Orion UK VX8L vs others

[Ignoro]

Hi, I'm not really in the market for a new scope, but maybe I am, I'm not sure... Or if you want: I'm undecided or maybe I'm not... 🐸

I'll post, I guess that's what forums are for... 

So there is an Orion UK VX8L (1/8 lambda) dobsonian with a used price of 500€ currently available near me, so I'm wandering should I buy it, I wouldn't like to miss it but still I'm not sure for visual astronomy how much difference is between this one and the GSO, SW or similar scopes which are avaliable very often. Orion is also a bit lighter to carry and has a smaller secondary so it's allegedly sharper on planets...

I'm still not sure do I want a 20kg scope as now I'm quite happy with my small Heritage 130p, but still I think I'm slowly overgrowing this scope and in would like to see stuff a bit better. I often observe with my kids, so we'd be good with 2 scopes. I understand it's good for AP but that's too much for me now, maybe when I can have a permanently positioned scope somewhere...

I also thought about buying AZ-4 for my heritage and then in time maybe get a Mak or a smaller APO and use it with a mount and stick with smaller scopes, but this route is much more expensive and I suppose I'd still want a bigger scope eventually... 

So if this Orion is better I might even buy it, so if any of you have experience with this scope or some, it would be great if you tell me about it...

Thanks

[mikeDnight]

I'd go for the Skywatcher. They are excellent!

I've never been a fan of anything made by Orion UK. 

[dweller25]

I have had both the 8” F/6 Skywatcher and the 8” F/6 Orion Optics scopes (1/10th wave)

The Orion was only slightly better than the Skywatcher and not worth the massive price difference.

So I would recommend the Skywatcher 8” F/6 

 

[Ignoro]

This was easy... 😎

Thanks

[Stu]

Out of interest, was the OO scope just the OTA or was it on a dob mount?

For context, I recently picked up an OO 8" f8 scope with 1/10th wave optics for £200 without  mount. A VX8L 1/10th wave went on eBay recently for just over £200, again without mount.

Personally, provided the price is right, I would choose an Orion Optics scope for the guarantee of optical quality and the lighter aluminium tube.

[Piero]

+1 for skywatcher 8" f6. Good scope. Even better if you get a second hand one. I can lift mine all together as the whole thing is about 20kg.

[Paul73]

7 minutes ago, Stu said:

Personally, provided the price is right, I would choose an Orion Optics scope for the guarantee of optical quality and the lighter aluminium tube.

2nd Hand only! Their new prices are rather aggressive (in my financially challenged opinion).

Paul

[johninderby]

Wish I had never sold my OO 8” f8 OTA. “upgraded” to something bigger. Should have mounted the OTA on a dob base and kept it.

If buying new would go for the Bresser 8”. Better fit and finish, a proper mirror cell and an excellent focuser and similar optics. The dob version with it’s proper alt bearings beats the Skywatcher any day.

The Skywatcher is OK but price can quickly go up if you add what I consider the necessary upgrades.

Edited May 15, 2019 by johninderby

[Stu]

24 minutes ago, Paul73 said:

2nd Hand only! Their new prices are rather aggressive (in my financially challenged opinion).

Paul

Agreed, that's why I said if the price is right 👍👍

[Ignoro]

22 minutes ago, johninderby said:

Wish I had never sold my OO 8” f8 OTA. “upgraded” to something bigger. Should have mounted the OTA on a dob base and kept it.

If buying new would go for the Bresser 8”. Better fit and finish, a proper mirror cell and an excellent focuser and similar optics. The dob version with it’s proper alt bearings beats the Skywatcher any day.

The Skywatcher is OK but price can quickly go up if you add what I consider the necessary upgrades.

Bressers look great... 

43 minutes ago, Stu said:

Out of interest, was the OO scope just the OTA or was it on a dob mount?

For context, I recently picked up an OO 8" f8 scope with 1/10th wave optics for £200 without  mount. A VX8L 1/10th wave went on eBay recently for just over £200, again without mount.

Personally, provided the price is right, I would choose an Orion Optics scope for the guarantee of optical quality and the lighter aluminium tube.

It's on a Dob base, I didn't even check ebay as the shipping here should be costly...

32 minutes ago, Paul73 said:

2nd Hand only! Their new prices are rather aggressive (in my financially challenged opinion).

