Some Flocking help needed...

[DanyalAG]

Hello Everyone. I'm going to flock a 6" f/5 Newtonian(Orion Starblast 6) but I have a problem.Purpose-built flocking materials are currently not available(not shipped) in my country. My question is were I to flock my telescope with some black foam sheets (from hobby stores), would it make any difference? Maybe I could even paint the sheets with flat-black paint?

And if this is not a suitable material or method for flocking, could anybody suggest some alternative flocking materials to the purpose-built ones like Protostar?. Thanks.

[Shelster1973]

When I did mine a few years back, I used black felt sheets bought in the arts and crafts section of a local 'Range' store.  Stick this down with Copydex or other similar glue and you will be fine.

You can see some pictures of scope after flocking here

[DanyalAG]

Thanks a lot mate.

 

[johninderby]

Not a good idea to use felt sheets boight iin a craft shop as most will shed fibres. Better to use proper flocking material such as the kind sold by FLO.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/misc/black-velour-telescope-flocking-material.html

Edited March 16, 2020 by johninderby

[CraigT82]

I also used 'hobby' felt for my heritage 130p, self adhesive I think it was. If you give the sheets a good vacuum first it doesn't shed much fibres once fitted to the scope where it remains essentially undisturbed. 

[kbrown]

Search for "D C FIX Velour Black Velvet". That's what I used...

[Fo_Cuss]

If you can't get hold of recommended flocking material...
In the meantime, you can get experimental 😈

Acquire card, or rigid plastic sheet, that will self roll to the interior of the scope.

If initially, it doesn't perfectly self-roll ... you can train it, by rolling the material into a slightly smaller diameter.
In this way, when it springs out, it will grip to the tube.

Once you have cracked this setup phase, you can experiment by apply different materials to the transport material.

Find a light to point your tube at, and look down the other end.
See which materials are best at absorbing the light.

When materials are scarce, you need to be innovative 😉

🌝

[johninderby]

I used acetate sheet to make a liner for the dob then applied the flocking to the acetate sheet while it was lying flat on a table. Much neater job than applying it directly to the tube.

Edited March 16, 2020 by johninderby

[DanyalAG]

6 hours ago, Fo_Cuss said:

If you can't get hold of recommended flocking material...
In the meantime, you can get experimental 😈

Acquire card, or rigid plastic sheet, that will self roll to the interior of the scope.

If initially, it doesn't perfectly self-roll ... you can train it, by rolling the material into a slightly smaller diameter.
In this way, when it springs out, it will grip to the tube.

Once you have cracked this setup phase, you can experiment by apply different materials to the transport material.

Find a light to point your tube at, and look down the other end.
See which materials are best at absorbing the light.

When materials are scarce, you need to be innovative 😉

🌝

Great advice. Thanks.

I'm thinking of trying different materials and then using a flashlight to see how reflective it is at oblique angles. Then I'll choose the material that reflects the least light.

Right now, I have a found a sheet that is used in home-theaters.It is marketed to minimize reflections. So I'm thinking it will (probably) work.

Also, I have another question. I've been reading on the net, and most sites say that only flocking the tube opposite the focuser and 6 inches up from the primary mirror (along with a tube extension) has any real effect. Is this true? or should I flock the whole tube?

Again, Thanks to everyone for the advice.

[johninderby]

I prefer to flock the entire tube altough just flocking oposite the focuser and about a foot up from the primary mirror does work nearly as well. 

You will find flocking really helps with planetary observing with much improved contrast but not that much with DSOs. 

Edited March 17, 2020 by johninderby

[DanyalAG]

34 minutes ago, johninderby said:

I prefer to flock the entire tube altough just flocking oposite the focuser and about a foot up from the primary mirror does work nearly as well. 

You will find flocking really helps with planetary observing with much improved contrast but not that much with DSOs. 

Thanks mate.

[Fo_Cuss]

5 hours ago, DanyalAG said:

most sites say that only flocking the tube opposite the focuser and 6 inches up from the primary mirror (along with a tube extension) has any real effect. Is this true? or should I flock the whole tube?

From this consensus, it is likely to be the case that most of the gains to be had, are closest to the eyepiece.

For my scope, I have gone for all out elimination of stray light, to the extent of creating a cone of flocked baffles down the tube.

It is currently in an unfinished state, but I have had a scope at terrestrial objects, and found that the images are now highly colourful (as compared to being previously dull and washed out).

I have found that all flocking material does reflect some light, particularly at very fine angles (skimming across the surface).

Consequently, by flocking the whole tube, there will be reduced possibility for this reflected light.

Further; I would examine your eyepieces.

Behind the field stop ring, there may be a shiny cylinder that could prove problematic.

A blacked, thin piece of card, appropriately cut to the cylinder size, can fit behind the field stop ring.
This should solve that problem ... and you can't get any closer to the eyepiece than that 😉

🌝

[m.tweedy]

On 16/03/2020 at 13:24, johninderby said:

Not a good idea to use felt sheets boight iin a craft shop as most will shed fibres. 

