Got problems with new floodlights?

[JOC]

This is a did you know..................

Did you know that if a factory or other location installs a set of big permanent floodlights that they need planning permission to do so?  If new floodlights are reported and the location is found not to have planning then a planning enforcement action can be bought to bear on the offending location.  If the location tries to put in a retrospective planning application then this is the point when you can object.  I've posted just in case this information is useful to someone in the UK.

[DAVE AMENDALL]

Interesting. Light pollution has very strict laws which are rarely enforced. What about the local leisure centre with their floodlight sports areas. Beyond reproach.Sport comes first. You cannot object. Gloomy thought...............Dave

[JOC]

If they are in violation of local planning regs - i.e. have put them up without requesting planning permission anyone can report the planning violation and force an application to be made - at which point opposition arguments are given a chance to be heard.  The important thing to know is that the erection of floodlights requires planning and not all people/firms/organisations are aware of this.  If someone just slings up a few floodlights, esp. without due regard to their neighbours (near or more distant), they need planning permission to do so (even if there aren't any adverse effects) and they may not have it.  At the very least a complaint will force an application to be made and give all aspects of the proposal a chance to be considered. 

[mikeDnight]

22 hours ago, JOC said:

This is a did you know..................

Did you know that if a factory or other location installs a set of big permanent floodlights that they need planning permission to do so?  If new floodlights are reported and the location is found not to have planning then a planning enforcement action can be bought to bear on the offending location.  If the location tries to put in a retrospective planning application then this is the point when you can object.  I've posted just in case this information is useful to someone in the UK.

I have a recreation area near to me which during the darker months is flood lit. A couple of years ago I contacted a local councillor to complain about the lighting affecting my hobby and to ask if the lights could be shielded. Within 24hrs the offending lights had been disconnected while the lights aimed away from me were still lit and didn't impact on my observing.

A couple of weeks ago, someone came to service all the light on the recreation ground, and sure enough, the offending flood lighting was switched back on and aimed at me. I again contacted the same councillor, and again within a very short time the offending lighting was switched off.

Contacting the streetlighting department proved fruitless, as did trying to contact the park's department,  as each denied responsibility. Reasoning politely with a local councillor may prove to be the simplest way to resolve intrusive lighting issues.

I can now again see the milkyway from my front doorstep! ???

Mike

[JeremyS]

19 minutes ago, mikeDnight said:

I have a recreation area near to me which during the darker months is flood lit. A couple of years ago I contacted a local councillor to complain about the lighting affecting my hobby and to ask if the lights could be shielded. Within 24hrs the offending lights had been disconnected while the lights aimed away from me were still lit and didn't impact on my observing.

A couple of weeks ago, someone came to service all the light on the recreation ground, and sure enough, the offending flood lighting was switched back on and aimed at me. I again contacted the same councillor, and again within a very short time the offending lighting was switched off.

Contacting the streetlighting department proved fruitless, as did trying to contact the park's department,  as each denied responsibility. Reasoning politely with a local councillor may prove to be the simplest way to resolve intrusive lighting issues.

I can now again see the milkyway from my front doorstep! ???

Mike

Well done Mike for persisting with this. The more people take the initiative to raise these matters with the relevant authority (in this case the local councillor), the more people will come to understand that being able to enjoy the night skies is a part of normal life. The whole astronomical community will then benefit.

Jeremy

[JOC]

Well I was told that I couldn't really bring a case for the local problem ruining my hobby, but they don't have planning, and in my opinion are a visual road hazard - they are going to be made to apply for planning which IMO is fair as everyone will get a chance to have their say about their presence.  TBH I don't have a problem with them illuminating the companies own premises, but I don't see that they need to illuminate the surrounding 8 acres!  A little shielding and some angling on the lights and everyone will be happy.

[nightfisher]

There is a factory on the hill a little way away from me that now has a load of floodlights, i doubt if they have planning permission but i see little point in reporting as there are VERY strong rumours the local Councillor is in their pocket, they deal with animal carcass waste and transport the stuff, lots of spillage on local roads but just pay any fines  

[JOC]

nightfisher, that is the picture I was recalling when I posted the OP - I couldn't recall who had posted it.  I can only say that local councillor in their pockets or not a councillor is only one person on a larger committee.  The rules have to be applied - if they don't have planning they should and if they are not reported (and reportees are not disclosed) they will be allowed to get away with it.  If the lights are liable to be a distraction to road users then the county council roads department can also get involved.  Only you can make the decision to report them, but at the very least you can have the satisfaction of causing them an inconvenience and a sizeable cost as they will have a planning enforcement action placed against them if they don't have planning permission (which I somehow doubt they have) and you will also have the sasifaction of knowing that you did what you could rather then just cursing their presence every time you see them.  Best scenario is that they are required to screen them a bit which you would like to see happen I'm sure.  Its no good moaning and not acting IMO, I've achieved a lot with action in the past.  What ever the situation and whoever they have in their 'back pocket' the rules are required to be applied and in this instance if they don't have planning they should. 

