New guy, old skies.

[Froobyone]

Hello fellow gazers.

I just joined the forum after finding a post during some astro-google'ing (it's cloudy) (of course) and I wanted to introduce myself before unleashing the gattling gun of questions I'll probably ask in time.

So here is my CV, it's a lighthearted summary of my experiences so far, just as I'm about to embark on the next part of the journey.

A Long time ago, in a galaxy far far away... (Well, 4 years ago, actualy, in a galaxy quite close, being that we're in it)

I got my first scope exactly four years ago, for my birthday.

My adult interest in the sky came about one chilly december night in 2004, I'd seen a television program that has stated that you could see the Int Space Station crossing the sky and that, furthermore, there was an internet site that showed you where it was, at any given time. Not only that, but the site also showed the tracks of tons of other things, like satalites and iridium flares, most of you will know the site to which I refer, but I'm not sure about posting rules so won't post the link just in case.

So, armed with a pair of 50x30 binoculars I headed for the garden at the next crossing and sure enough, there it was. There was no discernable detail, but it was where it was supposed to be and was moving at the correct rate so what else could it be? I was elated, I'd made my first astronomical sighting and I loved it. It was dusk and a few stars where begining to twinkle through the twilight. I trained the binos on them and suddenly, I was out there, in space, hundreds of stars lept into view,more than I could ever hope to see the with my naked eye. I scanned the sky feverishly, seeing sights I had previously never seen. I felt privileged, like the universe was putting a show on, for me alone in my garden.

Now binoculars are great for a quick scan of the heavens, but they don't half make your arms hurt holding them up for extended periods. Luckily, they had a mount hole in the bottom and with a bit of lateral thinking and a bit of swearing I managed to couple them to a camera tripod.

Much better, steady views, no arm ache, but now it's neck ache. Grrrrrr.

Oh well, I've got the greatest show in existence at my fingertips, I can handle a bit of neckache. So a few clear wintry nights later I've leaned a few things. Mainly about jumpers, gloves and that fact that you lose a million percent of your bodyheat, through your head. (also learned that looking a complete Benny in a hat is better than your ears faling off).

I'm enjoying myself immensly, things couldn't be better, thinks I. I'm addicted to standing the the freezing cold staring at the sky through bonos.

I find myself looking the south east late one night (or early one morning, depending on perspective) and I see a very bright star, seems brighter than the others. I check lenses for condensation, but they are clear. So I look again, try to re-focus, but it doesn't seem to want to focus, weird, the stars next to it are pretty well focused. Keep staring.....keep staring....It's almost as if it's not round..........almost oval.............

My heart skips a beat, I step back, no, it couldn't be, could it?

I look again, my brain, working on it's own, thinks it knows what it is and decides to help me resolve the image a little.

Part of me is saying, no way, that's not possbile your eyes are playing tricks and the other part is saying, keep looking, concentrate, it'll be worth it; and so with increasing excitement I stare and stare. The seeing gives me just enough clarity, just for a few seconds.

And then I know, without a doubt, what it is I'm loooking at, I get a funny feeling in my stomach and my eyes go a bit runny.

I've just seen Saturn for the very first time!

It was nothing more than a fuzzy out of shape dot, but it was Saturn. I cannot easily put into words how that moment felt, elation, wonder, pride (because I'd found it and correctly identified it)

I ran into the house and practicaly jumping up and down, fired up the planetarium software to double check my findings. Sure enough, it showed Saturn right where I'd been looking. With much glee and boundiness I announced this great news to my girlfriend (who was asleep at the time, it was 2:30am). The news wasn't met with the enthusiasm I thought it desrved...

The following evening I tried to show her what I'd seen and though I struggled to find it at first, due to it being much earlier in the evening and me having no clue what was where. She couldn't make out the shape, which I now know was to be expected, at the time I didn't realise that the eye learns to see, and it takes time. I had acidentally discovered "averted viewing" the previous evening, but I was actually naive enough to think that this was because my own eyes were faulty LOL!

I instead wowed her with never before seen views of the moon. She was suitably impressed.

A few days later, one of my biker mates (yeah, I ride bikes too) came round for a coffee (we had run out of bats blood), I was regailing him on my recent saturn experience and the subject of binos/scopes came up, I've got my dads old spotting scope if you want to borrow it, he said.

