About to pull the trigger on a C8 + HEQ5 Pro. Need some advice!

[Xiga]

Hello fellow Astronomy heads!

I've bee a long time lurker here but seeing as I'm now close to making a major purchase, I thought now might be a good time to finally make my first SGL post!

I've always been fascinated by Astronomy, but for whatever reason have never owned a telescope. Well, no more excuses, after 4 long months of exhaustive reseaarch it's' time to take the plunge! I live in a second-floor flat in Belfast, and each session will involve loading up the car and driving to a remote location, so portability will be an important factor. I have stretched my budget to reach £1,500 (waaaaaaay more than I was initially intending) and the plan is that for the first year or two I will be learning the ropes and doing just visual (a bit of everything, not just planetary or DSO) before moving onto the dark art of AP. For this I will pick up an 80 ED plus guiding equipment when the time comes.

Keeping costs down to the bare minimum is important, so for this reason the mount I've decided to go for will be an HEQ5 Pro Synscan. That way when the time comes for imaging I won't need to invest in a 2nd mount. I can keep the 2 x 5Kg counterweights permanently in the car boot, that way the tripod+mount will only weigh 13.6Kg, so not that much more than the 8SE equivalent (about 9Kg I think?).

And so then to the issue of which OTA to pair it with. I searched long and hard to find an affordable, portable OTA that would be ideal for both visual and imaging, and now realise that such a beast doesn't exist (please correct me if I'm wrong though). This is partly why I've decided to just get an 80 ED for when the imaging bug bites (I've also ordered 'Making Every Photon Count' from FLO). This means I can now just focus on getting whicher scope will give me the most aperture in the most affordable, portable package.

The Newts are very tempting I have to say, due to their low price. But they're pretty big and heavy, and I have about 30 to 40 stairs to go up and down each time (some of which are narrow) so I think that pretty much rules them out. So the obvious choice seems to be the Celestron C8 XLT OTA, as it weighs a little over half of an 8" Newt, and is much shorter too. I enquired with FLO abut how much the C8 + HEQ5 Pro would cost and they quoted me a price of £1,414 + £39 P&P. This seems like a really good price to me, can anyone else confirm? (Note, the C8 comes with a diagonal and a 25mm eyepice).

Does anybody have any other suggestions, in case I've overlooked something? I already have a 17Ah power pack and a Celestron X2 Barlow as a start, if I were to go with the above combo, what other bare minimuj essentials would I need just to get started at observing straight away?

Sorry for the long post, and clear skies!

[nightfisher]

Your plan sounds water tight, good mount, the C8 gets lots of praise, and with all the stairs it will be easier to cart up and down, compared to a big newt

[jarralad]

dew shield and dew band,i have the same set up.

[astrofox]

C8 is a good mount and you can sometimes get a carry strap for it which makes moving it a breeze. I learned the hard way apperture feaver can overwhealm common sense. I soon realised the scope I used most is the one I can carry easily.

[billhinge]

I agree, I have a C11 and recently bought an 80mm Apo, the 80mm is certainly more fun to use, easier to set up, puts less strain on the mount and I'm more inclined to go out and take a risk with the weather

[boris sputnik]

I have a Nexstar 8SE and a HEQ5 pro mount ,SSAG mini 50mm guider scope ,focal reducer / corrector That brings f/10, 2032mm to f/6.3 ,1280mm ,and a Canon 1100D modified.

I love my kit and I wouldn't change a thing in the way I made my progression to astrophoto...The C8 is good for visual and astrophoto and it weights 7 kilos not 9 ,and for the price ,the HEQ5 pro is a very good mount !

This summer I'm buying a 80 mm refractor so I can take pictures I cannot take with the C8. It looks like you did a good research and you will be happy with that road you are taking in amateur astronomy and astrophotography.

Good luck mate ! Hope I hear from you again when you have your kit...

Maxx ,Québec

[Xiga]

Thanks guys. I'm a bit nervous spending so much tbh, I was initially only intending to spend about £750 (will have to break it gently to my better half). I will get a dew shield as well then, they seem to be essential for SCTs. I'm finding the thought of dew heaters quite off putting, as it will probably mean another £100 and require a lot of juice to run. I'll see how I get on with just the shield for the time being. I hear some people use a mini hair dryer, is that right?

