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Full frame dslr -your opinion please

Andywilliams

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Andywilliams

Andywilliams

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Greetings all,

I am getting into all sorts of trouble miscalculating FOV with my cropped sensor dslr’s ......

So my question is the following.

In your opinion, which is the best value for money and most suitable for Astro photography full frame dslr for a keen guy on a modest to medium budget.

In fact, is there a favourite amongst you? A sort of standard go to camera with a full frame.

I look forward to hearing from you,

cheers,

Andy 

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geordie85

geordie85

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I recently bought a canon 6d and even though I've only used it properly for astro work twice, I'm extremely impressed with it. Very low noise, highly sensitive and even unmodified it has a very good HA response. 

In fact I'm seriously considering buying another for a dual rig 

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ollypenrice

ollypenrice

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First of all, forget this entirely meaningless 'cropped sensor' terminology. There is no such thing as a cropped sensor. A sensor has a size, and that's that. Just use a decent planetarium (I use SkyMap Pro out of old habit) and plug in your focal length and sensor size x-y in mm and it will model your FOV on the sky. This cannot be a problem.

I would think it an odd choice to spend a lot of money on a full frame DSLR when you could spend a comparable or lesser sum on a cooled astro camera. It no longer has to be CCD, it could be CMOS. And will your optics cover full frame? If they will, I'd suggest that they deserve better than a DSLR. 

Awaiting flak!

:icon_mrgreen:lly

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steppenwolf

steppenwolf

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1 hour ago, ollypenrice said:

I would think it an odd choice to spend a lot of money on a full frame DSLR when you could spend a comparable or lesser sum on a cooled astro camera. It no longer has to be CCD, it could be CMOS. And will your optics cover full frame? If they will, I'd suggest that they deserve better than a DSLR. 

I concur ....... :happy1:

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geordie85

geordie85

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1 hour ago, ollypenrice said:

First of all, forget this entirely meaningless 'cropped sensor' terminology. There is no such thing as a cropped sensor. A sensor has a size, and that's that. Just use a decent planetarium (I use SkyMap Pro out of old habit) and plug in your focal length and sensor size x-y in mm and it will model your FOV on the sky. This cannot be a problem.

I would think it an odd choice to spend a lot of money on a full frame DSLR when you could spend a comparable or lesser sum on a cooled astro camera. It no longer has to be CCD, it could be CMOS. And will your optics cover full frame? If they will, I'd suggest that they deserve better than a DSLR. 

Awaiting flak!

:icon_mrgreen:lly

I actually changed from a ccd to full frame DSLR. The main reasoning behind it was portability and easy of use. But then I've gone from back garden imaging to dark site imaging. It's alot easier for me to travel out after work with my scope/ lens, dslr and Star adventurer than with my whole imaging setup.

With that being said, if I could still image from my back garden I'd stick with ccd imaging.

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Andywilliams

Andywilliams

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2 hours ago, ollypenrice said:

First of all, forget this entirely meaningless 'cropped sensor' terminology. There is no such thing as a cropped sensor. A sensor has a size, and that's that. Just use a decent planetarium (I use SkyMap Pro out of old habit) and plug in your focal length and sensor size x-y in mm and it will model your FOV on the sky. This cannot be a problem.

I would think it an odd choice to spend a lot of money on a full frame DSLR when you could spend a comparable or lesser sum on a cooled astro camera. It no longer has to be CCD, it could be CMOS. And will your optics cover full frame? If they will, I'd suggest that they deserve better than a DSLR. 

Awaiting flak!

:icon_mrgreen:lly

Many thanks  Olly,

No flak coming from this quarter !

In fact quite the opposite.....

You  have just saved me a minimum of $1300

i guess as a newbie, things that may seem rather obvious do not necessarily occur to me .

Skymap  pro here we come.....and thanks heaps for the tips.

cheers,

Andy 

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laser_jock99

laser_jock99

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26 minutes ago, geordie85 said:

I actually changed from a ccd to full frame DSLR. The main reasoning behind it was portability and easy of use.

Hit the nail on the head there. No computer needed, just a cheap intervalometer. Olly's point about corrected imaging circle size is valid though. Not many scopes out there can properly utilize the whole area of a large CCD. One of the main reasons I've never gone full frame.

 

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Ken82

Ken82

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As others have mentioned i would only consider buying a full frame dslr/ccd if you have a scope capable of covering the frame. I currently use a modified canon 6d with a tak fsq for widefield which i find to perform exceptionally. I bought the 6d as a compromise because the cost of a full frame ccd would most probably be thousands more. If you do have a scope able to cover a full frame sensor then i would look no further than the canon 6d as ive found even 8-10min exposures have very little noise.

