Rowan AZ75 Mount

[Alan White]

21 minutes ago, dweller25 said:

Apples and pears go well together 🙂

They may do indeed, nice Apple and Pear Crumble anyone?  Oh and Custard, got to be Custard.

[Stu]

3 hours ago, Alan White said:

A comment on @Stu spin videos:

It has been noted by one of our old SGL friends who now frequesnts CN that the spin test is pointless fresh from the factory.
What we need is one thats done a long time in varying conditions.

I can see the initial point, but unless we have a Time Machine available, then we cannot do that in testing, can we.

I think that the AZ75 will be just as smooth after use than fresh from Rowan,
They greases they use are of aviation quality, so they are not intended to fail in use.

The AZ100 is greased with Aeroshell 33, which is used heavily in the Aviation Industry,
It has wide temp range and is designed for a long service life, its great even at -73 Degrees Celcius, so I think we should be OK 

The same grease was on the assembly area for the AZ75, but it will have far less to lubricate as no worms or internal gears.



 

Thanks Alan. Yes, unless as you say we have a time machine, all we can do is test what we have now.

I hope, given the likely comments on CN (I can imagine!), that the reason for showing the ‘spin test’ was patently obvious? I know it’s not a typical use case 🤪🤪, it was purely aimed at showing that whether single or dual scope, balanced or unbalanced, the movement in Az is totally free. I could show the same thing in Alt but it may come as a surprise to some of our US readers that I’m not totally stupid 😉! Try the same thing in Az (or alt) with an unbalanced Ercole or similar and you get a very different result.

Why does that matter you ask? Because it means any tension is under your control, you can set it to be as free or tight as you like, with very fine adjustment.

Now I’m better set up, I’ve changed tack (Tak?) to show some live views through the eyepiece at high powers so people can make their own judgement. I’m not here to sell the mount to anyone, just try to represent it for what it is. Let’s not forget it’s still a prototype.

[Alan White]

Keep on with the Videos @Stu, they are great, something I do not do, but perhaps I should.
I might do a round up video at the end of my testing to explain the mount and how it worked.

The mount is indeed very controlled and puts you in the driving seat, unlike every other Alt Az of this size I have tried or owned.
And boy have I tried some mounts to find 'the one'!

 

[johninderby]

What I would like to see is an AZ50. A single sided mount with slo-mo and say a 10kg capacity and under 3 kg in weight.  Something to fill in a real gap in the market. And yes it wouldn't be cheap but think there would be a market for such a premium product. 🤔

Edited October 18, 2021 by johninderby

[Alan White]

Last night it cleared for a while, and being the dedicated tester I am, although full of Cold, I made for the Observing Pad for some Planet and Lunar testing.
The conditions were improved on Friday night, but still far from perfect.

Ignoring the awful image presented, this was about smothness and shakes at higher magnification.
The reality was as follows:

5mm XW gives me 159x and Jupiter was observable for some moments, conditions would not allow more, but I did more...
I needed a slight reballance, its a dramatic change of EP weight and size and then:
Popped in the 3-6 Nagler Zoom and it went to mush at 4mm, but it was stable in view and stable as I hand tracked.
In went the 3.4 HR and wow, that's magic, not perfect but oddly better than 4mm and giving 233x
At 3mm I had no idea if the mount or image danced, the image was so dire and wobbly.....but I am sure it was the conditions at play.
Another night will tell, but lets face it Jupiter shows great detail at 150X to an observers eye anyway.
Another night, another test to come.

5mm XW gives me the same 159x on Lunar and although a bit fish bowl was very stable.
The mount was invisible to my tracking etc.
Reballance again and in goes the Nagler 3-6.
All magnifications were ok, but 4mm + 199x and it went to mush.
But the mount again was smooth, tracking was no issue and very much dissapered.
In again went the 3.4 HR and magic again is bestowed, a nice sharp (sky allowing) and a mount steady view.

However the mount with a fine set of EP cannot change the sky conditions; that would be magic and would sell like  hot cakes if it did.