Paul

I never thought about buying this until I've seen the used ad, but it's still a bit of a stretch for me...

I think I'll go for something like SW and used. I just wanted to see if I'll miss much if I don't get this scope as it won't come up in the ads again very soon, but something else will...  No hurry, I have a scope already

Thanks everyone

Edited May 15, 2019 by Ignoro

[John]

Skywatcher 200mm newtonians come two varieties, F/5 and F/6. The F/5 is the version sold either as an optical tube or on an equatorial mount as the Explorer 200P. The F/6 is supplied on the dobsonian mount as the Skyliner 200P.

Given your interests I would be thinking about the F/6 version which has a slightly smaller secondary, is kinder to eyepieces and a touch easier to maintain in good collimation.

I agree with Stu that Orion Optics scopes make sense bought on the used market where one of the better grade optics options has been selected but don't offer good value as a new purchase.

Edit: actually you can get a Skywatcher F/4 200mm as well now but that is aimed at imagers.

 

 

[Ignoro]

Thanks, I thought to buy 200/1200, I'll just wait for the right ad to come up.

There is a GSO 200 f6 now for 300gbp including a few colored filters, a Barlow and 4 EP 9mm UWA and various plossls...

Maybe that's not a bad deal... I'll think a bit no hurry. It's uncommonly cloudy here these days anyway... We never had this many rainy days in May, or April...

[Rick_It]

I have the OOUK VX8L. Second hand, for the OTA only, I paid a lower price than 500€. In any case, the OOUK has those advantage:

- It's much more lighter (7-8kg)

- It comes with a good dual speed focuser

- Having the tube rings, you will have no problem in balancing even with heavier eyepieces, binoviewer. Do not underestimate this aspect, this is important.

- A lot of focus available, can be used with the binoviewer (I think) and can be used with a reflex (I'm sure)

- The mirror cell is really another planets w.r.t. the SW. It keeps collimation very very well

- Commercial solid tube dobson mounts (GSO, Skywatcher) are horrible. They weight a lot, they have an undersized ALT movement and they use cheap bearing materials. Much better to build your own mount using teflon, formica, baltic birch and large disks for the ALT movement. Do not underestimate this, smooth movements are important when manually tracking a planet or a double star at 250x. You will also ends up with a lighter mount (mine weight about 7.5kg, but it can be made even lighter). Moreover, it's much easier to add encoders in your mount.

Edited May 15, 2019 by Rick_It

[Timebandit]

 

 

I have a standard OOUK 8". Great little scope and have never regretted buying it. It was purchased second hand and was well below 500. If you are looking for a guaranteed spec mirror and a light alloy tube assembly ,then the OOuk are the way to go IMO , but buy second hand, as new they are priced top heavy. I use mine on a AZ4 set up. Easy to handle and load in the car if need to. The 8" Newt are a very flexible and worthwhile step up in aperture, but still sensible money. 

Hope this helps 🔭

 

 

 

[Ignoro]

15 minutes ago, Timebandit said:

 

 

I have a standard OOUK 8". Great little scope and have never regretted buying it. It was purchased second hand and was well below 500. If you are looking for a guaranteed spec mirror and a light alloy tube assembly ,then the OOuk are the way to go IMO , but buy second hand, as new they are priced top heavy. I use mine on a AZ4 set up. Easy to handle and load in the car if need to. The 8" Newt are a very flexible and worthwhile step up in aperture, but still sensible money. 

Hope this helps 🔭

 

 

 

So you're using 8 newt on AZ4 and it's good. I never thought about it... I might just reconsider again as this lightweight is very appealing...

[scarp15]

The VX8L (F6) on the OOUK dob base is a great combination. I have this version with 1/10PV mirrors. Balance is excellent, as mentioned the tube rings are applicable for if modifying the profile at the eyepiece. Quality mirror cell, nice two speed focuser etc. The tube is light and the metal mount is smooth and engineered to a high quality. Second hand these will provide excellent value.

 

 

 

 

[John]

I have an AZ-4. It's a great mount but I can't see it being able to cope with an 8 inch F/6 tube assembly, even an Orion Optics one

Even my ED120 refractor is too much for it at more than medium magnifications.

I have used a 150mm F/5 newtonian on an AZ-4 and that was fine.

