Takahashi doublet refractor for observing.

[Guest]

I have owned several refractor telescopes with FPL 53 objective. They gave very good views of planets and other objects. I understand that Takahashi refractors would give better views. Although I have never owned one. My question is based on me owning just one high quality and light weight refractor. I did lift a Takahashi up once and was amazed at how light it was. As it would be used for visual observing, a 100 mm F7 doublet objective would fit the requirement. Is there such an instrument? 

If so what do owners think 🤔 of them. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by Guest
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[paulastro]

The Takahashi 100DC and DF are 100 mm aperture and 740mm focal length, one element fluorite.  They are superb, in my view you wont get better for visual observing.  And yes, they are better than FPL53 objectives.  I have used SW ED doublet refractors with FPL53 for years and they  are excellent too - but not as good as Tak. Having said that they are not too far behind.  I currently use two of the SW doublets and am very happy with them.  But I have used the Taks too, if the price is no object and you want the best, buy one of the Taks, you can see the difference.  If you're on a budget buy one of the SW FPL 53s, you'll still have a great refractor.  I've not mentioned FPL triplets as I much prefer doublets for visual myself.

 

Edited April 24, 2020 by paulastro

[John]

Can't speak highly enough of my 100mm Tak doublet - mine is the F/9 version but the F/7.4 and F/8's are really superb as well.

I still have my ED120 Skywatcher though and that is also a cracking scope. The 100mm Tak gets mighty close to it in performance though - closer than it ought really for a 20mm aperture difference

If you have followed any of the threads highlighting what the owners of these scopes think of them over the past 5 years you will see that the praise is fulsome. Having owned one myself for nearly 4 years now, I know why 

I tried to describe the differences between my Tak 100 and my (also excellent) Vixen ED102 SS on another forum and came up with this:

"Over the past couple of clear nights I've had both my 15 year old Vixen ED102SS F/6.5 and my new Tak FC100DL F/9 on the same mount to compare them. The targets have been Jupiter, Mars, Saturn, the Moon and some tightish double stars. This post is just a summary rather than anything in-depth on the scopes though.

While the Tak showed no CA whatsoever on anything whether in or out of focus, the Vixen did pretty well and just showed a very small splash of CA around Vega. No CA around the lunar limb, and the planets at focus and the usual ed doublet CA traces showing in the intra and extra focal image.

The star test on the Tak was pretty much identical inside and outside focus and textbook at focus. The Vixen again does quite nicely but the 1st diffraction ring is a little brighter than ideal and certainly brighter than the Tak's. Tight, uneven brightness, double stars are easier to split with the Tak because of this I think.

Both scopes showed more or less similar detail and contrast on the planets but I was conscious of having to look harder to find it with the Vixen and, as the magnification exceeded 200x the image in the Tak remained sharp and well composed while the Vixen started to lag a little. The Tak handles 200x plus pretty much as well as my (rather good) ED120 does with just slightly dimmer images. 257x and even 300x make you forget sometimes that you just have 3.9" of aperture to play with !

So the Tak FC100DL outperformed the Vixen ED102SS by a small but noticeable margin on these nights at least. The Vixen is still a lovely little refractor IMHO and it's wide field capability combined with pretty decent high power viewing will keep it in my possession  

The Tak FC100DL is my 1st Tak and my 1st refractor with a fluorite lens element and I can now understand what the owners of similar Tak models and the Vixen FL's are so enthusiastic about"

The Vixen has very similar performance to the Skywatcher ED100 which I owned before getting the Vixen.

[mikeDnight]

I believe that if you're going to own just one telescope, then why not make it the best you can afford? Ive owned some very nice large refractors, but the larger they get, the less I want to use them. When I bought a Tak FC100DC in early 2015 the darn thing nearly burned me out. Every opportunity I had I was out with my scope. Since then I've made literally hundreds of observational sketches and seen things I wouldn't have believed a 4" scope could show. It is sharp and has great contrast and definition. On nights when the seeing is steady I can use powers in excess of 400X on some targets. Essentially identical star images either side of focus as John says, and perfect Airy disc's. Jupiter is vibrant and Mars reveals a wealth of subtle detail. The Moon is laser etched. On one occasion while drifting over the Appenine mountains at 474X my stomach rolled as I felt like I was falling over the stark, almost 3D cliff face. Binary stars are simply awesome showing wonderful contrasting colours. And Deep sky on a transparent night and with good dark adaption appears surprisingly bright. The faintest object I've seen so far in the 100mm has been IC434 which extends from Alnitak and contains the Horse Head, though the HH appeared as only a vague dark notch with averted vision.