But in summary, mount tracked smothly at any magnification and exceded the smothness of other AltAz I have owned or tried.

 

Edited October 18, 2021 by Alan White

[Alan White]

10 minutes ago, johninderby said:

What I would like to see is an AZ50. A single sided mount with slo-mo and say a 10kg capacity and under 3 kg in weight.  Something to fill in a real gap in the market. And yes it wouldn't be cheap but think there would be a market for such a premium product. 🤔

@johninderby we all named a smaller Rowan mount a while ago, I posted it would be the AZ75, before I knew of its existance and before my trip to Rowans.
The 75 is the logical step in size due to metal stock sizes, so a 50? who knows.

 

[John]

1 hour ago, Alan White said:

You have done the Horsehead with one of your Refraactors? Wow, thats quite something in my mind @John

Not yet Alan, but under a really dark sky, and when fully dark adapted, who knows what might be possible ?

@mikeDnight has done it with his 100mm I seem to recall.

 

Edited October 18, 2021 by John

[John]

3 hours ago, Stu said:

Thanks Alan. Yes, unless as you say we have a time machine, all we can do is test what we have now.....

....... I’m not here to sell the mount to anyone, just try to represent it for what it is. Let’s not forget it’s still a prototype.

Excellent points Stu

Reminds me of some of the stuff that I've tried out on behalf of the forum in the past. You can only call it as you see it.

[Concordia000]

1 hour ago, johninderby said:

What I would like to see is an AZ50. A single sided mount with slo-mo and say a 10kg capacity and under 3 kg in weight.  Something to fill in a real gap in the market. And yes it wouldn't be cheap but think there would be a market for such a premium product. 🤔

This tbh. With encoders and the possibility to use motors down the line.

[Alan White]

On the Riser front;

This has already been discussed with Rowan by myself and Stu in seperate conversations,
this was before the testing and we both said 'A matching Riser would be Good', and we have said it again since the mounts arrived,
as have some of you here too.

Rowan have told me/us that a Riser is in the works, one that fits both the AZ100 and AZ75, 
so very much customer feedback being acted upon, as I thought it would be.

So good news indeed.

 

Edited October 18, 2021 by Alan White

[Alan White]

I have been asked on CN how it compares to the AYO ii mount.

I like the AYO ii mounts, the AZ75 is of the same size class.
This mount has higher resolution encoders, you can change the clamps on both sides,
the finish is smother and more polished in look, (its not polished, its how it comes of the machines).

If someone wishes lend me an AYO ii that I can compare, that's fine, but not really the point of this Prototype testing I / We are doing.
@Stu has owned AYO mounts so can talk from experience, I tried but the production runs were never at the time I had the cash.
 

Edited October 18, 2021 by Alan White

[Concordia000]

Maybe a bit of a selfish desire but I wish Rowan can make their mounts available in more colours.

A silver or red AZ75 will look a lot more compelling to me…

Though as mentioned above, if there is ever an AZ50 with silky smooth motion, Rowan can just take my money  

One thing people here might find counter intuitive is that I wish Rowan or other makers can make a wedge for their altaz mounts. There are so many premium manual Altaz mounts, but the only premium manual equatorial mount is the Vixen AP which is bloody expensive.

[JeremyS]

10 minutes ago, Concordia000 said:

Maybe a bit of a selfish desire but I wish Rowan can make their mounts available in more colours.

A silver or red AZ75 will look a lot more compelling to me…

Though as mentioned above, if there is ever an AZ50 with silky smooth motion, Rowan can just take my money  

One thing people here might find counter intuitive is that I wish Rowan or other makers can make a wedge for their altaz mounts. There are so many premium manual Altaz mounts, but the only premium manual equatorial mount is the Vixen AP which is bloody expensive.