Yes PLEASE!, said I.

Ooooo, now I've got a scope, can I call myself an amatuer astronomer yet? I decide not.

The next clear night, the scope is on the tripod and my binos look sadly on, from the top of the fridge. (The sure sign of an objects "don't need you any moreness" is it's placement on top of a tall fridge. It's a universal law).

My first port of call? you guessed it. I aim the small scope at Saturn and quickly realise I can't aim a scope with an angled eyepeice! It takes me nearly 10 mins to finally find it, but at least it's given my eyes some "dark" time. The scope in question had a zoom. I forget the actual specs, but it was a terrestrial bird watching scope, about 60mm I think. So once I'd found the planet I moved the zoom ring to it's max setting and looked again.

If I'd thought the first time I saw Saturn was exciting then the moment the actual rings resolved themselves to me was possibly one of the most memorable moments of my life! This wasn't a funny shaped spludge of light, this was a ringed planet! This was actualy Saturn, live!

More tears in the eyes I'm afraid, quite emotional for me, this star gazing lark. (well, I was only 34 at the time).

And I could finally share my find with my girlfriend, my step daughter, my friends, the postman, people innocently walking by. I just couldn't show enough people, I felt like a prophet, bringing the universe into peoples lives.

Oh dear, now I've got a taste for it. Was it time to buy a telescope?

I'd obviously wanted one since I was a child, doesn't eveyone? I was constantly looking at the stars when I was young. Although to be honest, for a long time it was to see if I could see any space ships from Star Wars, which is real, obviously. Then as a teen I had enough basic knowledge of the naked eye sky to be able to show off to girls. Very important as a teen. Although no one saw fit to tell me teenage girls don't give a stuff about Orion or the Plough.

The thing that had always prevented me from getting a scope so far, was the percieved huge cost. I knew I was never going to be happy with a department store purchase as I knew enough about optics to know that they mattered! The alternative, as far as I knew, ran into several hundreds of pounds, money that I simply couldn't justify spending.

So I'd never looked at the price of scopes, until I was much much older.

It was only after my saturn experince that I did a bit of research on the net, and realised that it was possible to get something usable for a couple of hundred pounds...

...and with my birthday coming up 2 months later, I started my campaign of deep wishfull sighs, "oooo, look at this...isn't that cheap...." *Insert lovable rogue smile* and other underhand hint tactics. My lovely and evermore understanding girlfriend is very used to this and knows how to play the game.

Once that particular battle had been won and I had been given a 200 pound budget, it was then time to look for a scope (and of course try to up the £200 pound budget to say, £250). I wouldn't want Newton spinning in his grave because I missed out on potential mm's in aperture.

Then I found my scope, I knew it as soon as I saw her, sleek, silver, lights that flashed, the words "computerised GOTO control". That'll do for me I thought. (also perfectly on the £250 borderline). So, a few more sighs later I got the "oh, go on then, but that's it, that's all you're getting". *Insert broan grin and butterflies in stomach*

Now, I'm a pretty impulsive guy, if i decide I want something, then I want it to be delivered yesterday, before 9. I hate having to wait for things, especially presents.

I ring the dealer, make my purchase, pretend that I know what I'm talking about. Job done.

Wohoo!

Oh, but there's a problem A BIG PROBLEM, it's now midway through january and the scope has been ordered and dispatched.

My birthday isn't for weeks!

It's due to arrive the 2 days after it was ordered and now I have to spend the next few days worrying that I've made a big mistake and the scope I've bought is the size of a toilet roll tube!

Reading reviews of the scope you've already bought is a double edged sword. I believe the correct method is to READ REVIEWS FIRST! Oh well.

Most reviews say it's good, good enough for me anyway. It's due to arrive the next day.

Due to my girlfriends mistrust of me and my abilty to accidentaly open things, she took the day off work so she could shepard the new arrival into a safe and secure storage location.

I spent the day at the window, fretting like an expectant father and listening for medium sized vans to come down the street. For some annoying reason, it was "Medium sized vans going down the street day" that day. I think it's annual, just bad timing I guess. Eventually a meduim sized van of suitable van lettering (not Bob's Carpets, for example) pulled up outside the house. Heartbeat starts to race, it's here!

