IS THIS TELESCOPE TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE???

[wesdon1]

Hi all. So today I found this beast of a 'scope, a 120 triplet apo, which as you all know triplet refractors are very expensive because the glass to make them is so expensive etc! Askar 120 APO Triplet Refractor | First Light Optics

My question is...is £1499 for a 120mm triplet apo just too good to be true?? has anyone had a chance to test this particular 'scope out? They also do a 103mm, a 140mm and even a whopping 185mm aperture version!!?? the 185mm is circa £5k, which is a similar price to sky watchers 150 esprit triplet model. What are peoples thoughts on this 120mm triplets price?? If it's even fairly decent, I would argue it's the bargain of the decade!!

[bosun21]

1 minute ago, wesdon1 said:

Hi all. So today I found this beast of a 'scope, a 120 triplet apo, which as you all know triplet refractors are very expensive because the glass to make them is so expensive etc! Askar 120 APO Triplet Refractor | First Light Optics

My question is...is £1499 for a 120mm triplet apo just too good to be true?? has anyone had a chance to test this particular 'scope out? They also do a 103mm, a 140mm and even a whopping 185mm aperture version!!?? the 185mm is circa £5k, which is a similar price to sky watchers 150 esprit triplet model. What are peoples thoughts on this 120mm triplets price?? If it's even fairly decent, I would argue it's the bargain of the decade!!

There’s a thread discussing all the new Askar triplets.

[Elp]

In future it may be productive to search before making a new thread:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Clarkey]

The 115mm Altair triplet is only £1300 and well proven. Not sure how much difference the extra 5mm will make.

[The60mmKid]

I, for one, demand an investigation.

[Sponcom]

3 hours ago, Elp said:

In future it may be productive to search before making a new thread:

Nice and polite, anyone would think it was a cloudy nights forum.

[vlaiv]

I would not otherwise post this in dedicated threads regarding said scope, but I think I can post it here because of they way thread topic was phrased.

Is it too good to be true? Well - consider this:

You can't really purchase 80mm F/7.5 achromat for less than say 250 euro - but I managed to purchase said lens for 35 euro of AliExpress. I won't go into detail of how much other components cost - except to say that I'm confident that my  DIY scope based on this lens will be less than 100 euro.

Rest is just labor costs and profit margins.

If someone decides to cut down their profit margin from say 100% to 60% - what you get is a bargain scope

 

 

[Peter Drew]

Always a good way to break into a market if you can afford it.  Provided the product is good, and the Askar seems to be considered good, an entry price that is tempting is offered.  Eventually "bargains" become "good value for money" when prices are increased.   🙂

[paulastro]

4 hours ago, wesdon1 said:

Hi all. So today I found this beast of a 'scope, a 120 triplet apo, which as you all know triplet refractors are very expensive because the glass to make them is so expensive etc! Askar 120 APO Triplet Refractor | First Light Optics

My question is...is £1499 for a 120mm triplet apo just too good to be true?? has anyone had a chance to test this particular 'scope out? They also do a 103mm, a 140mm and even a whopping 185mm aperture version!!?? the 185mm is circa £5k, which is a similar price to sky watchers 150 esprit triplet model. What are peoples thoughts on this 120mm triplets price?? If it's even fairly decent, I would argue it's the bargain of the decade!!

I have had the 103 version since November 1st, and before buying it, like yourself wondered how on earth they could make it for the money.  A month and a a half later,  I ask myself the same thing every time I use it.  It's more amazing when you have actually used it and know how good it is.

To save  repeating it here, my review is on FLOs website.

Of course, it doesn't necessarily mean all its relatives are the same quality, but they certainly produced a cracker with the 103.  I would have thought it likely they are made to the same standard. If you want to pm me regarding any aspects of the scope, please feel free to do so.  I've no idea where you are located, but if you are anywhere near West Yorkshire you are welcome to come and check it out for yourself.

The finally factor in my decision was that I knew if I bought it from any of the suppliers who have a long proven record of a very favourable returns policy, then I wasn't risking anything by ordering it. In the event, its turned out to be a very wise purchase 🙂.

 

 

[Elp]

1 hour ago, Sponcom said:

Nice and polite, anyone would think it was a cloudy nights forum.

Wasn't meant to be impolite, apologies if construed as such. As a source of information it's useful to have less threads about the same topic than many with few. From a systems point of view it also uses less storage as a result as anyone whom witnessed the backup taking place earlier this year and the time it took to sort. I've also done it myself duplicating existing threads, easy thing to do.

But I get the excitement, certainly an interesting line of products of which I'm also interested in.

 

[Louis D]

5 hours ago, wesdon1 said:

Hi all. So today I found this beast of a 'scope, a 120 triplet apo, which as you all know triplet refractors are very expensive because the glass to make them is so expensive etc! Askar 120 APO Triplet Refractor | First Light Optics

My question is...is £1499 for a 120mm triplet apo just too good to be true?? has anyone had a chance to test this particular 'scope out? They also do a 103mm, a 140mm and even a whopping 185mm aperture version!!?? the 185mm is circa £5k, which is a similar price to sky watchers 150 esprit triplet model. What are peoples thoughts on this 120mm triplets price?? If it's even fairly decent, I would argue it's the bargain of the decade!!

You're comparing apples to oranges with the Esprit triplet comparison.  It uses FPL-53 equivalent instead of FPL-51 equivalent glass as in the Askar.  The former is considerably more expensive than the latter.  That, and I find the Esprit line priced on the high side for a Chinese made product.  Synta (SW) makes a good product, but so do JOC (ES/Bresser), Sharpstar (Askar and many house brands) and Taiwan's Long Perng (many house brands).

