited July 11, 2022 by Rustang

[woldsman]

11 minutes ago, Alan White said:

How about dark skies nearer to home, The South Downs for instance or Nort Norfolk?
Just a thought.
Lake District etc. has Lakes for a reason, the water fall from the sky regularly.

Absolutely - clouds encounter hills, rise and condense (although a lot of the water in the lakes must be melted snow and ice). Wind and the clouds brought in by the westerlies other issues but better than light pollution, at least. Going further inland to the Northumberland national park looks a better bet - that’s where Kieder observatory is situated. 

[Stu]

I think there are a range of options available, some closer to home and some a long trek.

I’ve experienced the South Downs, and whilst there is light pollution from the coastal towns, it is pretty dark (Mag 21.3 the best I’ve seen). This could be good for short trips from London.

Exmoor is amazing I believe, have only been there once at night and that was without a scope. The Llyn Peninsula and Elan Valley in Wales both are right up there with the best.

Weather is always tricky, even on the day! Excellent transparency is what you need for the best deep sky observing, often just after a heavy storm or shower when the skies are washed clean is best. Best bet though is to try on as many occasions as you can, you will get lucky sooner or later 👍

[cajen2]

Anyone observed near Land's End? I'm off to a campsite there on Thursday. I'm hoping I can find a spot away from all the site lights.

I can't take my 8" dob in my tiny campervan but the 6" Heritage Flextube should squeeze in somewhere.

[Gfamily]

There's a dark sky map available here

In terms of finding decent places for observing, the gostargazing.co.uk website has maps of 'observing sites' on a region by region basis.

At this time of year, go South rather than North, as the skies get darker earlier, and it might also be useful if you are looking over the sea, as you may have less light pollution in that direction;  so maybe think South Devon.

 

 

[Stu]

1 hour ago, Gfamily said:

There's a dark sky map available here

In terms of finding decent places for observing, the gostargazing.co.uk website has maps of 'observing sites' on a region by region basis.

At this time of year, go South rather than North, as the skies get darker earlier, and it might also be useful if you are looking over the sea, as you may have less light pollution in that direction;  so maybe think South Devon.

 

 

I’ve had good success on Southern sites near the coast in Devon and Dorset. Durlston Head is good, and is near St Aldhelm’s chapel.

The Pembrokeshire coast can also be excellent. I observed near Manorbier and it was better than mag 21 with a sea horizon. There was low cloud which didn’t help but above that was fab.

[DaveS]

I see that site lists the West Bexington car park. I can vouch for the darkness of the sky here BUT. I was talking to a couple of residents after a parish meeting and they said the restaurant has a bad habit of leaving lights on all night, so may not be as good as expected.  Gorselands caravan site a hit higher up might be an idea.

[sorrimen]

4 hours ago, woldsman said:

Absolutely - clouds encounter hills, rise and condense (although a lot of the water in the lakes must be melted snow and ice). Wind and the clouds brought in by the westerlies other issues but better than light pollution, at least. Going further inland to the Northumberland national park looks a better bet - that’s where Kieder observatory is situated. 

Hmm yeah I anticipated some orographic rainfall but had hoped there would be areas that could avoid. Northumberland looks great but I think may be just a bit too far to convince my friend to drive sadly. 

[Stu]

7 minutes ago, sorrimen said:

Hmm yeah I anticipated some orographic rainfall but had hoped there would be areas that could avoid. Northumberland looks great but I think may be just a bit too far to convince my friend to drive sadly. 

This site on the South Downs is pretty good. Bit of a bumpy track up to it but a good horizon to the South, albeit some light pollution from the coastal towns. Much closer than some alternatives though, and pretty dark.

[sorrimen]

54 minutes ago, Stu said:

This site on the South Downs is pretty good. Bit of a bumpy track up to it but a good horizon to the South, albeit some light pollution from the coastal towns. Much closer than some alternatives though, and pretty dark.