I'm actually going to own a proper telescope. (I thought it was proper, stop mocking me, haha). A small box appears out the back of the van, my heart sinks. I think oh my god, if it's that small, it's going to be worse that the spotting scope. My girlfriend answers the door, I can't do it due to excitement and now, slowly rising fear.

"Two parcels for you love, this small one and a big one, I'll just go and fetch it".

Never in the field of human courier deliveries have so few words meant so much.

She reappears with a much more respectable sized box. Yes, size does matter, anyone who says different probably isn't showing anyone theirs.

Papers are signed, thanks are given, doors are shut and the whining begins.

My poor girlfriend has to put up with about 4 weeks of me and my puppy dog eyes.

I tried every tactic at my disposal, from the classic and well used "I should check if it's all there, I'd hate to open it on my birthday and find an important piece missing". Also tried "I should get the manual out of the box, so I can learn how to use it...I'd hate to open it on my birthday to find that I can't use it". She was rock solid, not even bending on the manual. I even resorted to "What if i get run over tomorrow and killed and I'll never even get to see my scope...." To which I was told, if I mentioned the scope again, it would go on ebay.

Sigh

Patience, they say, is a virtue.

Wrong, patience is having someting better to do while you wait.

The weeks dragged by, my unweilding girlfriend didn't weild. The eve of my birthday arrived and at 0.00am (it's officially my birthday, that's the law). The box was opened. There she lay, my first astronomical telescope.

Celestron 114mm 4.5 inch Reflector on a Nextar GoTo alt/az mount.

And for the first time in history, a new scope was unboxed and the sky stayed clear.

You know full well what I was going to look at first.

Hmm, if only it was as easy as point and look. Polar alignment? You mean the telescope doesn't know where it is in the world? Oh, I had so much to learn.

After at least an hour of trying to align it, I gave up and just slewed to saturn using the finder scope.

I picked the biggest mag eyepice i had and popped it in.

Hello Saturn my old friend, I've come to gawp at you again.

Hello Cassini Division, hello moons, hello surface cloud patterns. Holy Rubbish, that's an actual planet!

I think it may be the greatest thing I've ever seen with my own eyes.

Now can I say I'm an Amatuer Astronomer?

Right, let's find Jupiter. Wow! I can see the bands of clouds! Had it have been present, I'd have seen the red spot too, but it wasn't and I didn't.

Next I wanted to see a Nebula, Orion is high in the sky so it's the obvious choice. It is here that I have my first dissapointment. I can see the nebula, but it's just about monochrome. S'funny, I think, I'm sure it's supposed to be colourfull. Of course my research reveals that that is to be expected and I learn a lot about cones and rods and how poor the eye is at seeing this stuff.

Aha, thinks I, I can sort that right out. Photography!

So like an idiot, I go out and buy a Canon 300D and the bits needed to mate it to my scope. Oh the folly of naivity.

Didn't occur to me that an alt/az mount can't really take pictures. So I spent a long time trying to get something, anything to show for my efforts and expenditure. I managed, more through fluke than skill, to get a fuzzy bluish smudge of Orion's Nebula. I was actualy perversly proud of it.

It was rubbish.

After a lot more reading online, I came to the realisation that to take photos I needed an EQ mount and really, one with tracking motors. This put the photographic dream out of reach of my meagre budget. But hey, I got a nice DSLR to shoot other terrestrial stuff, so it's not all bad.

2236 Pics of the dog later.......

I kept myself happy with viewing the planets, the moon and DSOs (deeply smudged objects)

As winter turned to spring and the skies got lighter and the seeing got worse, the scope came out less and less. During the summer months, fine clear nights meant time out on the bike and being too drained afterwards to bother with the scope. Plus, the summer sky didn't really hold much interest to me.

Summer waned and autumn came along and stole all the leaves. There's something about a crisp dark night that just begs you to spend a few hours in the garden looking skyward. One thing that I'd really wanted to do, in fact one of the main motivations for getting a scope in the first place, was seeing Andromeda. I was aware that it was observable with the naked eye from dark sites as I'd spied it whilst on holiday on the Norfolk Broads.

With this in mind, I started my hunt. I'd long since given up on aligning the Nextar, so I was manualy searching. After probably a week or so of clearish nights, I finally zeroed in and was again dissapointed to find an elongated smudge.

