M31?! with bins

[zork]

Ok, I am not sure at all, but I _think_ I saw M31 yesterday with my 10x50 bins. I was peeking at Jupiter (just a very bright spot) and I decided to try to see M31 since I had read it was possible to see with the naked eye. So... It should give a slightly better view with bins. So I checked Stellarium for the whereabouts and out in the dark I found some stars that seemed to match those in Stellarium... I spent an hour looking at stars and stuff, not really seeing M31. I decided to end for the night and suddenly I found a "smudge", a "blur". It seemed to be in the area M31 should be in... But it was just a blurry spot... More round then the galaxy shape of Andromeda I am used to in pics... The blurry spot was just there... Not at other places.

So... You think it could acually be M31 or just whatever? I am still feeling like a newbie and I usually feel like I dont know what anything is for sure except the moon.

[themos]

There's not many "smudges" that stay in the sky for minutes so... well done, you saw M31! I can always find it in my finder scope and that should have comparable aperture and magnification to the binoculars you are using.

[carastro]

But it was just a blurry spot... More round then the galaxy shape of Andromeda I am used to in pics...

Yup, if you were certain that you were looking in the right place, then this is what Andromeda will look like. You cannot see the spiral arms and the classic picture you are used to seeing in magazines etc through binoculars, or even through telescopes as it needs long exposure cameras to create those lovely pictures. So what you are seeing is the bright core of the galaxy.

Well done finding it.

Carole

[RayGil]

Hello.

M31 is a nice binocular object from a dark sky site, you may find the Moon is washing some of the detail out. I use M31, M13 & M57 as tests for seeing conditions.

M31 in binoculars is normally a whispy smudge central core, and depends on seeing conditions how far the arms extend? The darker the site and with good seeing conditions the arms/lanes with stretch across the FOV, but expect to much detail, a basic shape is the best you will get, and like most DSO's whispy smudges is the Norm.

One thing about M31 once you have eventually located it, it's really easy to find there after, even though it may have took weeks to initially find it? it's virtually a naked eye object in Dark Skies even to my Old eyes!

Hope that helps?

Ray

[matt c]

I remember seeing M31 for the first time, I was amazed at how clear it was even in my urban skies

[Uplooker]

Congratulations on seeing the object that is furthest from us but still observable with the naked eye (did that come out right)..

Uplooker

[FraserClarke]

One thing about M31 once you have eventually located it, it's really easy to find there after

Absolutely. Once you know where to look and what to expect it's incredibly obvious.

You won't be able to avoid it now

[JonH]

I've only recently managed to find M31 with bins, and as the others have said, now it's a piece of cake. Try looking for it when there's no moon, it'll be far more obvious.

[ollypenrice]

It is certainly a bin object under even half decent skies. I have lousy eyesight but can see it with direct naked eye vision from here. If I can, anyone can! It is thrilling to see, my first glimpse being one of those 'hairs on the back of the neck' moments.

Olly

[Rui]

Some DSO (Deep Sky Objects) are very easy with bins, even from urban locations.

These include M31 (in Andromeda), M45 or the Pleiades (in Taurus, the Bull), M42 (the Orion Nebula), M44 (the Behive cluster, in Cancer), the Double Cluster in Perseus.

You've just started you list of DSO's. Congratulations.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Even through my 20X90 bins....M31 is not really an impressive sight. Its just a bright circular smudge that elongates into fainter smudges on both sides to make the overall shape cigar like.

What is impressive is that i can see it naked eye as a "faint fuzzy". Once you find it you will always be able to set your eyes/optical aid on it in a matter of seconds.

Rui has named a few more of the other famous Messier objects above which are really worth checking out. They are the objects that i think MOST astronomers "cut their teeth on".

[zork]

hey all and thanks! it was really great seeing it, but i wasnt sure it could actually be m31. i am not waiting for clear skies again so i can check back on the "smudge". :]

[Abell76]

Hi ZORK

If you ever run out of smudges Here´s some more for your viewing pleasure...

The page is still PreAlpha as I am working on extending the original list by Karen Pierce, but maybe it will help your observations.

I will include basic maps once I get around to it.

