AstroBuySell is getting silly...

[DRT]

I've clearly missed out on this chap; I'm tempted to post a bogus add to entice him in... Only joking.

James

If you do, make sure you increase you Inbox maximum size limit before starting a conversation

[jambouk]

Can someone private message me any names i should just avoid. I've had a few odd emails about my recent ABS items.

[carastro]

I can't remember the name of the chap who got stroppy about my scope price, (see previous posts) but I don't think he was a trader, I think he was a forum member and possibly of this community, but don't think I have seen him around for quite a while.  Just a private cheap skate I think.

Likewise I had a trader once buy one of my items with no questions asked at all, it was only some months later I bumped into him at Kelling and he told me he had bought my camera for his stock that I realised he was a trader, I had no idea, but I must have asked the right price.  It was a camera I had bought which i hadn't realised was firewire and I couldn't use it as I had no firewire port.  

One thing I always do do though is make sure I give a good description and if there are any faults, I make sure I tell those also so the buyer knows what he/she is getting. for instance I sold a CG5 GT once which I had problems guiding with, I was never sure if it was the mount that was the problem, but I stated this was the case, and some-one quite happily bought it as they said all they wanted was a GOTO.  

Carole 

[carastro]

Just out of interest, I sold a small Atik16c last year, which i myself had bought 2nd hand and used it a couple of times and decided it was too small for my needs and re-sold it. 

I then got a reply from the buyer that it had a few scratches and he would have to get it re-sprayed.  I hadn't even noticed those scratches, and it must have been in the same condition when I bought it.  I can't honestly see what difference that would make to the performance of the camera, and quite honestly i thought it quite unimportant.  But in the end I offered him to return it and I'd refund the money or give him £20 refund to keep it.  He chose the latter.  
 

Just wondered what you guys think of this.  Would you be bothered with a few scratches?  I never even saw or noticed them, so I can't imagine they were anything major.  I just offered the discount or return rather than have a continued argument or spoiled reputation.

Or do you think he was "trying it on".  Come to think of it I should have demanded to see photos, oh well too late now.  

Carole 

[Chris]

I think he was trying it on Carol, who would be bothered by a few very minor scratches on a very old and cheap Atik16C? My old Atik16 had a couple of scrapes when it arrived = not bothered it was cheap!

If it was a nearly new 414, 460 etc I could understand it as you would pay a LOT more and expect a newer camera to be in good shape.

I say this as someone who is OCD about keeping kit looking nice, but you really need to look at the price you're paying for kit and what you can expect   

[wxsatuser]

I had the same selling some of my Gscale railway gear.

Someone asked me if I had a certain piece of trackwork and I replied it was well weathered having been in the garden for over 5years.

When the chap received it I had a mail that there was a chip in part of the track plastic.

Honestly you would need  a magnifying glass to see it.

All I did was offer to take it back, never heard another word, he got it cheap anyway, chancer!

Next time he wanted something I did'nt have it.

[Stu]

I agree, I would offer a full refund including postage but personally would not offer a discount as that leaves you too open to people taking advantage.

I have, very occasionally found an item to be in worse condition than I thought after having agreed a sale. In this case I have proactively given a part refund if the person is happy to accept the item still.

[mcolbert]

Carole, for me it's the glass that counts.  Or the sensor inside the 'camera'  If I'm worried by the external - I'll spray it or think about a steampunk conversion.

[Physopto]

Any one who suggests he needs to respray (in this instance), a camera is round the bend! It was obviously a rather silly try on that worked. He probably went away grinning to himself, thinking he had won. Well in all honesty he won a small victory but really has lost credibility in your eyes and any other seller. I'm with Big Sumorian offer to refund on return, but also stipulate it must be in the same condition and working.

I always photograph any item that I am selling. I also video it working and being packaged up, for proof of state. I also always send items out by either registered post insured and to be signed for.

Derek

[philj]

I must admit that using UKABS has not been a pleasant experience for me on several occassions. Buying, no problem but selling, well Ive had the lot. From the people giving me pricing advice to the person who says, yep i will have it, then nothing no comms etc.