Takahashi currently offer three 100mm fluorite doublets, that are light weight and have exquisite optics. These are the FC100DC,  FC100DF and the FC100DZ.  Their reputation for offering some of the best optics currently available are well deserved, and they are readily available, so no inordinately long wait.  They don't need a hefty mount and so make a great g&g option. An AZ4 or Vixen GP will carry them well.

A F9 FC100DL alongside a F7.4 FC100DC,  both on SW AZ4  mounts.

And the new F8 FC100DZ  with retractable dew shield

Edited April 24, 2020 by mikeDnight

[paulastro]

So, it would be true to say you liked your Tak Mike?  😄

[mikeDnight]

14 hours ago, paulastro said:

So, it would be true to say you liked your Tak Mike?  😄

Very subtle Paul, and very true. And there is a thin green UPS tracking line snailing its way across the country to my house as I type.  

Edited April 25, 2020 by mikeDnight

[John]

DZ, DZ, DZ ........

[Alan White]

Or a Skywatcher vixen rail, that’s green? 😂

[jock1958]

Bought my Tak FC 100DL two years ago after reading some excellent reviews on the net and this forum...thanks guys for lightening my wallet!  

I was looking for a 4" refractor that would see me well into retirement with brilliant optics, lightweight and beautifully engineered, needless to say I haven't been disappointed!

The only thing I added was a feather-touch focuser which was more of an extravagance than a necessity, but must admit I enjoy the ability to eke out that extra little bit of performance.

[mikeDnight]

1 hour ago, John said:

DZ, DZ, DZ ........

I know I must have said a hundred times that I'd never part with my DC. And watching it go was quite literally heart wrenching as I loved it so much. Over the last five years I've had at least two opportunities to buy a DL,  but I couldn't part with the DC. However, in February, after reading a partial review on the DZ claiming its images are ice cold, I found myself in a moment of insanity placing an order with TruTek Astro. I'm lucky I placed the order when I did because I got the scope before the price increase. And Nick was the cheapest at the time anyway. The DZ arrives on Monday so prepare for yet another unboxing.  To be honest, I don't know what I will gain by this insane and costly change, as the DC was as near to being as perfect as perfect gets visually. Having said that, the DL gave a cooler view which I found appealing, so the DZ which is reportedly even cooler than the DL, should be nice. If the DZ allows me to use my 1.6mm HR to form a perfect star image at the zenith at 500X, I'll be in heaven. 

[Stu]

4 minutes ago, mikeDnight said:

I know I must have said a hundred times that I'd never part with my DC. And watching it go was quite literally heart wrenching as I loved it so much. Over the last five years I've had at least two opportunities to buy a DL,  but I couldn't part with the DC. However, in February, after reading a partial review on the DZ claiming its images are ice cold, I found myself in a moment of insanity placing an order with TruTek Astro. I'm lucky I placed the order when I did because I got the scope before the price increase. And Nick was the cheapest at the time anyway. The DZ arrives on Monday so prepare for yet another unboxing.  To be honest, I don't know what I will gain by this insane and costly change, as the DC was as near to being as perfect as perfect gets visually. Having said that, the DL gave a cooler view which I found appealing, so the DZ which is reportedly even cooler than the DL, should be nice. If the DZ allows me to use my 1.6mm HR to form a perfect star image at the zenith at 500X, I'll be in heaven. 

Gosh I didn’t know the DC had gone Mike! Shame not to be able to compare them, but am sure the DZ will be everything you hope for. My DC won’t be going anywhere, and like @jock1958 I enjoy the benefit of a feathertouch focuser, it really does help nail the focus.

[vineyard]

Is there an emoji for green with envy?  Enjoy!

 

PS - looking fwd to seeing the sketches that come from that!

Edited April 25, 2020 by vineyard

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, vineyard said:

Is there an emoji for green with envy?  Enjoy!