Thanks so much for the specific recommendation. If it was a common thing/just for one night this would be exactly where I would be looking. Given that I’ve convinced them to do a camping trip and they’re willing to go far like the lake district, do you not think it’s worth getting to an even darker spot? I’ve got basically no experience with low bortles so I’ve got no idea how much better somewhere like exmoor/lake district would be compared to  the South Downs. Assuming this is my only chance at a darker site for a while, what’s your take?

[Stu]

2 minutes ago, sorrimen said:

Thanks so much for the specific recommendation. If it was a common thing/just for one night this would be exactly where I would be looking. Given that I’ve convinced them to do a camping trip and they’re willing to go far like the lake district, do you not think it’s worth getting to an even darker spot? I’ve got basically no experience with low bortles so I’ve got no idea how much better somewhere like exmoor/lake district would be compared to  the South Downs. Assuming this is my only chance at a darker site for a while, what’s your take?

Exmoor and North Wales/Elan Valley would be darker than the South Downs and if you are in for a camping trip, worth the extra trip I would say. My one recollection of Dartmoor on a very clear dark night was that it was amazing, more stars than I recall in a long time.

When are you planning on going? To my mind there is limited benefit in going for a very long trip until we get proper darkness back for at least a few hours a night, and make sure you go when the Moon is out of the way too. New Moon in August is likely to be a good time, the Milky Way is over head and there are plenty of lovely objects down in the south to view.

One thing to bear in mind is that it is very easy to get confused under a very dark sky. The constellations don’t stand out nearly aswell, so finding your way around can actually be more difficult. Being prepared in terms of kit, and knowing where stuff is in the dark also helps a lot.

To be honest, any decent site will give you plenty of reward versus being under a light polluted sky.

[Elp]

A proper dark site is exactly that, you literally cannot see your hands out in front of you, unless the moon's out and you also get a moon shadow. The night sky is also difficult to navigate as there's so many stars, I remember Pleiades in particular sticks out due to the close arrangement of stars, and the milky way looks like a cloud bisecting the sky. You generally tend to see a few meteors/shooting stars too. I've also had the benefit of being in rural Asia away from any town and those skies are on another level.

Edited July 11, 2022 by Elp

[scarp15]

Think that you ought consider multiple reasons for commiting to go on a long  distance multi night camping trip. Also that your companions understand the need for a dim red light at night. If the skies are clear for periods, then great indulge. Otherwise enjoy other perhaps more daytime pursuits. Good wildcamping spots make sense for more assured localised dark sky.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PeterStudz]

Near to my home much of the New Forest is Bortle 4. Maybe not dark enough for what you are after but it’ll be a significant improvement from your home. Plenty of campsites, a few not that far from a pub. And there’s quite a bit to do during the day. The seaside is not far away too. 

And if you are there in the autumn or possibly late summer, I might be able to take you in a fungi walk. It’s one of the things that I do

[Saganite]

19 hours ago, cajen2 said:

Anyone observed near Land's End? I'm off to a campsite there on Thursday. I'm hoping I can find a spot away from all the site lights.

I can't take my 8" dob in my tiny campervan but the 6" Heritage Flextube should squeeze in somewhere.

We stayed on a campsite August 2021, about 400 yards from Lands End.  I didn't have a scope just binoculars, but it was the darkest sky I have seen in my life, Kelling Heath included, with the Milky Way bright  and stretching right across the whole sky, quite beautiful.

I hope the weather holds for you and if it does your 6" scope will give you a superb treat.

Good luck

Edited July 12, 2022 by Saganite

[cajen2]

Thanks for that, S.

10 minutes ago, Saganite said:

We stayed on a campsite August 2021, about 400 yards from Lands End.  I didn't have a scope just binoculars, but it was the darkest sky I have seen in my life, Kelling Heath included, with the Milky Way bright , and stretching right across the whole sky, quite beautiful.

I hope the weather holds for you and if it does your 6" scope will give you a superb treat.

Good luck

 

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

I'd say hang on until late August to mid October. The nights will still be warmish or very bearably chilly. Also longer and darker than mid summer.