Do your homework and choose the accordingly.

[Mr Spock]

The Askar is meant as an imaging scope and isn't quite corrected as well as others. I've seen a test which shows colour inside and outside of focus, but ok in focus. More or less what you'd expect for FPL-51. It's no doubt very good at what it does.

For visual I'd prefer a doublet and at that price the StellaMira 125mm looks to be the bargain.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellamira-telescopes/stellamira-125mm-ed-doublet-f78-refractor-telescope.html

 

 

[Ags]

I don't understand the issue often reported with scopes showing false color inside or outside of focus. Surely only the focus point counts? The false color inside and outside of focus is just intrinsic to being color-free at focus. If one lens in the lens cell introduces false color that is then corrected by a later lens in the lens group, then there MUST be chromatic aberration out of focus. It might be much less with an FPL53 or fluorite scope, but it must be there to some extent. But - why does it matter? No-one willingly looks at objects out of focus, right?

[The60mmKid]

6 hours ago, Ags said:

I don't understand the issue often reported with scopes showing false color inside or outside of focus. Surely only the focus point counts? The false color inside and outside of focus is just intrinsic to being color-free at focus. If one lens in the lens cell introduces false color that is then corrected by a later lens in the lens group, then there MUST be chromatic aberration out of focus. It might be much less with an FPL53 or fluorite scope, but it must be there to some extent. But - why does it matter? No-one willingly looks at objects out of focus, right?

I only look through a telescope when the spot diagram is unavailable, and then I only look at out-of-focus stars. Otherwise there would be no way to really know whether I'm enjoying it.

[Mr Spock]

10 hours ago, Ags said:

I don't understand the issue often reported with scopes showing false color inside or outside of focus. Surely only the focus point counts?

It shows how well corrected the scope is  Inside/outside focus can also show correction for spherical aberration and other flaws. They are just basic tests.

So, in addition to colour correction, we have:

 

[Highburymark]

Then there’s the pattern which graphics like the above rarely seem to show - clear, consistent rings on one side of focus and a mushy, blur on the other, making any rings difficult to see, which shows spherochromatism, and which the majority of ED doublets display to some degree. 
 

[Peter Drew]

I  think most amateurs would be satisfied with most of the in focus star images shown on that graphic despite the aberrations that caused them.  Good luck with getting seeing conditions good enough to see them like that, specially in apertures above 6".     🙂

[Highburymark]

1 hour ago, Peter Drew said:

I  think most amateurs would be satisfied with most of the in focus star images shown on that graphic despite the aberrations that caused them.  Good luck with getting seeing conditions good enough to see them like that, specially in apertures above 6".     🙂

Agree. I’ve got a 60ED which is very mushy one side of focus in the star test - it’s a cracking little telescope. Nice and sharp with false colour well controlled. It’s why the best star test is in focus, using your own eyes under the night sky.
The Askars look excellent to me. You can see how much attention to detail they’ve put into the package. 

[newbie alert]

On 13/12/2023 at 21:30, Louis D said:

You're comparing apples to oranges with the Esprit triplet comparison.  It uses FPL-53 equivalent instead of FPL-51 equivalent glass as in the Askar.  The former is considerably more expensive than the latter.  That, and I find the Esprit line priced on the high side for a Chinese made product.  Synta (SW) makes a good product, but so do JOC (ES/Bresser), Sharpstar (Askar and many house brands) and Taiwan's Long Perng (many house brands).

Do your homework and choose the accordingly.

 I used to have the same opinion but I've seen a fpl51 glass triplet perform just as well as a fpl53

[Mr Spock]

There's a difference between optics being close to perfection and someone deeming them to be acceptable 

[Nik271]

There is no perfect optics, even the Takahashi triplets like TSA-120 have spot diagrams which are a bit bloated in violet light. Between 450nm and 650nm they are as good as it gets. This Askar triplet seems to be well controlled in visual, not as good as a Tak triplet but I expect  will give the doublets a run for their money at this price. I like that the tube can be shortened to accommodate binoviewers, to visual observers this is a nice bonus.

[Louis D]

8 hours ago, newbie alert said:

 I used to have the same opinion but I've seen a fpl51 glass triplet perform just as well as a fpl53

Where did I say they don't?  I simply said that if you're going to compare triplets based on price (which is what the OP seemed to do), make sure they are both using the same grade of glass.  After that, price difference comes down to quality of the lens figuring/polish/coatings/etc., tube mechanicals (focuser, lens cell, baffling, etc.), labor costs, factory profit margins, middleman markups, dealer markups, differing import tariffs, etc.

[vlaiv]

5 minutes ago, Louis D said:

After that, price difference comes down to quality of the lens figuring/polish/coatings/etc

I think that days of hand figuring are long gone. It is all done by machines and I don't think that quality of figure is related to time anymore.

It can be related to what particular machine can achieve, but I'm certain that it takes same amount of time (so huge part of cost of making item - except for the cost of material) to do different quality lenses.

[wesdon1]

On 13/12/2023 at 15:42, bosun21 said:

There’s a thread discussing all the new Askar triplets.

 

On 13/12/2023 at 16:01, Elp said:

In future it may be productive to search before making a new thread:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

@bosun21 LOL I sensed a bit of "you telling me off for wasting time writing a thread about something that's already been discussed" ?? Haha! Joking aside, it did kinda offend me, but I do understand what you were trying to tell me! So absolutely no hard feelings my friend!

Kind Regards, Wes.

Edited December 18, 2023 by wesdon1
missed a bit

[wesdon1]

On 13/12/2023 at 17:47, The60mmKid said:

I, for one, demand an investigation.

@The60mmKid haha I liked this reply! Thanks mate!😂👍