The ideal starter setup

[Adam-R]

Hi all,

New here and looking to get into AP. 
im not a stranger to photography in general but I’ve had maybe 10 years without a camera. 
 

I know that the answer to this question will be ‘it depends’ but, if you had to start again and you had, say £1k - what equipment would you be buying now? 
I already have a Nikon D7100, Samyang 14mm F2 and a 35mm F1.8. 
 

so I’m guessing I’ll need a tripod, tracker? And then maybe a scope for DSO? 
 

I love to tinker and upgrade stuff and I’m already looking at a D850 as it’s full frame. 
 

What does everyone recommend? 

[Cosmic Geoff]

Budget? And what exactly do you want to image? Constellations? Nebulae? Planets? Remote galaxies?

[teoria_del_big_bang]

Firstly welcome to SGL, honestly if you want to succeed in astrophotography you have made the perfect start joining. Lots of great knowledgeable people wiling to give good advice. 

Secondly, I think you need to reply with answers to @Cosmic Geoff post as we need to know these things, my advice would be not to say I want to image a bit of everything as both the equipment and the methods used are quite different. Certainly trying to buy equipment to do both planetary and DSO's I think  will just mean you end up with gear not ideal for either and also because the processes used for each of these is quite different it also makes it much more difficult for you to do either of them well. Yes of course eventually you can do both but concentrating on one to begin with I think is the best approach.

Thirdly before spending any cash on gear I would but a book or two, ask plenty of questions on this forum and use google to find out what is involved. One book you absolutely must get is "Every photon counts". There is quite a bit more to AP than pointing camera to space and taking an image, or even several images which are then stacked together. And I am sure you have already done some homework and probably aware of this but I certainly found "Every photon counts" really did explain things in very plain language I could easily understand leaving me with the knowledge I needed to get a good start and not buy lots of unnecessary gear.

Whilst reading your books and learning by other means get involved on SGL and eventually when part of this community you will have access to the 2nd hand sales on here which means you could save lots of money and will get good condition 2nd hand gear.

Good luck in your new adventure 🙂 

Steve

Edited October 3, 2023 by teoria_del_big_bang

[doublevodka]

I agree with the above, it really depends on what you want to image as to the advice.

But, starting with what you have, astrobin is worth a poke around, here are some example shots with your 14mm lens - https://www.astrobin.com/search/?q=samyang+14mm&d=i&t=all&date_published_min=2011-11-09&date_published_max=2023-10-03 If you click into the pictures it will give you an idea of mounts used etc which may be of interest and some 35mm F1.8 too https://www.astrobin.com/search/?q=35mm+f1.8 One thing to bear in mind though is for these very wide field shots you need to be somewhere with very little light pollution, especially with the 14 mm.

There are so many different avenues you can take with astrophotography so it'd be really helpful if you could pin down what targets you are thinking of and a definite budget, it'll then make it much easier to make recommendations. you might not even know that yet, so https://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/making-every-photon-count-steve-richards.html would be a good idea before you start spending on equipment.

 

[Adam-R]

Wow thanks for the great replies already! It feels like this will be a great community. 
I am interested in Nebulae and landscape AP. As for budget, considering what I already have I’d be looking at about £1k to get me fully up and running, but would like to make a start capturing asap. 
 

thanks! 

[doublevodka]

12 minutes ago, Adam-R said:

Wow thanks for the great replies already! It feels like this will be a great community. 
I am interested in Nebulae and landscape AP. As for budget, considering what I already have I’d be looking at about £1k to get me fully up and running, but would like to make a start capturing asap. 
 

thanks! 

See what others recommend too, but you are going to at least want some sort of tracking mount like a star adventurer, for ease of use I'd maybe have a look at something like this https://www.firstlightoptics.com/equatorial-astronomy-mounts/sky-watcher-star-adventurer-gti.html

 

A couple of links below for you to look at, bear in mind this is just one of many, many options, it's really easy to go from several hundred to several thousand pounds in astrophotography (which is why I stick to visual 😂)

 

Review here - 

 

and an example setup here

 

 

[teoria_del_big_bang]

I think £1K is enough to get some decent equipment to get you going but be warned if you get a liking for it then you will spend this several times over (well that's my story anyway and I think so many of us on this forum). 
Please get the book I recommended though it really will give you some great knowledge and an insight into what equipment is needed and what types of software you will need from a very unbiased view.

We all wanted to get going asap and depending where you live it maybe a matter of grabbing what imaging time you can due to weather, but, really a slower and methodical approach really does pay off and i think you actually see the rewards with better images far quicker than rushing in armed with little knowledge of the processes involved.