A little tip I was given years ago was to spay hairspray on the material (before putting back in the OTA) and that largely overcame the shedding issue. Any make will do. 😉

 

[Barry-W-Fenner]

Couple of pics of the 200p being flocked. I quite like the shot of the final strip being applied. It really shows the difference in light being absorbed.i applied mine in two inch strips down the tube and it came out really well.

There was a noticable difference in contrast when complete. One of the first objects I viewed was the ring nebula and I found it easier to locate and I could see more of it. I can't say if this was down to the flocking or better seeing that night but I am a believer that the flocking has improved my observing, I feel that it is a worth while fairly cheap upgrade which has a small hand in combating our light polluted sky's..

 

Baz

 

[DanyalAG]

1 hour ago, Barry-W-Fenner said:

Couple of pics of the 200p being flocked. I quite like the shot of the final strip being applied. It really shows the difference in light being absorbed.i applied mine in two inch strips down the tube and it came out really well.

There was a noticable difference in contrast when complete. One of the first objects I viewed was the ring nebula and I found it easier to locate and I could see more of it. I can't say if this was down to the flocking or better seeing that night but I am a believer that the flocking has improved my observing, I feel that it is a worth while fairly cheap upgrade which has a small hand in combating our light polluted sky's..

 

Baz

 

Did you use protostar or some other material ?

[lenscap]

On 16/03/2020 at 12:11, DanyalAG said:

could anybody suggest some alternative flocking materials

I am about to flock my 200p with the "self-adhesive black velvet jewellery lining" material that you can find on ebay. It is very black.

As the description suggests it is intended for lining shelves & display cases in jewellery stores.

If you know anyone in the jewellery trade they might know where to get some locally.

[Barry-W-Fenner]

3 hours ago, DanyalAG said:

Did you use protostar or some other material ?

The material used was the black velour flock supplied by FLO - John posted the link above. It's a very good product, noticeably darker non shedding and sticks like muck to a blanket. It also has grid lines on the reverse which were very useful for straight cuts. For my 8" dob I used 2 rolls. I managed to do the inside of the focuser tube aswell.

Baz

[johninderby]

Protostar flockboard is a great product but ridiculously expensive when shipped from the US. The FLO flocking is pretty inexpensive anyway so it’s what I use.

[GlenM]

The Protostar Flockboard  was/is excellent stuff. Buying was always a little hit and miss from Bryan although most of the time I did receive it. When I had my little business before retiring I used to sell it. Good grief the postage from the states was ridiculous. I always got complaints about the price 😀

 

Glen.

 

[johninderby]

I used to sell the Protostar flocking for a while but gave up as the price was so uncompetative. 🙁

[Ouroboros]

I like the thread title! 🙂 

[prusling]

On 16/03/2020 at 23:03, johninderby said:

I used acetate sheet to make a liner for the dob then applied the flocking to the acetate sheet while it was lying flat on a table. Much neater job than applying it directly to the tube.

@johninderby Many thanks for this approach. @AdeKing pointed me towards an earlier post of yours describing it, and I recently completed the flocking of a new-to-me SkyLiner 200p.  I'm delighted by the result - it was so much easier to stick the flocking to the backing material with it lying flat on a table.

For anyone interested in adopting this approach for a similar scope in the UK, I used 0.5mm x 1050mm x 750mm Black Polypropylene Sheet from kitronik.co.uk which had the right 'foldability' whilst retaining its shape, along with the recommended d-c-fix® 348-0005 Sticky Back Self Adhesive VinylFilm Black Velour 2 x 45cm x 1m from goodswholesale.co.uk.

For the 1200mm FL Skyliner the 1m length of the velour finished just short of the 1050mm length of polypropylene (PP) and I trimmed all the excess off - if I did this again I'd leave maybe 20mm uncovered which would then extend down the sides of primary and better match the tube length. The PP width of 750mm is a close match to the inner circumference with a slight overlap and there is just one join where the 2 x 450mm rolls of flocking material abut, with the remainder trimmed off for other purposes. I didn't make holes for the Dob side bearings and instead refitted them using shorter A2 Stainless Steel Socket Countersunk Screw Allen Key Bolts M6 6mm x 30mm from Amazon (I have loads of these left if anyone needs some) which hardly protrude or deform the inner tube. I cut out a rectangle for the focuser and gaps for the spider vane fittings and poked through manually with a drill bit to refit the finderbase (not shown in the photo). Having done this I didn't even need to stick together the two sides of the PP to form the tube as the material holds it shape against the OTA.

Thanks again for this approach.

[DanyalAG]

3 hours ago, Ouroboros said:

I like the thread title! 🙂 

Thanks. Although I'll admit I didn't really think about it.

Edited March 18, 2020 by DanyalAG

[Ouroboros]

Just now, DanyalAG said:

Thanks. Although I'll admit I didn't really think abou it.

No, no. I'm sure! 😉  Best we move swiftly on!  🙂 

[johninderby]

36 minutes ago, prusling said:

@johninderby Many thanks for this approach. @AdeKing pointed me towards an earlier post of yours describing it, and I recently completed the flocking of a new-to-me SkyLiner 200p.  I'm delighted by the result - it was so much easier to stick the flocking to the backing material with it lying flat on a table.

 

Glad the approach was usefull to you. Sort of DIY Protostar Flockboard. 👍🏻