NO LONGER A BEGINNER

[GazofCorra]

Having been a member of this forum for several months and realising that i too was asking the same questions as most newcomers to the hobby, i thought i would tell you where i am in the hobby and some of my thoughts.

Firstly this forum is probably the best Astronomy forum there is, but like all forums the answers you receive to your questions are primarily based on another persons own experience and preferences, so they are not to be misinterpreted as the only way to do things.

I originally wanted everyone to tell me what to look for in the night sky as well as what equipment to buy etc, what i have come to find out is you only get out what you put in and the most important part to Astronomy for me is understanding what Astronomy is all about and i have spent many hours reading various books and observing the skies with just my eyes and a pair of binoculars, even though i have 3 telescopes to use.

In the beginning i wanted to see the DSO's and planets similar to those in any book, now i have come to realise that i will never be able to see any of those objects like you see on the internet and in books because our eyes are incapable of obtaining any of the detail or colours the pictures show us and the final thing is most telescopes are not good enough.

I have 3 telescopes that most people would go for coming into the hobby 1. Skywatcher Evostar ED80 DS-PRO, 2. Skywatcher Skymax 127 Mak, 3. Skywatcher Skyliner 200P, all have there pro's and cons.

What my advice would be to anyone coming into the hobby would be 1. Read books, study skycharts, observe the night sky with your eyes and binoculars and get familiar with the constellations etc, 2. By rushing out and buying a telescope without knowledge will lead to disappointment and soon quitting the hobby, 3. Forget Astro-imaging until you are a fairly competent Astronomer.

Finally i would suggest that everyone start with Lunar and Planetary observation as well as Double and binary stars and some open clusters as to me these are the most rewarding objects that you will ever see with your own eyes, the most disappointing views i have seen are Galaxies and nebula as what you actually see is nothing like what i imagined and when it comes to these DSO's you want a very large scope.

Again this is my opinion and all i can say is this is what i would say to my friends and family if they were to get into Astronomy.

[Charon]

Hmmm interesting.

[Treewick]

I am still very much a beginner, some thoughts on your post. I think the suggestion of reading and studying the charts and sky is invaluable. I have found it immensely rewarding and a great way to kill the time while waiting for clear skies (the cloud cover which seem to be proportionally influenced by the purchase of any pieces Astronomy equipment. That has been my experience so far anyway).

I also agree whole heartedly on your comments about this board. The information provided by the members here has been of great assistance to me and I thoroughly enjoy reading the threads and taking in the wealth of information they provide.

While I agree that viewing Nebula / Galaxies without the proper understanding of what you could realistically expect to see would be disappointing, I think that if properly informed, and going in with realistic expectations, the thrill of finding and seeing such an object for yourself is unmatched. True the appearance of some of these objects is little more than a smudge or blur in the scope, but for me anyway, finding that smudge or blur is a greatly rewarding experience. There in front of me are the results of forces of nature I can not fully comprehend, that came to be over time frames and at distances that boggle the imagination, and I found it (with some effort) in my back yard on my scope. I have also found that revisiting these objects under different conditions is a lot of fun because I’m always chasing the better viewing. Maybe tonight is the night I will see just a little bit more than I have previously. As with anything though this is all subject to personal preferences. I can understand how others would not be as interested in these objects when compared to the Moon or planets which are much more clearly resolved when viewing so I can appreciate your sentiments.

[Bazzaar]

Ah Grasshopper, you have made the first step on the the road of wisdom to enlightenment!

Heh!

Joking aside, nice summation.

Regards

Barry

[Nova]

Everyone looking to get into this hobby should read this thread. Esspecially the part about nebula and galaxies not being visible in the same way as in pictures. This for me was the biggest dissapointment when I first started looking into this hobby a few months ago but it didnt dampen my spirits, there is still plenty out there to see. I actually enjoy the tinkering with the mount, scope and all the gadgets almost as much as observing but I have to agree, knowledge of astronomy by reading, looking and hopefully understanding is an essential part of this hobby

[Bart]

I'm new also to this game (Jan). While it would have been fantastic to see colours etc through the lens, its not necessary. People will be enthused about differing aspects of the hobby. Some like the chase and eventual finding of objects, however smudgey, some probably like the gizmos more and justify them by occasionally gazing through them.