 

[Timebandit]

1 hour ago, Ignoro said:

So you're using 8 newt on AZ4 and it's good. I never thought about it... I might just reconsider again as this lightweight is very appealing...

 

 

43 minutes ago, John said:

I have an AZ-4. It's a great mount but I can't see it being able to cope with an 8 inch F/6 tube assembly, even an Orion Optics one

Even my ED120 refractor is too much for it at more than medium magnifications.

I have used a 150mm F/5 newtonian on an AZ-4 and that was fine.

 

 

If I remember correctly the Standard VX8" is  F/4.5 .So mine seems fine on my 2" Steel leg AZ4. 

Not sure what a F/6 would be like. Bit of a balancing trick to far I suspect 

 

 

 

[John]

27 minutes ago, Timebandit said:

 

 

 

If I remember correctly the Standard VX8" is  F/4.5 .So mine seems fine on my 2" Steel leg AZ4. 

Not sure what a F/6 would be like. Bit of a balancing trick to far I suspect 

 

 

 

Ah, that makes more sense. I assumed F/6 because the OP was interested in the VX8L which is the F/6 model.

 

[Ignoro]

1 hour ago, Timebandit said:

 

 

 

If I remember correctly the Standard VX8" is  F/4.5 .So mine seems fine on my 2" Steel leg AZ4. 

Not sure what a F/6 would be like. Bit of a balancing trick to far I suspect 

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, John said:

I have an AZ-4. It's a great mount but I can't see it being able to cope with an 8 inch F/6 tube assembly, even an Orion Optics one

Even my ED120 refractor is too much for it at more than medium magnifications.

I have used a 150mm F/5 newtonian on an AZ-4 and that was fine.

 

I misunderstood, sorry...

[Ignoro]

2 hours ago, scarp15 said:

The VX8L (F6) on the OOUK dob base is a great combination. I have this version with 1/10PV mirrors. Balance is excellent, as mentioned the tube rings are applicable for if modifying the profile at the eyepiece. Quality mirror cell, nice two speed focuser etc. The tube is light and the metal mount is smooth and engineered to a high quality. Second hand these will provide excellent value.

 

 

 

 

Nature is so nice there, I've been only in London... Next time I go to UK I must go a bit north.

The scope and the mount look great...

 

[Ignoro]

Ok I've realized that this one comes on a DIY mount, which I don't like. So the price would be just below 300£ for the tube with a focuser, finder, rings (which also look different than scarp15's image).

I'm not sure I want a big and heavy eq mount (or maybe I'm sure). 

AZ would be ok but I would need something heavier and more expensive than AZ4. I actually can't find any suitable AZ, except those double scope mounts, but then I'd need one more scope 😨.

The mount on the scarp15's image looks so classy ✨ ,nicely made and practical. But it costs 330€ on TS site and I have other stuff to spend money on in life so... 🤔

So is there a good dobsonian mount I could buy for not too much money, any thoughts?

Thanks

Edited May 16, 2019 by Ignoro

[Rick_It]

Something below £300 is a fair price for the tube. As for the mount, if you can the best solution is to build it by yourself.

You can have someone cutting the wood for you, so you will have just to assemble it. You have to purchase the formica laminate and the teflon pads. Only if you want encoder compatibility, you need a blacksmith (hope the word is correct) to make the central pivot with an hole for the encoder's shaft. Else, whatever M8 bolt will suffice.

Edited May 17, 2019 by Rick_It

[Ignoro]

What is encoder compatibility?

[JG777]

On 17/05/2019 at 15:02, Ignoro said:

What is encoder compatibility?

Have a read here http://www.astrodevices.com/AllAboutDSCs/index.html

Encoders are small rotary devices that measure a mounts position in altitude and azimuth. They send a signal via cable to a unit that is pre loaded with astro objects, and the user just pushes the scope into position usually following the guide arrows and co-ordinates on the units screen. Once the co-ordinates are "zeroed" the telescope will be pointing at the chosen object. This is referred to as "Push to". Advantages are silent running, custom catalogs, fast easy set up and minimal power requirements. Disadvantage is cost ( more than GOTO usually ) and some folk do not like nudging their scopes to view objects. Personally I really like it and have two set ups, but I am not very good at finding stuff manually and my local skies have a fair amount of LP.