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geordie85

geordie85

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22 minutes ago, Ken82 said:

As others have mentioned i would only consider buying a full frame dslr/ccd if you have a scope capable of covering the frame. I currently use a modified canon 6d with a tak fsq for widefield which i find to perform exceptionally. I bought the 6d as a compromise because the cost of a full frame ccd would most probably be thousands more. If you do have a scope able to cover a full frame sensor then i would look no further than the canon 6d as ive found even 8-10min exposures have very little noise.

Was it hard to modify your 6d? 

I can't seem to find anyone in the UK who does it

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Space Hopper

Space Hopper

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12 minutes ago, geordie85 said:

Was it hard to modify your 6d? 

I can't seem to find anyone in the UK who does it

Me neither.

In fact i enquired with someone who routinely converts DSLRs for astro, and he declined to do my 6D.

 

I've also learned the new 6D2 is not a patch on the 6D1 for astro.

So look out for cut priced 6D1's now the Mk 2 is out.

I just wish the 6D1 had the articulating screen that the Mk2 has......

 

 

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Thalestris24

Thalestris24

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1 hour ago, Andywilliams said:

Many thanks  Olly,

No flak coming from this quarter !

In fact quite the opposite.....

You  have just saved me a minimum of $1300

i guess as a newbie, things that may seem rather obvious do not necessarily occur to me .

Skymap  pro here we come.....and thanks heaps for the tips.

cheers,

Andy 

Try this for free else download Stellarium, also free

Louise

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wxsatuser

wxsatuser

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5 hours ago, ollypenrice said:

First of all, forget this entirely meaningless 'cropped sensor' terminology. There is no such thing as a cropped sensor. A sensor has a size, and that's that. Just use a decent planetarium (I use SkyMap Pro out of old habit) and plug in your focal length and sensor size x-y in mm and it will model your FOV on the sky. This cannot be a problem.

I would think it an odd choice to spend a lot of money on a full frame DSLR when you could spend a comparable or lesser sum on a cooled astro camera. It no longer has to be CCD, it could be CMOS. And will your optics cover full frame? If they will, I'd suggest that they deserve better than a DSLR. 

Awaiting flak!

:icon_mrgreen:lly

Photography misconceptions with no flak here. :icon_biggrin:

 It's crop factor, the adjustment we make for lenses on different size sensors to get the same FOV.

 

 

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Ken82

Ken82

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8 hours ago, geordie85 said:

Was it hard to modify your 6d? 

I can't seem to find anyone in the UK who does it

Andy Ellis (astronomiser) modified my canon 6d. I believe it is much more difficult to modify the 6d as the filter is glued in place. Anyway Andy did a superb job and I’m very pleased with the reult! For the camera body and the modification I’d say it cost me around £1300 which in my eyes is a bargain considering a full frame ccd would likely cost double. 

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ollypenrice

ollypenrice

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3 hours ago, wxsatuser said:

Photography misconceptions with no flak here. :icon_biggrin:

 It's crop factor, the adjustment we make for lenses on different size sensors to get the same FOV.

 

 

Indeed, but the problem with this term, particularly in astronomy, is that it perpetuates the fallacy that reducing the chip size magically increases the focal length!

Olly

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Space Hopper

Space Hopper

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2 hours ago, Ken82 said:

Andy Ellis (astronomiser) modified my canon 6d. I believe it is much more difficult to modify the 6d as the filter is glued in place. Anyway Andy did a superb job and I’m very pleased with the reult! For the camera body and the modification I’d say it cost me around £1300 which in my eyes is a bargain considering a full frame ccd would likely cost double. 

It was Andy, if i remember right, who declined to modify my own 6D

He said he didn't do that model any more, for the reasons you state.

Shame, but entirely his prerogative of course.

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Mr Spock

Mr Spock

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1 hour ago, ollypenrice said:

Indeed, but the problem with this term, particularly in astronomy, is that it perpetuates the fallacy that reducing the chip size magically increases the focal length!

It's the same in photography. I get sick of hearing a 35mm lens is equivalent of a 50mm lens. No, it isn't - it's still 35mm, it just has a smaller field of view than on full frame. You could say the same about medium format where a 35mm lens would be a strong wide angle - it's still 35mm :wink2:

However, getting people's heads around the concept is almost impossible.

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geordie85

geordie85

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1 hour ago, Ken82 said:

Cheapastrophotography will not modify the canon 6d due to the greater difficulty. 

Understandably but it's strange he'll sell a pre modded one. But it is rather expensive. 

I found a site that claims to do them but I've never heard of or seen any reference to these guys before. Has anyone had any experience with them?

http://www.dslrastromod.co.uk/order.html

Their prices are quite high too

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