In my few months it has been great tracking down the Messiers. I have about 60ish at this point, all in binocs and most through the scope. Some have been relatively underwhelming, some fantastic, never forget the first sighting of M13 through the scope, the Ring nebula was exciting, the leo triplet magic, M11, M8 ah....

I have wondered recently though, that after i manage (if) to get all the Messiers, will I bore and lose interest. Will i go onto the NGC as there are some beauties there? Will i re-experience them all when my wife allows me to satisfy the aperture fever raging within me.

Cant answer these now.

I suppose what I'm saying is different strokes for different folks.

Bart

[DrNeb]

I find the faint fuzzies rather impressive! granted it doesnt look like much, but what you are seeing is the faint watermark of something so vast and so far away.

it boggles my mind.

Sure the planets are easy on the eye, but it's JUST a planet. that tiny cluster of light is soooo much more.

I hope you checked out the ring nebula, as that does pretty much resemble the photos. obviously with only a tinge of colour in the right conditions.

[rowan46]

good post

[Macavity]

I think, knowing what know now, I should've bought something like:

First Light Optics - Celestron NexStar 8SE

Or any other COMPLETE (off the shelf) working system!

Notwithstanding the "journey", I wince at the amount of money I've expended on chasing the unachievable (on moderate budget) via interminable, optimistic experimentation. <G> However, and at the risk of gentle variance, I'd still commend a little BASIC imaging. It can be a fun challenge - Though, in complete honesty, encompassing as many (more?) pitfalls as the (first) above!

[Astro Imp]

What a good summation by the OP.

I feel that too many newcomers set unrealistic goals and are then underwelmed by their experiences. Me I didn't expect to see much in the first place and have enjoyed every minute since getting my scope in January.

Yes it can be be frustrating when you start, there are so many things that you don't know or fully understand but getting everything set up and working properly and then viewing your first planet, DSO, double star and first look at the moon just make me want more.

Pity about the UK weather, but can't do much about that so make the best of it.

[Stu]

I do agree with many of these comments. I've been visual observing for around 11 years now and it has taken patience and persistence to get to the level I am at now, and to see a decent range of objects.

Astronomy is not something to be rushed, in fact rushing through things means that you miss many of the finger details which are out there.

Messiers to me are not something to be collected our ticked off, but something to be savoured. I often find myself looking at the same objects repeatedly, seeing different detail in them each time.

It took me a good couple of years to get going, I bought a 6" Celestron reflector without knowing much about it but I used it for 5 years or more before outgrowing it.

So my view is, take your time and enjoy it, the stars aren't going anywhere.

Cheers

Stu

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk

[Pete Presland]

the classic line up frac,mak and newt sounds like something from a massage parlour

enjoyed reading your review of your progress,but i think i will always be part beginner

[GazofCorra]

Thanks to those who liked my honesty and this post was aimed at the complete beginners as i too myself came into the hobby with little knowledge and great expectations and from reading and viewing i have came to accept that many of the objects we are lucky to be able to view will never look like those in books, this is why i suggested a starting point of lunar/planets etc as these offer the best views you are likely to see and are easy to find and when you consider how far away they are or there place in our solar system it expands the mind and leaves you wanting more, but i think if you came into the hobby and went straight for DSO's like galaxies/nebula then you may be left deflated that is if you can even find them as knowledge of the constellations and an understanding of what they really are is important and so is averted vision.

I found M81 & M82 through my Mak and i was surprised what i actually saw (not much) at first i thought it was a mark on my lens, now i agree some people will be ecstatic and enthralled at looking at another galaxy but for me it was not what i expected and i soon went looking for something else, but each to their own.

I also think that when it comes to Astronomy most of us will always remain a novice as there is so much to learn and grasp, you are a beginner in my book until you get first light and actually find something and know what you are looking at, then you become a novice.

I hope this helps some complete beginners as if they understand the parameters of the hobby and set realistic goals then they have the basis for a long term hobby that is very rewarding.

Clear skies, i wish lol.......