Book your trip around a favourable phase. i.e. new moon, or a few days either side when the moon rises very early in the day and sets early evening.

https://moonphases.co.uk/moon-calendar,

If you fancy a trek, Kielder Campsite in Northumberland is the darkest camp site in England, however it's very remote and unless you like walking or trail cycling there's not much else to do. Forget anything and you're scuppered!

https://kieldercampsite.co.uk/

The midges are incredibly sociable but they're less of a (literal) pain from mid September onward.

Not far behind, the Yorkshire Dales has great skies plenty of campsites to choose from and fewer partying midges.

In Wales just about anywhere in Snowdonia, Brecon or Elan.

Further south I've no clue but the likes of the South Downs, Exmoor and Dartmoor are dark sky areas.

The site below is useful:

https://gostargazing.co.uk/regions/country/england/

If not wild camping, the trick is to look for campsites that do no allow large groups, preferably tents only (or very few van/touring pitches), few pitches overall and decent sized pitches. Those considerations minimise the risk of light nuisances from other campers.

I tend to go through https://www.pitchup.com/ taking into consideration the criteria above and match up the area with:

www.lightpollutionmap.info (choosing World Atlas 2015 in the drop down menu)

 

 

[scotty1]

On 11/07/2022 at 13:37, sorrimen said:

Hi all

Hoping those of you in the UK can share some experience and expertise with me. 

Ross

P.s. how do you guys go about planning trips a long drive away i.e. weather checking and moon cycle etc.? Any advice is strongly welcomed!

For cloud cover I use SAT24 

The white areas are cloud. For clear skies you need grey or black tones. And the infrared setting for night.  

https://en.sat24.com/en/nl/infraPolair 

 

 

 

 

[Spile]

I was lucky to spend 7 nights on the Isles of Scilly (we got back today) and the skies were remarkably dark even on St Mary’s near Hugh Town. Last year we visited Kielder Observatory in Northumberland and that was stunning too.

Edited July 12, 2022 by Spile

[PeterW]

Suffolk coast, Isle of Wight, Pembrokeshire, mid wales. Going north too far can result in more cloud and rain. The South Downs, Chilterns, Kent Weald, get you somewhere, depends where in London you’re starting from. 

 

Best time are the 3rd quarter to new moon late august to mid October,  school time, dark, not too cold and the Milky Way right overhead. 

 

Having a few nights gives you a few tries for clear skies, so have something to do in the daytime. Be prepared to stay up “just in case…”. I can tell you that the person who turns up late to breakfast at a starparty and says the skies were perfect 30mins after you decided to call it a night are not popular. Refer to as many weather apps as you can and the sat24 animated infrared images… gives you hope when you’re willing the clouds to part. You’ll also discover that low cloud seems to be invisible on those images!

 

Don’t forget binoculars, they’ll show a whole lot more under good lies and give you an overview of the Milky Way, rather than just looking at isolated objects with a scope. 

 

The lack of starparties with roofed accommodation is a hinderance to the “no car” observers, the Isle of Wight was the only one I knew of.

 

Good luck

 

Peter

[Jiggy 67]

We've just bought a static caravan in Tywin, Gwynedd, not far from Aberdovey....which in itself is fantastic, but to top it off, it's a bortle 3, which I rarely get to experience. It's on the coast with Snowdonia behind us and the skies are far darker than what I'm used to in Cheshire...on a good night the Milky Way stands out against a black sky instead of hiding in an orange haze. I haven't tried it yet, but there are also the mountains behind us to gain a bit of height and it would probably be even darker.......plenty of lay-bys to set up. I know there are darker places but the combination of sun (sometimes), sea, sand, beer and dark skies does it for me. If you're spending a few days away, it's important to think of the daytime as well, especially if you're taking the other half!!

[sorrimen]

Hi all,

Thanks ever so much for all the helpful replies, there are really so many! I think given that I’m restricted to these coming days with new moon and can’t do next month, I’ll settle somewhere with at least slightly more reliable weather. Probably south west coast or south downs, assuming I can convince my friends to do that! Feel free to keep commenting if anyone has thoughts to share. 

Thanks again