Does the C8 have a handle? Assuming it doesn't, does anyone know of a cheap bag/case that could be used in conjunction with the foam from the packaging to use for transportation & storage?

[boris sputnik]

I don't have the dew heaters bands yet so I use a Hair dryer I paid $15 for. I works but the bands are very constant ,no dew all night long without having to blow hot air every 20 minutes...

Another thing is that they're very expensive ,you can't just buy one band and plug it in a 12 volt socket. You have to buy a control box to set the temperature just right. And when you take astrophotos ,you need an extra band for your guiding scope. For now if you are going to just do observing and don't want to spend too much ,try the hair dryer. It's available in 12 volts at some astrostuff dealers.

For transportation i have come up with this kit. The red " chariot " is srewed to the container...and inside it's full of foam strips and the bottom is all 3inches thick foam when everything is inside ,nothing moves. When it's very cold ,I put my power tanks in the container isolated with the foam ,the battery stay strong much longer...

[Merlin66]

Hmmmm

The C8/HEQ5 is a great combo.

BUT

I see you're living in a 2nd floor city flat and anticipate all your observing will be done at some remote location. Been there, done that, it does become a royal PITA!

Don't get me wrong, I and many other have done that for years....but the scope/kit/time always seems to take longer to transport and set up than you imagine and things go wrong etc etc etc.

As has been said many times, the best scope you'll ever have is the one you use....

It may be better is start with a ED80 type refractor and even an EQ3 sized mount....get the practise (and fun) then decide whether or not to upgrade to something larger...

I'm sure others will comment!

[Xiga]

That's a nice setup boris, not a bad way to transport & store all the gear. I'm getting a bit worried about the whole dew issue now. Here in the UK i think it can get pretty bad, so i'd be annoyed if it ended up cutting short the few nights i'll no doubt get due to our bad weather. Can any other UK based people tell me how much of a pain it is dealing with due? If you had to buy everything over again, is it seious enough that it would affect your decision to get an 8" SCT? Maybe i'm making a mountain out of a molehill.......

I have another query if that's okay. I notice when looking at the list of specifications of the C8 OTA on FLO and also on every other site, none of them mention a focuser (e.g a crayford or R&P which are listed for most other scopes). Does the C8 come witha focuser included, or will i have to buy one seperately? If it does include one, what is it like, will i be content enough with it ot will it likely drive me nuts? I'm thinking of how difficult it will be to focus when on high mag (e.g x250+).

[Ludd]

Dew is an issue but it's quite easy to sort out. I started off with a home made shield made from a camping mat, then moved up to a heated dewshield by Astrozap. That keeps it under control.

Focusser - yes there is one built in, it moves the primary mirror up and down the tube and is fine for most purposes. For fine adjustments at high mags, an extra crayford or simiilar focusser can be screwed onto the back. I use one for planetary imaging and it is a bit easier than the built in focusser, which is quite stiff and makes the scope wobble a bit. But see how you go before spending ££ on a crayford!

[boris sputnik]

That's a nice setup boris, not a bad way to transport & store all the gear. I'm getting a bit worried about the whole dew issue now. Here in the UK i think it can get pretty bad, so i'd be annoyed if it ended up cutting short the few nights i'll no doubt get due to our bad weather. Can any other UK based people tell me how much of a pain it is dealing with due? If you had to buy everything over again, is it seious enough that it would affect your decision to get an 8" SCT? Maybe i'm making a mountain out of a molehill.......

I have another query if that's okay. I notice when looking at the list of specifications of the C8 OTA on FLO and also on every other site, none of them mention a focuser (e.g a crayford or R&P which are listed for most other scopes). Does the C8 come witha focuser included, or will i have to buy one seperately? If it does include one, what is it like, will i be content enough with it ot will it likely drive me nuts? I'm thinking of how difficult it will be to focus when on high mag (e.g x250+).

The focuser in a Schimmt-Cassegrain Telescope ( STC ) is moving the mirror to acheive focus. It's the knob just under the focal reducer in the center.

For focusing the best way IMHO is to buy a motor focus . This prevent the shaky image when we touch the knob. But I don't have one yet and won't have one for a while.Some people put a crayford on their C8 but it's heavy and costly. Keep in mind that with your HEQ5 pro mount the C8 + the guider scope + the camera is within the acceptable limit of weight but you can't go much further. The maximum load for the HEQ5 is 15 kilos ,but that's for observing. For astrophoto ,we are supposed to keep the weight the closest possible to half the maximum payload.

