Helping some beginners

[carastro]

I am not a beginner, but was asked today for advice from some beginners.  

We sat socially distanced in the garden and I lent them a planisphere, and we talked through what their preferences would be.

It was decided that they did NOT want a Reflector as didn't want the collimation part. 

Something simple to set up and not more than about £300 (possibly a little over.

They only want to do visual.

So I have suggested a Cassegrain on an Alt/Az mount preferably one that can be operated manually if they don't have access to power (or  don't have time for GOTO) but they would like the option of using as GOTO as well.

I have found a couple on scopes on FLO which I have messaged them about:#

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/maksutov/skywatcher-skymax-102-synscan-az-goto.html  

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/maksutov/sky-watcher-skymax-102-az-gti.html

Just wondered whether any-ne had any more ideas.

Thanks

Carole 

 

 

 

[Macavity]

Cannot go too far wrong with that? As I noted (in retrospect!) the MAK102
would be a "good thing"! I do sense some folk (beginners) may be put off
by false colour of (my other suggestion) Short tube Achromat: ST102 etc.

A MAK102 would be nicely portable too. I always felt the bigger MAK127
was a little heavy (narrow field) for Electronic GoTo mounts etc. But these
latter have probably improved, since I was a (fairly complete) beginner? 🙂

Edited July 25, 2020 by Macavity

[happy-kat]

As far as I am aware only the azgti can be used with no power.

[carastro]

Thanks every-one, and thanks Happy Kat, yes I thought that one might be usable manually.

One of them is retiring from the Police Force and is going to ask for a telescope as a retirement present, (or at least money towards one), so I think they are going for the scope rather than binos as it's a "one off" opportunity.

Carole 

I can see some Astronomy sessions coming up in the garden in the future once CV is no longer a threat, they live almost opposite me.

Edited July 25, 2020 by carastro

[Ags]

I have used the AZ-GTI + Mak 102 combination. It works very well, although the quality of the AZ-GTI can be a bit hit and miss.

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

The problem with the AZGTI is it seems, a lottery to get one which doesn't bind in azimuth, rendering it not so useful as a manual mount. My first one was OK, but developed another problem. The replacement has the stiffness and binding azimuth issue... 🤬 I've read numerous reports online about this.

Not having power shouldn't ever be a problem. The mount can run for several sessions from a £20 20000mah usb power bank and £5 converter cable.

As for the reflectors sold with the Synscan AZ GOTO/AZ-GTI/Star Discovery packages, they utilise fixed cell primary mirrors. The secondary collimation is very easy, taking a minute and requires infrequent adjustment.

 

Edited July 25, 2020 by ScouseSpaceCadet

[happy-kat]

^ the stardiscovery is the other skywatcher mount with freedom find.

[RT65CB-SWL]

+1 for alt-az mounts... less faffing about... more viewing time...

My 're-modded' ETX105, star diagonal, and 7-21mm zoom e/p., on a Universal Astronomics DwarfStar mount and Manfrotto 055PROB tripod...

"Probably the best lightweight visual 'grab & go' setup in the world!" - "Vorsprung durch non-tecnik!"
 

[carastro]

Yes I was thinking a 2nd hand ETX might be ideal for them, I used to own one and often used it as a manual scope when at outreach events.

I might have a look on UKABS for one.

Thanks for the other comments above - duly noted.  They definitely did not seem keen on any form of collimation and felt they would get frustrated with it and then not use it. 

Carole 

[carastro]

Quote

 it seems, a lottery to get one which doesn't bind in azimuth

So it gets stuck when you try to use it manually?

Carole 

[carastro]

Quote

the stardiscovery is the other skywatcher mount with freedom find.

I took a look at this and the price on it's own is the limit of their budget without the telescope.!!

Also I took a look at 2nd hand ETXs and they all seem to be holding their prices, and nearly double their budget.

I'll wait and see what FLO reply and then have another talk with them and see what they want to do.

Carole 

[Peter Drew]

Being frightened of  collimating a Newtonian is the worst possible excuse for not owning one!  Young beginners should easily learn to do this re-employing their smart phone dexterity.  The older generation, i.e. retirees, might well benefit from a relatively hassle free refractor.  Is the retiree in question interested in astronomy or is the telescope intended for multi-purpose use?, could have a bearing on the recommendations.     🙂

[happy-kat]

If shortly to be a retiree then may already have a decent photo tripod that could be repurposed with a ball head to use a mak on.

[Pain in the Neck]

8 hours ago, carastro said:

I can see some Astronomy sessions coming up in the garden in the future once CV is no longer a threat, they live almost opposite me.

I would love to have somebody living close to me that would be willing to give me some advice and guidance to a complete beginner. The dark arts of star-hopping, polar-aligning an EQ mount, and collimating the dreaded newt would (I think) be so much easier with a one-to-one session (or perhaps two) with an experienced stargazer. Astro Societies are obviously a non-starter at the moment, and online advice (even the legendary Astrobaby guides) are just not the same.