 

PS - looking fwd to seeing the sketches that come from that!

Like this? 

[paulastro]

Lets  hope that the DZ performs better than your excellent DC did - it will take some doing.   I can see you getting anxious if a few weeks go by with no good seeing and the DZ hasn't yet matched the DC at it's best.

Anyway Mike, we're good friends and you can always rely on me for words of support and encouragement whilst waiting for a top night to come along for the DZ to strut its stuff.  And, being the good pal I am, I'll be happy to take the DZ off your hands (  at a bargain price of course! ) if you get fed up waiting.  🤣

[JeremyS]

I'm sure this will prove to be an absolute stunner @mikeDnight. From what I've heard, those Tak DZ's are about as close to optical perfection as it's possible to get. The fluorite and superb Tak craftsmanship will undoubtedly deliver wonders. I suspect this one really will be a keeper - after all I don't think there is anywhere further to progress in a 4-inch telescope!

And you're already well positioned to extract that last detail from it with your complete set of Vixen HR's. The 1.6 mm will be wonderful on nights of good seeing.

[omo]

Have any of you used a focal extender on the FC series Taks, how do they perform then?

[F15Rules]

3 hours ago, mikeDnight said:

Very subtle Paul, and very true. And there is a thin green UPS tracking line snailing its way across the country to my house as I type.  

Aahh..that does explain a few things recently...😊 Congratulations!!

Dave

Edited April 25, 2020 by F15Rules

[mikeDnight]

26 minutes ago, omo said:

Have any of you used a focal extender on the FC series Taks, how do they perform then?

Yes!  I bought a 1.6 extender-Q for my DC which took it from F7.4 upto F11.8. It was absolutely stunning, giving pure high power views with superb definition and zero false colour. 

Edited April 25, 2020 by mikeDnight

[omo]

22 minutes ago, mikeDnight said:

Yes!  I bought a 1.6 extender-Q for my DC which took it from F7.4 upto F11.8. It was absolutely stunning, giving pure high power views with superb definition and zero false colour. 

Thought it would be good, thank you Mike, now you can try it with the DZ too . I hope you enjoy that more than you did the DC 👍

[mikeDnight]

1 hour ago, omo said:

Thought it would be good, thank you Mike, now you can try it with the DZ too . I hope you enjoy that more than you did the DC 👍

I'm not sure I could!  The DZ systems chart shows a different 1.6 extender Q. 

To be honest, I eventually just used the DC at its native F7.4, as the images were exquisite.

[Highburymark]

Martin - if you’re thinking of buying an FC-100 and value ergonomics, the DC is the lightest of the bunch at 2.8kg. It’s astonishingly easy to carry around and mount, which for me are primary considerations. The DL is slower as John mentions, and is perhaps the ultimate lunar/planetary choice, and at F/8 the DZ is in the middle - but it’s the only FC with a sliding dew shield - which is the one feature lacking from my DC that I’d love to have. 
If you trawl the SGL archives, you might just find the odd thread discussing the charms of the FC-100s.....

[mikeDnight]

On 24/04/2020 at 17:19, Grumpy Martian said:

I have owned several refractor telescopes with FPL 53 objective. They gave very good views of planets and other objects. I understand that Takahashi refractors would give better views. Although I have never owned one. My question is based on me owning just one high quality and light weight refractor. I did lift a Takahashi up once and was amazed at how light it was. As it would be used for visual observing, a 100 mm F7 doublet objective would fit the requirement. Is there such an instrument? 

If so what do owners think 🤔 of them. 

I'm betting you wished you hadn't asked? ☺

[andrew s]

Will you lot stop drooling over Takahashi refractors your dissolving my tablet.

Regards Andrew 

Edited April 25, 2020 by andrew s

[mikeDnight]

I've been finding solace in the fact I've still got a Tak at my fingertips. It was actually perfect for observing Venus in the Pleiades a short time ago. And, after taking this pic', I realized there was a chocolate bar on the top of my books that I'd confiscated off one of my son's last October.  It tasted like it was from last October too! 

[JeremyS]

4 minutes ago, mikeDnight said:

I've been finding solace in the fact I've still got a Tak at my fingertips.

Optical perfection in a finderscope. A jewel in the Tak crown 🙂

You'll have to save that mars bar for opposition.