I see this chap is selling a few things on Ukabs and here, I hope someone does the same trick to him as he,s tried with me twice

I like your ethics Olly mine are similar, and I try where possible to stick with them as far as astro kit is concerned.

I am a part time antiques dealer and the current barter climate that has taken over in England really frustrates but its now the done thing for customers to try get something for nothing, therefore to counter this you up the asking price, so eventually you end up with the price you want. It goes against my grain but you have to do it.

I watched with interest at a recent fair when an antiques dealer new to the culture set there stand out with a notice proudly stating " We dont haggle, all prices include discount", they did not have a good fair .

[carastro]

Carole, for me it's the glass that counts.  Or the sensor inside the 'camera' 

Exactly my feelings.

personally would not offer a discount as that leaves you too open to people taking advantage.

Yes you are right, but at the time I couldn't be bothered with all the hassle of it being returned and then having to re-advertise it. 

I always photograph any item that I am selling.

I always do that too, guess I was a bit slow on this one.  

Well I will be wiser next time.

Carole 

[DRT]

One thing that has really surprised me in this conversation is the number of people opposed to haggling/bargaining/bartering over the price of an item. That practice has been commonplace in our society for millennia, yet it seems to be offensive to some.

Who here has not tried to get a better price when trading in a car, buying double glazing, a conservatory, a new garden fence, etc?

Philj, I am particularly intrigued by your comment about "the current barter climate that has taken over in England" - has it not been that way forever in the antique trade?

As I say, I just find this interesting and am not disagreeing with anyone's point of view - it is simply something I had never considered before this thread evolved.

Food for thought.

[DRT]

Today I had an encounter that proved the points made above about meeting up to exchange items sold through ABS UK. I met up with Jules (nightfisher) this morning in a lay-by near the M1 to collect a couple of items. Despite the rain we stood and chatted for a good half an hour about life the universe and everything and I would like to think we each now have a new astro friend.

There is something quite satisfying about meeting the person you are doing business with rather than just being someone at the end of a keyboard

I think I have met around 15 people in the past two years in similar circumstances. Some have been very quick handover, handshake and thanks very much but others, like today, have been very pleasurable experiences.

James - you should try it sometime

[Stu]

One thing that has really surprised me in this conversation is the number of people opposed to haggling/bargaining/bartering over the price of an item. That practice has been commonplace in our society for millennia, yet it seems to be offensive to some.

Who here has not tried to get a better price when trading in a car, buying double glazing, a conservatory, a new garden fence, etc?

Philj, I am particularly intrigued by your comment about "the current barter climate that has taken over in England" - has it not been that way forever in the antique trade?

As I say, I just find this interesting and am not disagreeing with anyone's point of view - it is simply something I had never considered before this thread evolved.

Food for thought.

I suppose I am very 'English' about this . As said, if a seller puts 'offers accepted' or 'ono' on their ad then I would consider making an offer if I thought it fair. If not, then I buy or don't buy based on the advertised price as I assume that is what they are prepared to sell at.

I guess it's the same everywhere, the etiquette changes depending upon the environment; you wouldn't expect to go into a supermarket and barter, but it's often ok, as you say, with antiques and cars. I view eBay as the place for bartering and auctions.

Personally I find it a little frustrating because I tend to (often naively) operate on an expectation that people are asking genuine prices up front and haggling is not something I enjoy. I can get a bit grumpy if people make an offer when I haven't 'invited' offers, silly I know but that's how I've always operated on ABS both as a buyer and seller.

At the end of the day though I don't think it matters much, as long as both parties are polite, courteous and friendly you generally find a way of coming to an agreement in an amicable way. That's what is important, as well as treating others as you would hope to be treated.

[philj]

Hi Derek

I agree bartering has been around for millenia but the past 10 years or so has seen a sharp rise in it and a sharp rise in buyers thinking they are on tv and come out with unreasonable and sometimes rude ways of doing it.

These antiques shows on tv have alot to answer for, they are fiction because some dealers feel obliged to do silly discounts due to the pressure of the cameras etc. Then joe public see this on tv and think they can do the same. Bartering has changed.