But, I have to admit you sound keen and not expecting to do this for pennies so with our help I am sure you will succeed 🙂 

Steve

Edited October 3, 2023 by teoria_del_big_bang

[Adam-R]

Thanks Steve, and all the others. My undergraduate degree was physics so I guess I really should’ve taken an interest in this a few years ago. But I’m here now at least 😆

I’m in Sheffield, so if anyone knows of any good AP locations then I’d be keen to learn where they are. 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Adam-R

[Martthebass]

18 minutes ago, Adam-R said:

Thanks Steve, and all the others. My undergraduate degree was physics so I guess I really should’ve taken an interest in this a few years ago. But I’m here now at least 😆

I’m in Sheffield, so if anyone knows of any good AP locations then I’d be keen to learn where they are. 

Hi Adam, I'm not far from you (Rotherham).  If you need a lengthier discussion then hook me up.  The dark skies are pretty thin on the ground in these parts, you're probably looking out into the peaks to get half decent skies.  I'm Bortle 6 so tend to shoot mainly with L-Pro or L-Enhance filters which do a fair job on helping to deliver decent images.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Martthebass

[Martthebass]

Adam,

It would also be worth considering something like the 'all in one' solution below.  If something like this had been available 3 years ago when I was first looking into the hobby I would have bought it.  It's limited to the larger DSOs but the images I'm seeing from this piece of kit are excellent at the price point (<£600).

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/zwo-seestar-s50-all-in-one-smart-apo-telescope.html

 

[Adam-R]

5 hours ago, doublevodka said:

See what others recommend too, but you are going to at least want some sort of tracking mount like a star adventurer, for ease of use I'd maybe have a look at something like this https://www.firstlightoptics.com/equatorial-astronomy-mounts/sky-watcher-star-adventurer-gti.html

 

A couple of links below for you to look at, bear in mind this is just one of many, many options, it's really easy to go from several hundred to several thousand pounds in astrophotography (which is why I stick to visual 😂)

 

Review here - 

 

and an example setup here

 

Thanks for this. I've just watched both videos. 

It seems like the logical first step would be the mount in any case and then once I want to upgrade and can swap out the DSLR for a dedicated camera etc? 

From early research the ZWO ASIair will control the DSLR as well, which is handy. 

 

[Elp]

A question you need to ask yourself:

Are you likely to want to buy a larger telescope within 12 months?

If highly likely a yes, that budget will be eaten up fairly quickly (maybe in one go even then some) with just the mount (plus associated tripod) purchase.

If not and if I were starting from afresh with the equipment you already have personally I'd likely go with the Skywatcher Star Adventurer GTI as per Trevor's video, plus an Asiair mini (as long as you are happy sticking with ZWO equipment in future excluding the mount, also check the item listing for your camera model compatibility), provision for cables and fixing hardware, a small guidescope (30mm) and guide camera, if you buy used you might very slightly even have money for a used Samyang 135mm F2 which is one of the best pieces of equipment for imaging astro full stop (mine were way way under RRP, you have to be patient).

To start with, you'd only need the mount and use the mounts goto system and in built sidereal tracking, the rest is for autoguiding and computer control which makes it easier and you can take longer singular images due to better and more accurate tracking. The mount should also be good for maybe an 80mm aperture refractor for some future proofing.

[chewie]

37 minutes ago, Adam-R said:

Thanks for this. I've just watched both videos. 

It seems like the logical first step would be the mount in any case and then once I want to upgrade and can swap out the DSLR for a dedicated camera etc? 

From early research the ZWO ASIair will control the DSLR as well, which is handy. 

 

ASI Air is fantastic and it will save an awful lot of hassle off trying to get multiple programs working as one via a laptop for instance, bear in mind though that although it will work with DSLR's and various mounts any other equipment you buy further down the line will all have to be ZWO for the Air to work as its all locked in, eg guide cameras, electronic filter wheels, electronic focusers. Astro is a huge rabbit hole, your 1k budget is fine but it could well spiral upwards by quite a bit, think very carefully about what you want to achieve as it would probably be better in the long term financially to work towards an end goal rather than trying to bits and piece something together. It's probably worth keeping a close eye on your local marketplace, gumtree etc for someone selling a complete rig as these can be quite well discounted compared to buying new.