Disheartened, the scope was put into semi retirement. In that it was put away in such a way that it wasn't easily accesable, when the clouds broke and got used less and less. It still hadn't gone into the wilderness that is the "spare bedroom", but the binos were looking smug.

A couple of years passed and the desire to see DSOs hadn't lessened. So I decided to check ebay for scopes with larger apertures.

This is where I learnt a valuable lesson, a cheap scope will be just that, a cheap scope. I foolishly bought a very cheap 200mm Newtonian on an EQ mount. It was terrible, awfull image quality, bad mount. It was that bad, I daren't even tell the girlfriend how bad it was. But at least it made me appreciate the little 114mm Celestron again.

Well, two more years have passed and I find myself in a new job with a much healthier salary. I can finally buy something that will satiate both my desire for good views but also the holy grail, astrophotography.

I have just about worked out the setup that I'm going to get, barring a few questions, but I believe one should introduce oneself to a forum before tapping the knowledge.

So there it is, my introduction. Sorry it was long, but I thought you should know everything.

Thanks for reading

Dan

[barkis]

Hi. Dan, and welcome to SGL.

Please, you didn't need to apologise for you Intro, it was both interesting and amusing.

Welcome to the wonderful world of amateur astronomy.

Acquiring your first ever telescope is a very exciting, but fraught time. You do worry about have I done the right thing. Of course you do believe you have.

One thing you became aware of very quickly, is aperture fever can strike very early. It's a fundamental requirement being stricken with it, we all have at some time.

Anyway, I hope you settle in here, and any questions you have, just ask away. This is probably the friendliest forum you could hope for, and a wealth of knowledge and talent reside here. They are all eager to help when required.

Enjoy yourself.

Ron.

[thing]

Hi Dan, welcome to SGL, fire away with the questions. :salute: By the way, that has to be the longest first post ever

[Zaphod_B]

Hello Dan and welcome to the forum

As thing said, a very entertaining (and long) first post. So how have things progressed - have you sold the crappy eBay scope yet and do you still have your trusty Celestron?

I briefly had a Celestron NexStar 130 SLT (a long-ish, heavy-ish Newtonian reflector) and I had problems using the SkyAlign software - turns out that there was a fault in the azimuth drive.

However, I did learn a few things which may be of help here.

1) The GoTo scopes are VERY sensitive to voltage drops. I presume that you were using batteries rather than a mains power supply or car-battery (aka Power Tank)? If you were using batteries therin may lie your problem, especially if you decide to use rechargeable NiMH's (only 1.2V per cell) rather than 1.5V Alkaline cells (Duracells)!

With 8 of these powering the scope you get only 9.6V instead of 12V and even fresh alkalines can drop sufficiently after alignment to throw the GoTo off.

2) Most people use the 2-star alignment rather than the default 3-star alignment method and have better success

3) You WERE using the AMERICAN DATE FORMAT (i.e. MM-DD-YY) and not our date format (DD-MM-YY)? The software expects the American format (why the Yanks EXPECT everyone to follow their stupid date convention is beyond me. Why couldn't Celestron have given the option to have MM-DD-YY or DD-MM-YY in the scope setup?? - :scratch: )

The first time I tried to align my scope it was on the 3rd October this year and the Moon and Jupiter were clearly visible. The scope said it had aligned successfully (on about the 3rd try), but wouldn't slew to either the Moon or Jupiter! Puzzled, I went indoors with a sad face and checked the manual (yes, if all else fails, read the manual) and spotted that because of the date format thing, the scope thought it was the 10th March :laughing2:

4) You need to choose alignment stars that are in different parts of the sky (about 90 deg apart is best) and not too high or near the horizon.

and finally . . .

5) Approach every target star from BELOW and the LEFT (ie the scope should be moving UPWARDS and RIGHT). It's some quirk of the software (apparantly).

Try these out if you still have the Celestron 114 and let us know how you get on.

Once a GoTo is aligned properly, there is a certain magic (well for me anyway) to see the scope automatically slewing to your chosen object!

I now have a Meade ETX-105 and that works faultlessly (touches wooden head quickly)!

Anyway, as I said at the top, a warm welcome to SGL.

Zaph

[Casus belli]

Big welcome to SGL Dan. I cant wait for your first real report, if its half as good as your introduction it will be some read.