If you buy the dew heaters ,you should think about buying a Deep charge Marine Battery. Mine is a 33amp/hour with 2x 120volts outlet ( very practicle since I plug my laptop with the same wire transfo I use at home.) The Celestron Power Tank is good if you only plug your scope in.

Alittle come back on the focuser . Don't worry about it since every telescope is hard to focus at high magnification. The motor focus is a good buy and it helps a great deal !

If you have any other questions ,please just ask I will be more than happy to help you like so many people did with me.

cheers dude !

Maxx

[Xiga]

Thanks for all the info guys, you're being of great help and it's much appreciated, so cheers!

I have an old camping mat lying around doing nothing, so i think i'll try and convert it into a dew shield. I've heard the official ones are never long enough. How long should i try and make it, and does anyone have any tips?

I've already picked up a 17Ahr Powertank but i was surprised at just how heavy it is, it weighs a bl00dy ton! lol. I really don't want to have to use any more than one, i want to minimise the amout of gear i have to carry up and down the stairs each time. I will also be storing the powertank indoors, as i've heard they don't like the cold too much. Dew-heaters seem a great idea, if you're willing to spend the additional £££'s, but it sounds like they draw a lot of current. I think i will pick up one of the cheap 12v hair dryers to see how things go, but out of interest how long do you think i would expect to get out of my powertank using just the mount and say, 1 dew strap for the corrector lens?

I'm not intending on using the C8 for Astrophotography (i'll get an 80 ED at some point in the future for that) so it will be used for purely for visual. So I'm hoping i won't need to upgrade the original focuser, even for high planetary visual use. Am i correct in assuming the whole setup will be pretty stable (and not a shaky jake!) considering it'll be on a HEQ5 with no heavy guiding equipment or cameras attached?

As you can tell, i really want to keep the accessory count to a minimum at the beginning, as i'm basically spending my whole budget (and then some!) just to get up and running. It would be nice to have: 2" visual back, dielectric diagonal, 2" eyepieces, telrad finderscope etc etc but maybe someday!

[boris sputnik]

With your 17 amp/hour running only your scope and only one dew strap, it will get you through the night...recharge after every use. When outside ,try to put your battery in an isolated cardbord box (with foam or towels or an old blanket...) don't let it sit on the cold ground. You will have a very stable kit with the HEQ5 mount ,I love that mount.

You will not need another focuser...The stock one are very good. A Bahtinov focusing mask is easy to make for a few pennies ...and makes the focus perfect.

, you should make youself one.

And I hope that when you start imaging that you will give the C8 a chance. A 80mm refractor is very fine for astrophoto but at a max. of 600mm of focal lentgh ,there will be things you will have a hard time to see on your picture. The C8 is a f/10 ,2032mm stock ,but with a focal reducer it comes to f/6.3 at 1280mm wich is good for astrophoto. Don't miss on that opportunity please.

[nameunknown]

Hi

you may find that without the counterweights, the HEQ5 head and tripod are still quite heavy (try carting the same weight up the stairs) - I have one and it isn't light. Still you could leave the tripod in the car boot with the weights and just take the MC head in (I suppose that could go in the boot too, but sometimes they (and the hand-controller) don't like damp - although experiences differ). It is a great mount especially once connected up to ASCOM on a laptop (with a COM port and USB 2). I have one on my Newt but it never moves from the obs.

For accessories you might want to look at:

- a good thermos flask

- red dot finder

- fingerless gloves

- a moon filter

- long johns

N

[kirkster501]

Boots, preferably snow boots which are always being advertised on the groupon adverts this time of year for 20 quid or so. No matter how fantastic your gear, how brilliant the seeing is, how great the imaging run is turning out, as soon as your feet and hands are truly cold, it's all over for that night. Others will say the same.

steve

[boris sputnik]

Boots, preferably snow boots which are always being advertised on the groupon adverts this time of year for 20 quid or so. No matter how fantastic your gear, how brilliant the seeing is, how great the imaging run is turning out, as soon as your feet and hands are truly cold, it's all over for that night. Others will say the same.

steve

AB-SO-LU-TE-LY ! Living in Québec ,I know a bit about cold...When it's very cold and I image in my backyard ,I have a running fan heater ( small unit ) shooting on my feet and I can unfreeze my hands....sitting in front of the laptop for hours without moving in temperature of -20 Celcius ,I need the best winter gear .