Rowanberry colour? 
🤣

[johninderby]

1 minute ago, JeremyS said:

Rowanberry colour? 
🤣

Here you go. 😁😁😁

https://www.crispedge.com/faq/what-color-is-rowan

[JeremyS]

4 hours ago, Alan White said:

A comment on @Stu
The AZ100 is greased with Aeroshell 33, which is used heavily in the Aviation Industry,
It has wide temp range and is designed for a long service life, its great even at -73 Degrees Celcius, so I think we should be OK 



 

Nothing but the best 😊👍🏻👍🏻

[johninderby]

10 minutes ago, JeremyS said:

Nothing but the best 😊👍🏻👍🏻

No bias there then. 😁

I will admit to haveing a jar of Aeroshell 33 in my workshop though. 😁

Edited October 18, 2021 by johninderby

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

4 hours ago, johninderby said:

What I would like to see is an AZ50. A single sided mount with slo-mo and say a 10kg capacity and under 3 kg in weight.  Something to fill in a real gap in the market. And yes it wouldn't be cheap but think there would be a market for such a premium product. 🤔

As you mentioned on a thread elsewhere. A Rowan built solid single sided mount with slomo (and potentially encoders) for those who are a stuck with AZ4/5 mounts to upgrade to (or pay a bit more to skip the offerings from Skywatcher et al) would be fantastic... If I'd had that option I would probably not bought a used Celestron AVX for visual.

 

[jock1958]

1 hour ago, johninderby said:

No bias there then. 😁

I will admit to haveing a jar of Aeroshell 33 in my workshop though. 😁

Ahh good old grease 33, came in 45 gallon drums where I used to work! 🤣

[johninderby]

3 minutes ago, jock1958 said:

Ahh good old grease 33, came in 45 gallon drums where I used to work! 🤣

I didn’t need one of the bigger packs though. 😁

[Alan White]

I have taken some images of my own, not copying Stu's again.

Here we are with the counterweinght bar and Counterweight fitted.
The weight and bar feel close to the weight of the mount itself.

I have noticed that I forgot to fit the retaining screw to the end of the bar, shows how little I use counterweights tp forget that
highly important componant.

Edited October 18, 2021 by Alan White
added info

[JeremyS]

1 hour ago, johninderby said:

I didn’t need one of the bigger packs though. 😁

I’m going to see if we. An add @Stu’s spin test to the video

 

[Stephenstargazer]

Hmmmmm? people talking about an AZ50 with slowmos, encoders etc and only weighing 3 kg......If that tube had reasonable wall thickness there is not much room to fit decent shafts and bearings inside or gears is there? So the real world capacity will come right down and the quality of motion will suffer and then it wont have the Rowan feel we love. Whats more there are such smaller mounts in the market already, have a look at http://www.desertskyastro.com/DSV-2.html. They are very well made mounts, I have had one, but it's no Rowan beater.

I wonder if with a well placed pan handle we really need slow motions anyway (and I like them!). Smaller mounts for smaller scopes might not be the best choice for regular use at very high magnification? ( and I have tried that too!)

PS @Concordia000 putting an AZ side mount on a wedge does not turn it into an equatorial - the balance is all wrong unfortunately. But you can use an equatorial on it's side as an AZ (if you must).

Edited October 18, 2021 by Stephenstargazer

[johninderby]

Who says even if the body of the mount with the shaft is 50mm that one end with the gears couldn’t  be bigger. Plenty of ways to engineer a strong smaller mount and it would be a different design unlike the AZ75 or AZ100 style anyway.as it would be one sided.

And anyway this is just thinking out loud about what customers would want and I’m sure Rowan would come up with an original way to do it if they felt there was a big enough market.

Edited October 18, 2021 by johninderby

[Stephenstargazer]

Indeed @johninderby the example I showed does just that, but it still limits the shaft, bearings and the capacity does not scale down linearly.  Lots of makers have made smaller mounts, but none of them yet has made one that competes quite with the AZ100.

Edited October 18, 2021 by Stephenstargazer

[RobertI]

All this talk does make me wonder - given the choice (assuming quality, price and weight capacity are the same) would I prefer dual-mounting capability without slow motion or single mounting with slow motion? I’m honestly not sure. I really want to want the AZ75 if you know what I mean - might just have to buy one to find out. 😋