[nightfisher]

so do i just email the council with pics and a report, these lights stay on every night 7 days a week

[mikeDnight]

25 minutes ago, nightfisher said:

so do i just email the council with pics and a report, these lights stay on every night 7 days a week

I'd do just that! Also, I'd give a polite explanation as to how its not only intrusive and blinding, but that it has effectively destroyed any chance of carrying out your hobby of astronomy. It's not so much the light that's the problem but rather the light source. If they could either shield the lights so that the light is directed downward, or simply direct the lights themselves straight down, theyed still light the intended area but not beyond. The light source should not be visible from your location. Rather than just e-mailing the council, I'd try contacting the councillor for your ward. I have no interest in politics of any kind, so it was irrelevant to me which councillor I contacted. Someone who has a vested interest in your area is likely your best first step.

Mike

[nightfisher]

I have emailed bradford council, wonder if i even get a reply

[Mr Spock]

Whenever commercial interests are at stake the private individual will simply not be heard

[nightfisher]

1 minute ago, Mr Spock said:

Whenever commercial interests are at stake the private individual will simply not be heard

My thoughts exactly so i will be amazed if i even get a reply, but at least i tried, part of me is not fussed as i dont do DSO but the lights do coincide with planetary ecliptic, i am considering scaling down my astro due to weather/work and other stuff

[JOC]

nightfisher - good for you - at least you know you acted and that is worth something for your own self-esteem at least. :-)  My own council had a proper online reporting form that catered for the issue of light pollution - its the environmental health department that you need to target.  Oh, and the highways dept. if they cause a road distraction.

[SilverAstro]

On 17/03/2017 at 19:24, JOC said:

This is a did you know..................

Did you know that if a factory or other location installs a set of big permanent floodlights that they need planning permission to do so?

A very good reminder JOC ! Well alerted.

This probably explains why, many years ago, when an office block a couple of miles from my then back garden sprouted some lights round its car-park, I went along and asked at the gate for the site manager or chief-in-charge, some consternation but a phone call was made and two bods appeared. "Oh ! please come in and show us the problem", some pointings and mention of astro etc and they were most interested, very sorry, will be sorted forthwith etc&etc and please come back and tell us if the new shades and angles are not right. Brill ! all went relatively dark again I was amazed.  Now you have reminded me, they prob thought it was cheaper to keep one lone strange astronomer happy/quiet rather than the expense and rigmarole of applying for retrospective !!!

 

[nightfisher]

An update, having emailed bradford council i got a polite reply today advising me the site concered comes under the Calderdale council, despite having a bradford postcode, so i have emailed to Calderdale council including photo`s, we will see if any thing happens, i have my doubts if it will.

TBH if there is now resolution to this i just as well reduce my kit again and just become a snapper of the moon, as these lights come on at dust and go of at dawn 7 night a week, even the planetary ecliptic is blighted by them

[nightfisher]

So i got a swift reply from Calderdale council, telling me that it is down to Bradford council to investigate, in other words no one wants to know, i think this is enough to tip me into giving up astro

[happy-kat]

Could contact your local MP.

[nightfisher]

2 minutes ago, happy-kat said:

Could contact your local MP.

A strong rumour says he is in the pocket of said company

So i have 10 superbright floodlights shining directly onto the ecliptic path that are never turned of during the hours of darkness and a council that does not want to help, looks like i will be listing my gear soon

[happy-kat]

Do you have a reasonably local astronomy society to approach they may already be on the case.

[nightfisher]

No not in this area, i have emailed Bradford again and cut an pasted the other councils reply but i think it is clear what direction this is going in

[scarp15]

1 hour ago, nightfisher said:

A strong rumour says he is in the pocket of said company

So i have 10 superbright floodlights shining directly onto the ecliptic path that are never turned of during the hours of darkness and a council that does not want to help, looks like i will be listing my gear soon

I still would strongly consider contacting by emailing your MP, whatever interest he may or may not have with this company, all that is required is awareness that some modification to the light source needs to be implemented, which is clearly offensive and evasive whether you are into astronomy or not. Observing from your home turf for quite a few has its challenges.

Also do you have a local residents association that could act on this matter or is there a neighbour who could back you up, provide additional support?

[nightfisher]

I have sent a follow up mail to Bradford, they have decided to look into it, i wont hold my breath for a positive outcome, if nothing gests done i then have to decide should i sell up and move or scale down my astro to just Luna

[scarp15]

Good luck, did you include that picture with your email?

If you still feel that you are not making progress, see if you can contact an editor for your local newspaper and include some pictures, they may run an article.

[JOC]

Good  idea, local papers love things like this and often take little encouragement to run a story.  I've often involved my koal rags when it has been in my interest to do so.