Please excuse the chaos on the rest of the page - I don´t maintain the english section very well lately

[RayGil]

That's an excellent resource Abell, Thanks for posting, I will bookmark the page for future use:

[pete_l]

Even through my 20X90 bins....M31 is not really an impressive sight. Its just a bright circular smudge that elongates into fainter smudges on both sides to make the overall shape cigar like.

What is impressive is that i can see it naked eye as a "faint fuzzy". Once you find it you will always be able to set your eyes/optical aid on it in a matter of seconds.

Yes, that's my experience too - basically a small fuzzy with no detail observable. When I'm at my dark site (Mag 6.3-ish) I can just, barely make it out naked eye - right on the verge of visibility. Seeing it is more like the singing horse: notable for the ability, rather than the performance.

[nightfisher]

i got my 15x70 bins on tuesday and flo did a great job, by chance i got first light with them that evening and managed M31 plus some other smudges, might have been globs as i was freehand, but great stuff:)

[BinocularSky]

Congratulations on seeing the object that is furthest from us but still observable with the naked eye (did that come out right)..

Uplooker

It came out right, but it is factually incorrect.

M31 is a mere 780 kpc. Also visible to the unaided eye are: M33 (900 kpc), M81 (3.6 Mpc), NGC 253 (3.7 Mpc), Centaurus A (4.2 Mpc -- but that was Stephen O'Meara, who has exceptional vision) and, according to Mike Inglis, M83 (4.5 Mpc).

Of course, none of these is a touch on GRB080319B which, at 2300 Mpc, was at mag 5.8 for about half a minute -- so I guess it doesn't really count....

As to the OP's question, yes, in heavily light-polluted skies, only hte core of M31 is visible, and that does look approximately circular. In general, you are learning why we visual observers of DSOs refer to them as "fuzzy blobs"!

[Petrol]

I found M31 a bit difficult to find, once I had found it though, It was easy the next time. With good visibility and some decent bins, you can deffo see it Nice one and well done

[scogyrd]

I don't even think you need decent bins. I first found m31 with some ruby coated 10x50s that cost £10 from machinemart.

It does look better in higher quality bins though, everything looked a bit blue through the ruby coated lenses.

[Regan]

M31 will be the first i will hunt down. Tried to find it with a cheap toy tasco but but no joy. Just waiting on my binos

[Regan]

found it it's only taken me 4 hours i must have scanned past it hundreds of times, Street light has been a problem, It was very faint just visible with my 15x70 no way a naked eye for me,

Looked like a very faint washed out smudge but was amazing:D

I was determined to find it tonight so now i can sleep soundly or should i stay up for Saturn

[Toadeh]

Are my skys really dark? Its a white blob for me when I look out the back garden, but like a cloud drifting accross.

[Abell76]

Here´s a sketch of M31 in 15x70 bins under dark skies:

Rony's ETX Site : Binocular sketch - M31 - The Andromeda

Under brighter skies just imagine it smaller, with the diffuse parts missing.

Try downloading the sketch to your computer and lower the gamma a little.

Here´s a sketch of the galaxy under more light polluted conditions:

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/attachments/1310431-m31_andromeda_18Dec06.jpg

[pete_l]

Are my skys really dark? Its a white blob for me when I look out the back garden, but like a cloud drifting accross.

Yes, I'd say your skies are extremely dark, compared with what most people have. You're very fortunate.

Here's an extract from a wide webcam stack I made a month or so ago (testing my LX mods) It's a series of 8 second exposures, hence the trailing

.

The three stars labeled are the brightest ones around M31. A is Νν Andromeda - the closest of the three "guide stars" that lead up to the galaxy. It's Mag. 4.5 and is invisible from my semi-rural location.

Star B is magnitude 5.3 and C (the star just below the letter) is Mag. 5.1

[update, a little later]

Using a graphics package's "eye-dropper" mode to get the absolute brightness of the individual pixels, the brightest pixels in star C come out at a smidge over 170. For star B the number is around 150 - a little dimmer. For the core of Andromeda the brightest pixels are about 155. So from that I'd reckon that the core of the galaxy is between Mag 5.1 and 5.3, but closer to the 5.3 end. Let's call it Mag 5.2.

So, just to see the core of Andromeda requires a sky darker than Mag. 5. For any "blobiness" - well, the star nearest the core is Mag 7