Feel free to ask any questions, the folks on here are very friendly and very helpful.

[Ferox]

Welcome to SGL Dan.

Loved the introduction.

[Talitha]

Hi and welcome to SGL, Dan.

[timetraveller]

hello Dan and a very warm welcome to stargazers hope your stay here will be both happy and productive and just start firing off those questions there are some truly friendly and very knowledgeable people on here.

And may i congratulate you on the longest first post in the welcome section I have ever seen could be up for a world record there

but seriously come on in kick off your shoes and relax

best wishes Pete

[Doc]

Wow Dan I'm surprised your hand didn't drop off from writing all that.

But it was a great read. I also started off with a spotting scope a Kowa if I remember right.

Welcome to SGL and any short questions just fire away.

[Sam]

Welcome to SGL Dan, what a very interesting and enjoyable first post!

[lunator]

Hello Dan

Welcome to SGL

Rgds

Ian

[mike.brightmore]

Hi Dan

really enjoyed the read - having been down most of those paths myself. Don't give up on the binos though. Truth is you could have got some half decent photos with your original set-up and the DSLR (and still could) by stacking short exposures. You would need to sort out SkyAlign first though. Why not give it a go? Welcome to SGL, stick with it and you'll get all the information and motivation you need.

Mike

[Froobyone]

Hi

Thank you all for the warm welcome and the advice.

I have read some fantastic posts on here already and armed with this information, I have today purchased my new equipment from David Hinds, who were also the provider of my Nextar and I had found them to be really nice to deal with. Plus, I took advantage of the 0% finance deal, which I couldn't find anywhere else.

I will post my new purchases in another thread as this one is more about introductions.

Again, thank you for the warm welcome, I look forward to the Stargazers Lounge being a much visited place over the coming years.

Dan

Inside every old person, is a young person wondering what happened.

[glowjet]

Hello Dan

Welcome to SGL, loved your intro and I shall now look forward to your future postings on what your setup is going to be, I am hoping to delve into the mysteries of Astrophotography, but financial constraints are taking thier toll at the moment.

Best wishes John.

[scotastro]

Great post there Dan, welcome to SGL

I'm sure most of us have had similar learning experiences, both exciting (seeing Saturn or Jupiter for the first time) and disheartening.

I know the ebay 200mm scope you mentioned, don't know where the mirror come from but it should be in a fun park hall of mirrors it distorts so well. Though the scope is impossible to get it to work the mount can be kicked into half decent shape.

Mike

[Jeff RV]

Hi Dan & welcome to SGL.

Love the long intro, off to find new scope review now!

Jeff.

[gary1968]

Hi Dan and welcome to SGL..... :-D . Your intro was a very interesting and amusing read... It reminded me how I came into this hobby 3 or 4 years ago. 3 mounts and 6 scopes later I have the set up I should have bought in the 1st place.... lol. My wife too is very understanding and puts up with my whims etc, astroo cameras now being the whim... ;-)

Cheers,

Gary.

BTW, I too am into bikes, when the summer come the scopes go away and the bike come out. Whats your bike mate? I have a 1200 Bandit.

[ron.s.g]

Hi Dan and welcome,

great intro, and just like the rest of us (must have it now),

do you still use the binos for quick looks?.

regards ron.s.g

[phillc]

Hello Dan and a warm welcome to SGL

Merry Christmas

phillc :wave:

[ash]

Welcome to SGL Dan :wave:

Excellent intro

Andy

[centroid]

Hi Dan, and welcome to SGL.

Fascinating intro, and a story that almost certainly has the 'dejavu' factor for many people on this forum.

You couldn't have arrived on a better forum than this one, so enjoy!!

Dave

[Froobyone]

Hello all and again thanks for the warm welcome.

I'll answer a couple of the questions.

ron.s.g: Yes, the binos do still come out now and again, sometimes you just need to see Pleiades.

gary1968: I've currently got an 2007 R1, it's an awsome peice of kit that, these days, never gets the thrashing it desires. Think I only managed 1300 miles in her first year. Only get her out on blue sky days now, so she'll be garaged till spring now.

At least I've got something as equally has cool to do while I wait.

I look forward to my time here.

Dan

Inside every old person, is a young person wondering what happened.

[Stephen Green]

Hi Dan welcome to the SGL :sunny: :sunny:

Stephen