[brantuk]

Good thread Gazof - some very good points made for beginners - the faint fuzzies are mostly an acquired skill/taste

[WayBig]

I've been doing this for 18 months, got 3 scopes, 4 pairs of bins, been through a whole host of eyepieces, am a proto-star whatever thar means, can do 50-75% of the sky at night crossword but still consider myself a beginner.

There's so much more to see and learn, and so many helpful people with much more experience than I.... and here's a great place to start!

[Macavity]

I found M81 & M82 through my Mak and i was surprised what i actually saw (not much) at first i thought it was a mark on my lens, now i agree some people will be ecstatic and enthralled at looking at another galaxy but for me it was not what i expected and i soon went looking for something else, but each to their own.

An important [iMO] point. Being "underwhelmed" should be entirely allowable - And in many areas, besides Astronomy! A personal issue with external galaxies - Even in "observatory class" images, was ever the repeated effort to mentally subtract foreground stars?

Scope limitations may work to advantage - If I can see it well, it must be "good"? LOL. Though I have great hopes re. video imaging. In the interim, there are still many surprises. For me personally, certain planetary nebulae stand out (sic!).

[Beulah]

My first discovered object was M97 - luckily the "smudge" didn't put me off and I am still into the hobby of studying the night sky years later...

[Telrad]

I think regardless of how much I learn and develop my knowledge of astronomy I will always be a beginner. I remember the first time I looked through a scope to see Saturn, even now Saturn fills me with nostalgia and excitement when I view it...

[JohnnyD333]

" 3. Forget Astro-imaging until you are a fairly competent Astronomer."

Understatement of the year. After dabbling in this for a while, I have the utmost respect for those in SGL who put out all these amazing photos.

[Ags]

In the last year I have built up some experience and a fair bit of knowledge, but I'm a beginner every time I try something new. I can drive my SE mount around happily, but don't ask me about collimation or GEM mounts, or photoshop or registax or building a pier (my latest enthusiasm...). I'm pretty sure that even the most experienced people have areas in which they would still feel a little like a beginner. Astronomy is a very wide-ranging hobby after all.

[hellothere123]

someone should make up a "newbie normal questions" post

[obscura]

I tend to disagree with competence in astronomy before imaging. I began in late December 2010 but it was two months + before getting me feet wet and buying kit. This two months were spent reading, researching, asking dumb questions here and with suppliers. The big step forward was being advised here to buy "Making Every Photon Count" from FLO. I speed read the book twice before reading in depth and it continues to be the prime reference book.

During these summer months I am continously setting kit up and driving the software in order that I am completely familiar before the longer nights arrive. This involves all from polar align to imaging with all s/w pumping in and doing their bit.

A few night shots and sun shots without trying to be too clever underlined what I knew but the raft I didn't. But its comimg together.

One thing I am doing is writing my own reference manual on how I do it.

My astronomy background was the normal fascination with up there, taking the OU S282 course and a brief sojourn with an LX 90 some years ago before digital exploded onto the scene. Imaging on film was beyond me at that time.

So, if imaging turns you on, go for it but study, research, read, ask etc etc. It'll save expensive mistakes and disappointment. My kit I believe is a "standard" imaging set up but its working for me. The challenge, in my senior years, is fantastically rewarding. And it keeps me off the streets and out of the wife's way.

[Macavity]

You can always START (imaging) in a modest way. One of many solutions:

Celestron NexImage Solar System Imager | Telescope Accessories | Rother Valley Optics

It's nice to commit SOME of one's experiences to "posterity" ... Well, the internet, anyway!

[JamesM]

Just to add two more considerations to your list. I am still amazed at how many new people still buy kit without ever looking through a telescope first at a star party, astro club etc - does help manage expectations. It follows from this, that a new person will be able to establish a true benchmark as to what all those 'numbers' really mean at the eyepiece which is where it counts and so can be better informed as to what to get or to save for from the outset. Nothing wastes money more than buying and reselling. The other consideration is where you observe from. Getting out of town to a darker site is a hassle but its what I do all the time and it does make a difference in improving contrast and observing that little bit more detail. Even better than both of the above is observing with others, as it enables you to share in both 'disappointments' and the rewards of what you see and where you found it.

There's a lot of sky up there and they don't call it space for nothing, so two heads trying to find stuff is always better than one!

Good thread.

James