[Dunkster]

C8 should be very stable on HEQ5, it's way under the payload limit

Btw, FLO have the C9.25 on clearance for a limited time, for a little more than the usual price for the C8. The HEQ5 should take it in its stride for visual

Regarding the focuser, it's a technique you'll soon master. As with any other scope, if you find it's inadequate, you can get dual speed Crayford focusers that screw onto the rear cell or you can replace the stock focussing know with a micro focuser.

[Fogboundturtle]

C8/HEQ5 Pro was my first setup and I still have it. Its great for visual and planetary. You can't go wrong.

[Xiga]

Dunkster I know mate, I looked long and hard at the C9.25, it has a great reputation, but in the end decided against due to it being almost twice as heavy as the C8. I just thought the minimal extra aperture wouldn't justify the amount of extra weight. Plus, it's out of my price range I'm afraid. I know the HEQ5 ain't light either, but I'm banking on it being a mount for life (or at least a very long time) and it will enable imaging when the time comes. I'll keep the tripod & counterweights in the car boot, that way I'll only have to carry the mount head & controller on each trip. Good news that the stock focuser will most likely do for a while at least. If I get the urge to do planetary imaging I'll probably upgrade it at some point. Tbh, my main worry is that I will sooner rather than later feel compelled to move from 1.25" to 2" which would mean having to upgrade the visual back, diagonal, and eyepieces. So not cheap. I will however put a focal reducer top of my list of items to get once I've had some time in the field. I imagine having the option of a wider fov will be crucial for a lot of DSO's?

Forgot to say, I already have a Celestron 1.25" moon filter as well. And I'll be sure to wrap up warm on my nights out! Lol. I've had a rethink about making my own dew shield (I'm not very 'crafty') so I'll probably just buy one instead. FLO have an 'Astrozap Flexi-Heat Dew Shield' which has a heat strip built in for around £63. Can anyone vouch for their effectiveness? Also, they have 2 very similar ones listed, one is for a 'Celeston 8 SE (notched)' the other is for a '8" Celestron Edge HD'. Which one should I choose to fit the C8 OTA listed here:

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/optical-tube-assemblies/celestron-c8-xlt-optical-tube-assembly.html

Ok, almost done!

Is a Bahtinov mask mainly just for imaging? For purely visual, do people just mainly trust their eyes?

So far, my shopping list of absolute bare essentials contains the C8, the HEQ5, the cigarette power cable for the mount, and a dew shield. Total cost (excl P&P) £1,494 so pretty much at the limit!

[boris sputnik]

Dunkster I know mate, I looked long and hard at the C9.25, it has a great reputation, but in the end decided against due to it being almost twice as heavy as the C8. I just thought the minimal extra aperture wouldn't justify the amount of extra weight. Plus, it's out of my price range I'm afraid. I know the HEQ5 ain't light either, but I'm banking on it being a mount for life (or at least a very long time) and it will enable imaging when the time comes. I'll keep the tripod & counterweights in the car boot, that way I'll only have to carry the mount head & controller on each trip. Good news that the stock focuser will most likely do for a while at least. If I get the urge to do planetary imaging I'll probably upgrade it at some point. Tbh, my main worry is that I will sooner rather than later feel compelled to move from 1.25" to 2" which would mean having to upgrade the visual back, diagonal, and eyepieces. So not cheap. I will however put a focal reducer top of my list of items to get once I've had some time in the field. I imagine having the option of a wider fov will be crucial for a lot of DSO's?

Forgot to say, I already have a Celestron 1.25" moon filter as well. And I'll be sure to wrap up warm on my nights out! Lol. I've had a rethink about making my own dew shield (I'm not very 'crafty') so I'll probably just buy one instead. FLO have an 'Astrozap Flexi-Heat Dew Shield' which has a heat strip built in for around £63. Can anyone vouch for their effectiveness? Also, they have 2 very similar ones listed, one is for a 'Celeston 8 SE (notched)' the other is for a '8" Celestron Edge HD'. Which one should I choose to fit the C8 OTA listed here:

http://www.firstligh...e-assembly.html

Ok, almost done!