There are many dealers with the same attitude and camera crews can get short shrift if they come round. BH have outstayed their welcome in some places over the years

[Scott]

Hi Derek

I agree bartering has been around for millenia but the past 10 years or so has seen a sharp rise in it and a sharp rise in buyers thinking they are on tv and come out with unreasonable and sometimes rude ways of doing it.

These antiques shows on tv have alot to answer for, they are fiction because some dealers feel obliged to do silly discounts due to the pressure of the cameras etc. Then joe public see this on tv and think they can do the same. Bartering has changed.

There are many dealers with the same attitude and camera crews can get short shrift if they come round. BH have outstayed their welcome in some places over the years

the building industry has also felt the effect of hollywood style television, namely the cowboy builder type show. It's got to the point now that merely offering advice to a customer is oft construde as an attempt to diddle them. the other side of the coin is the number of phonecalls from people saying " I saw a diy program the other night and they were putting up cornice. lookedeasy so I thought i'd give it a go......can you come and fix my bodge job please" why do people think watching a 15 min display on tv gives them the same skill as a tradesman of many yrs is beyond me...................And....breathe

[philj]

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_p_mdGtY26Y

I bet A&E has seen a sharp rise in attendance as well Scott. Lots of Reg Prescotts :-)

[mcolbert]

and the above comments tie in with another active thread on reliable retailers.  We are seeing how society changes over time mayhaps?

michael

[Dave In Vermont]

and the above comments tie in with another active thread on reliable retailers.  We are seeing how society changes over time mayhaps?

michael

Most likely the social change is running side - by - side with the economic picture. TV doesn't help matters either.

Dave

[Davey-T]

the building industry has also felt the effect of hollywood style television, namely the cowboy builder type show. It's got to the point now that merely offering advice to a customer is oft construde as an attempt to diddle them. the other side of the coin is the number of phonecalls from people saying " I saw a diy program the other night and they were putting up cornice. lookedeasy so I thought i'd give it a go......can you come and fix my bodge job please" why do people think watching a 15 min display on tv gives them the same skill as a tradesman of many yrs is beyond me...................And....breathe

Drives us round the bend when we say it'll take 2 weeks to refit their bathroom they say why when DIY SOS do a whole house in a week, and why will it cost that much when they've just seen a guy on Homes Under The Hammer do a whole house for £5000.00.

We say there's the price give us a call if you want it done 

Dave

[brantuk]

"Can someone private message me any names i should just avoid"

Avoid Brantuk - he'll twist your arm tight for a deal - and he's so subtle and nice about it you won't even realise it's happened. lol :grin:

[Scott]

"Can someone private message me any names i should just avoid"

Avoid Brantuk - he'll twist your arm tight for a deal - and he's so subtle and nice about it you won't even realise it's happened. lol :grin:

Thanks for the heads up err.....Brantuk???

[Scott]

Drives us round the bend when we say it'll take 2 weeks to refit their bathroom they say why when DIY SOS do a whole house in a week, and why will it cost that much when they've just seen a guy on Homes Under The Hammer do a whole house for £5000.00.

We say there's the price give us a call if you want it done 

Dave

I worked on one of the diy sos jobs. Its amazing what a good camera man can do

[mcolbert]

Most likely the social change is running side - by - side with the economic picture. TV doesn't help matters either.

Dave

 don't we call that entanglement?

michael

[Astro_Baby]

Oh I don't mind a haggle - what I dislike is someone pretty much accusing me on ABS of ripping 'other people off' which has happened a few times.  Make me an offer if you want but don't mail me telling me in your opinion I am asking too much and implying I am sharking people. When I was in the electronic distribution game I had dealers always trying to get a few clicks off the price - mostly by telling me my competitor would do it at 5% less.  I would always ask if that was the case why bother calling me.  9 times out of 10 they would say because your competitor has no stock to which I would always say 'fine - call me back when I have no stock and I will go 10% cheaper too'

Its the same on ebay these days which is why I almost never sell stuff there...people moaning that post and packing adds a fiver.  Where do they imagine I am going to get a jiffy bag from for free I wonder and a mail service to transfer it to them at no cost.  I usually say 'thats ok - tell you what don't pay the postage cost and I will just write your address on the item with a marker pen  and give it to a passing tramp - maybe it will get to you for no cost that way'