[Adam-R]

11 minutes ago, chewie said:

ASI Air is fantastic and it will save an awful lot of hassle off trying to get multiple programs working as one via a laptop for instance, bear in mind though that although it will work with DSLR's and various mounts any other equipment you buy further down the line will all have to be ZWO for the Air to work as its all locked in, eg guide cameras, electronic filter wheels, electronic focusers. Astro is a huge rabbit hole, your 1k budget is fine but it could well spiral upwards by quite a bit, think very carefully about what you want to achieve as it would probably be better in the long term financially to work towards an end goal rather than trying to bits and piece something together. It's probably worth keeping a close eye on your local marketplace, gumtree etc for someone selling a complete rig as these can be quite well discounted compared to buying new.

Thanks I'll def keep an eye out and once I've been here long enough I should be able to access the classifieds. I like to research and take my time and also like to buy into an eco-system so sticking with ZWO, for instance wouldn't necessarily be a problem 

[happy-kat]

Astro imaging puts a whole new demand on a camera then daytime photography. I'd search on any intended camera before getting it, for example a DSLR might have terrible ISO capabilities, heavy noise on longer exposures or certain cameras I've read have issues with onboard algorithms eating stars. Full frame sensors put demands on the lens or telescope having good optics to the edges plus increased vignetting. Software compatibility I understand has improved but that is another consideration.

Using what you have is a great start much can be learnt even using a static mount. Star trails for example and there are loads of free software to get to learn GIMP , starstax, sequator, deep sky stacker, stellarium for a few 

Astrobin is a handy place to see examples of all sorts

I use a Canon and a ZWO entry orientation Astro camera.

Edited October 3, 2023 by happy-kat

[ollypenrice]

If you respect your first budget, very few of your first purchases will pass to the second level. It's best to know this from the start.

If you want to build for the future, start with the mount. The rest will follow. This is a fairly sophisticated image but the mount was a basic EQ6 - and a very old one.

Olly

Edited October 3, 2023 by ollypenrice
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[Adam-R]

12 hours ago, ollypenrice said:

If you respect your first budget, very few of your first purchases will pass to the second level. It's best to know this from the start.

If you want to build for the future, start with the mount. The rest will follow. This is a fairly sophisticated image but the mount was a basic EQ6 - and a very old one.

Olly

Thanks Olly, that’s a lovely image. The EQ6 mounts look to be quite a jump price wise 

[Clarkey]

I think the point @ollypenrice is making is that the mount is the most important part of any set up and should be the bulk of the budget, which is quite right. If you were to buy a second hand mount (HEQ5 / 6), if you decided to give up on the AP you can re-sell with minimal losses. You already have a DSLR and you can use this with a prime lens or a widefield scope. You should be able to get this within your budget. You can run this from a bog-standard laptop using free or cheap software. If you then want to advance you already have the mount to do it.

[ollypenrice]

Just now, Clarkey said:

I think the point @ollypenrice is making is that the mount is the most important part of any set up and should be the bulk of the budget, which is quite right. If you were to buy a second hand mount (HEQ5 / 6), if you decided to give up on the AP you can re-sell with minimal losses. You already have a DSLR and you can use this with a prime lens or a widefield scope. You should be able to get this within your budget. You can run this from a bog-standard laptop using free or cheap software. If you then want to advance you already have the mount to do it.

That's right, but I'm also suggesting that, if you go for the very minimum on all three components (mount, optics, camera) you won't want to keep any of them if you upgrade along the line.

I agree that a second hand HEQ5 would be a sound investment.

Olly

[Adam-R]

3 minutes ago, Clarkey said:

I think the point @ollypenrice is making is that the mount is the most important part of any set up and should be the bulk of the budget, which is quite right. If you were to buy a second hand mount (HEQ5 / 6), if you decided to give up on the AP you can re-sell with minimal losses. You already have a DSLR and you can use this with a prime lens or a widefield scope. You should be able to get this within your budget. You can run this from a bog-standard laptop using free or cheap software. If you then want to advance you already have the mount to do it.

Thanks, Clarkey that makes sense 🙂

[happy-kat]

In general the more stable the mount the heavier it is, might be a consideration depending on where storage and observing location are such as stairs

[Adam-R]

Theres a full setup on ebay at the moment. £1300 but has a NEQ6 pro and a Skywatcher Astromaster 130 telescope 

[AstroMuni]

4 hours ago, Adam-R said:

Theres a full setup on ebay at the moment. £1300 but has a NEQ6 pro and a Skywatcher Astromaster 130 telescope 

If thats a Celstron Astromaster then its not really suited for AP.

[happy-kat]

For inspiration on trying with what you already have

https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/413262-eeva-from-a-tripod/

[Adam-R]

On 04/10/2023 at 21:30, happy-kat said:

For inspiration on trying with what you already have

https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/413262-eeva-from-a-tripod/

Nice, thanks @happy-kat