Is a Bahtinov mask mainly just for imaging? For purely visual, do people just mainly trust their eyes?

So far, my shopping list of absolute bare essentials contains the C8, the HEQ5, the cigarette power cable for the mount, and a dew shield. Total cost (excl P&P) £1,494 so pretty much at the limit!

The Bahtinov focusing mask is a Fast and easy way of obtaining a perfect focus...You can use it for visual or for imaging ,it's up to you ! It's a cheap accessory well worth having !

Maxx

[Dunkster]

Dunkster I know mate, I looked long and hard at the C9.25, it has a great reputation, but in the end decided against due to it being almost twice as heavy as the C8. I just thought the minimal extra aperture wouldn't justify the amount of extra weight. Plus, it's out of my price range I'm afraid. I know the HEQ5 ain't light either, but I'm banking on it being a mount for life (or at least a very long time) and it will enable imaging when the time comes. I'll keep the tripod & counterweights in the car boot, that way I'll only have to carry the mount head & controller on each trip. Good news that the stock focuser will most likely do for a while at least. If I get the urge to do planetary imaging I'll probably upgrade it at some point. Tbh, my main worry is that I will sooner rather than later feel compelled to move from 1.25" to 2" which would mean having to upgrade the visual back, diagonal, and eyepieces. So not cheap. I will however put a focal reducer top of my list of items to get once I've had some time in the field. I imagine having the option of a wider fov will be crucial for a lot of DSO's?

Forgot to say, I already have a Celestron 1.25" moon filter as well. And I'll be sure to wrap up warm on my nights out! Lol. I've had a rethink about making my own dew shield (I'm not very 'crafty') so I'll probably just buy one instead. FLO have an 'Astrozap Flexi-Heat Dew Shield' which has a heat strip built in for around £63. Can anyone vouch for their effectiveness? Also, they have 2 very similar ones listed, one is for a 'Celeston 8 SE (notched)' the other is for a '8" Celestron Edge HD'. Which one should I choose to fit the C8 OTA listed here:

http://www.firstligh...e-assembly.html

Ok, almost done!

Is a Bahtinov mask mainly just for imaging? For purely visual, do people just mainly trust their eyes?

So far, my shopping list of absolute bare essentials contains the C8, the HEQ5, the cigarette power cable for the mount, and a dew shield. Total cost (excl P&P) £1,494 so pretty much at the limit!

I know what you mean... the weight all adds up. The C8 is a great scope and very portable (I weighed mine in another thread and it's 5.0kg). Btw, it'll be interesting to see what counterweights you need... I've not put my C8 on the EQ yet.

I have the heated dew shield and it's one of those things that once you start using, do you want to not fire it up one night and risk dewing up? Ho hum. The 8SE and Edge HD 8 have different sized dovetails, so the notch is sized appropriately. You could save a lot by just cutting a camping mat to size - just get a tape measure around the end of the ota and get cut appropriately The dew band itself is apparently better placed behind the corrector rim itself (on the Alu ota)... remind me after work and I'll try and dig out a link...

Regarding 1.25" to 2" vb... don't rush the C8 can benefit from the wider 2" vb+diagonal+EP, but you'll still be able to squeeze 0.8 degree FOV (max) out of the 1.25" at that focal length, but about 1.3 degrees when you go 2".

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

Sounds like you did your research well. Good choice of kit for exactly the right reasons. I have a C8 on an EQ mount (the redoubtable Vixen Great Polaris), and an 80 APO for when the DSO imaging bug hits, or for when I want to do wide-field viewing. Great combo in my opinion. The C8 is also very good at planetary AP, which is way easier than DSO.

[Ludd]

I'm very happy with the Astrozap dew shield, but my OTA is an 8SE, with the vixen-sized dovetail. I think the OTA you've linked to has a wider dovetail which might not fit in the notch on the SE-specific dew shield.

I use a home made Bahtinov mask, cut from an old plastic art portfolio that had been kicking around in the shed, and it's very easy to use - I've found it particularly helpful getting the focus set up for imaging the ISS, when you don't have time to fiddle around with focus once the ISS has appeared above the horizon.

I've got a 2" visual back for my scope (from Astroboot for a few pounds) but haven't used it much at all - but that's probably because I do relatively little galaxy or nebula observing with this scope, due to London light pollution.

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

The regular C8 for HEQ5 has the same vixen dovetail.