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

5 hours ago, carastro said:

So it gets stuck when you try to use it manually?

Carole 

Yes... The manual action isn't smooth. Despite being tight in the azimuth rotation, it also sticks and requires an extra push. There is a fix for it but atm I just can't be bothered opening the mount and fiddling. The stickiness doesn't seem to interfere with gotos and tracking.

 

[carastro]

Quote

 Is the retiree in question interested in astronomy or is the telescope intended for multi-purpose use?

They go to dark locations with their campervan from time to time in Wales I think, and I guess they have been looking at the dark skies and thought they would like a telescope to see what's up there.  Probably also a new hobby to get into in retirement.  I should add that these are two women (so a lady policewoman retiring) and she didn't fancy the idea of having to collimate, thought she would lose interest and just put it away and never use it if she got frustrated with it.

Carole   

 

[CraigT82]

17 minutes ago, carastro said:

thought she would lose interest and just put it away and never use it if she got frustrated with it.

If this is the case perhaps a manual mount without electronics would be best. Cheap and cheerful goto mounts are some of the most frustrating things in astronony

[carastro]

Thanks, yes I think this is why she wanted the either or option.

carole 

[Tenor Viol]

21 minutes ago, carastro said:

They go to dark locations with their campervan from time to time in Wales I think, and I guess they have been looking at the dark skies and thought they would like a telescope to see what's up there.  Probably also a new hobby to get into in retirement.  I should add that these are two women (so a lady policewoman retiring) and she didn't fancy the idea of having to collimate, thought she would lose interest and just put it away and never use it if she got frustrated with it.

Carole   

 

Coincidences... my newish neighbour opposite is a retired policewoman, who now works part time for mental health services for the NHS. I've been helping her with suggestions for camera gear as she wants to get into photography. She was keen to see the comet. I don't think she wants to buy a telescope... yet...😈

I suspect once my APO arrives she may well be a visitor to the garden. 

[AstroNebulee]

On 25/07/2020 at 12:59, carastro said:

I am not a beginner, but was asked today for advice from some beginners.  

We sat socially distanced in the garden and I lent them a planisphere, and we talked through what their preferences would be.

It was decided that they did NOT want a Reflector as didn't want the collimation part. 

Something simple to set up and not more than about £300 (possibly a little over.

They only want to do visual.

So I have suggested a Cassegrain on an Alt/Az mount preferably one that can be operated manually if they don't have access to power (or  don't have time for GOTO) but they would like the option of using as GOTO as well.

I have found a couple on scopes on FLO which I have messaged them about:#

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/maksutov/skywatcher-skymax-102-synscan-az-goto.html  

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/maksutov/sky-watcher-skymax-102-az-gti.html

Just wondered whether any-ne had any more ideas.

Thanks

Carole 

 

 

 

Hopefully they can get the skywatcher scopes as most skywatchers are out of stock at the moment, I ordered a skywatcher skymax 127 ota recently and probably won't be in stock until mid August as skywa factory in China is struggling to kerp up and on reduced staff atm. They will be rewarded by thus fantastic hobby/fascination/compulsion 😁

[carastro]

Thanks everyone.  I have now done them a PDF with 4 options, but they all involve a Skywatcher scope, so I hope they don't have to wait too long for it.

Carole  

[Pain in the Neck]

I ordered my Skywatcher OTA (Explorer 150 PDS) on  04/07/2020 - still waiting.
I realise that it’s not even a month yet, but it seems an age when the skies are clear...

[Stu1smartcookie]

On 26/07/2020 at 08:35, carastro said:

They go to dark locations with their campervan from time to time in Wales I think, and I guess they have been looking at the dark skies and thought they would like a telescope to see what's up there.  Probably also a new hobby to get into in retirement.  I should add that these are two women (so a lady policewoman retiring) and she didn't fancy the idea of having to collimate, thought she would lose interest and just put it away and never use it if she got frustrated with it.

Carole   

 

Carole , not sure why them being women is that significant ... from my experience women tend to be far more patient than us men  (especially me lol) . Collimating a scope is built up as the pariah of the astronomy world when in reality its easy and only takes a couple of minutes . Learning gives knowledge gives confidence gives enjoyment . 

[Gfamily]

I bought a SW 102 Mak (on a SynScan mount) when I was getting my second scope, but always found it a disappointing performer when looking for DSOs at home. If we took it away to dark sites it was ok, but it struggled with any much level of light pollution. 

I relatively recently picked up a second hand 127 Mak and it's now my 'go to' scope for use at home or away, so it's the one we take way with us on holidays. I only really use my 8" SCT for star parties now. 

[AstroMuni]

On 25/07/2020 at 12:59, carastro said:

Just wondered whether any-ne had any more ideas.

Is there a reason you havent suggested a Dobs?