Deep space colour

[michaelg]

Can you expect to see any colour when viewing deep space objects with a 250px and decent eyepiece

thanks

[Spec-Chum]

Not really, no. But I swear I can see a green hint on the ring nebula...

[Moonshane]

on very few objects from very dark sites you might get a vague green/blue tint but this is about it. the only exception to this is stars where there's lots of colour.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Some people can detect a slight colour in certain DSO's like the Orion Neb and the Ring Neb. Thats more to do with their eyesight then it is to do with the scope they are using. Generally though to most of us.................DSO's come in different shades of grey.

[swamp thing]

I can see colour in some DSO,s with my 10" Dob. Mainly planetary nebula, some of which have quite striking colour. For example I was observing NGC6543 the cats eye nebula only the other night. This was bright green, no question about it.

Away from planetary nebula only the great nebula in Orion has shown any colour.

[paul schofield]

I also see greenish grey colour in M57 and also the Orion Nebula. Also I notice colour differences in stars, maybe its my imagination ? And its just the differences in brightness, but I am certain Betelgeuse shows its red proudly. Please someone tell me this is not my imagination and finally I see Sirius change colour frequently during observation. I know this is due to atmospheric interference, happens even more so through binoculars. Your post has got me thinking, do I imagine this ? look forward to reading replies.

[umadog]

The reason for the lack of colour is that there aren't enough photons available to activate your cone photoreceptors. They mediate colour vision, and without them you see in gray-scale. Indecently, in bright conditions your rods are completely saturated and useless. All vision goes through cones in bright conditions.

[LukeSkywatcher]

The reason for the lack of colour is that there aren't enough photons available to activate your cone photoreceptors. They mediate colour vision, and without them you see in gray-scale. Indecently, in bright conditions your rods are completely saturated and useless. All vision goes through cones in bright conditions.

I read somewhere recently that women have (i think) 4 types of cones in their eyes and men only have 3 types. This would account for more female astronomers claiming to be able to see colour in DSO's.

[LukeSkywatcher]

This could also explain why it is only men who suffer from colour blindness. I dont think women suffer from it simply because they have more cones (or type of cones) then men do

[sam mayo]

i just looked up the bit about women not going colour blind didnt know thought was fascinating thanks

[LukeSkywatcher]

i just looked up the bit about women not going colour blind didnt know thought was fascinating thanks

I was amazed when i heard it also. It was backed up somewhat by the fact that most airline pilots are male and all of them are tested for colour blindness, whereas any female that flies airlines does not go through this same eye test because women do not suffer from colour blindness.

[umadog]

Tetrachromacy (four cone types) is very rare in humans with a very small number of women having been shown to possess it. I think it's under 5 individuals. The degree to which it has any implications in colour vision is unclear. Women don't suffer from colour blindness for genetic reasons. Both men and women have three cone types. Cones are not functional in dark conditions, so having more cone types wouldn't allow you to see colour in DSOs. It's all down to sensitivity.

A while ago on Cloudy Nights one of the members reported that his 7 year old daughter could very clearly see red colouring in M42. She had no prior knowledge and spontaneously remarked on the colours. It's not clear why some people are able to do this whilst most cannot. There are a bunch of possible explanations such as the cornea, lens, and vitreous humour being clearer in a small child. Possibly some individuals have slightly more sensitive cones or the range of light levels over which rod and cone vision coexist are different in different people.

[mallorcasaint]

It's not quite true that women can't be colour blind. "About eight in 100 men and one in 100 women are affected by colour blindness." - BUPA

Anyway, I always thought female astronomers saw DSO's in Fifty Shades of Gray!

[Davey-T]

Well my eyesight is Rubbish but I'll swear the Orion Nebula looks green

Dave

[Beulah]

The only way I will have 50 Shades of Gray book in my possession is when I need to use it as kindling... I'm probably the only female in the world that has not read it.

I can see pink, blue and to a lesser extent, green hints in the Orion Nebula. This is only apparent when transparency and seeing is excellent.

This was borne out, unprompted, by two other people who funnily enough are female as well as myself.

The two other people had not seen the Orion Nebula in images - for there is another theory out there that states that you cannot see colour in DSOs in apertures less than 20" because your brain believes it's there due the suggestion of images seen already..

[LukeSkywatcher]

Both men and women have three cone types. Cones are not functional in dark conditions, so having more cone types wouldn't allow you to see colour in DSOs. It's all down to sensitivity.

I was sure i read that women have 4 types of cones. Maybe it was women have MORE cones then men and this would make the female eye more sensitive to colour perception.

I cant be sure, so lets go with the female eye being more sensitive to colour.

[LukeSkywatcher]

My father was red/green colour blind which really annoyed him because one of his favoutite sports to watch was snooker.

So to him all the red balls looked green and the single green ball looked red.

[Rig3l]

I can't see any colour, just grey..

The comparison with other colours can give us some reference points; I think that our brain, our mind, sometimes "make see" colours even if they are not visibile.. except for some DSO in really dark sites, maybe.. I don't know

PS. Take this test:

http://www.xrite.com/custom_page.aspx?PageID=77&Lang=en

[umadog]

Yep, could be more cones or higher cone density. But definitely women don't have four cone types except in certain very unusual circumstances.

[LukeSkywatcher]

I can't see any colour, just grey..

The comparison with other colours can give us some reference points; I think that our brain, our mind, sometimes "make see" colours even if they are not visibile.. except for some DSO in really dark sites, maybe.. I don't know

PS. Take this test:

http://www.xrite.com...geID=77&Lang=en

You are so right. We have all seen colour images of just about everything and when we are out observing at night, i think our brain sees more then our eyes. Our brain fills in the blanks and we think we see what we have seen in processed images.

[Si W]

Ye, I've heard of something like that before, the human brain tries to compensate for colour as the cone cells in the back of the eye are more sensitive to RGB, or something along that lines.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Yep, could be more cones or higher cone density. But definitely women don't have four cone types except in certain very unusual circumstances.

I'll go with that.

[Qualia]

I think that our brain, our mind, sometimes "make see" colours even if they are not visibile.. except for some DSO in really dark sites, maybe.. I don't know

I've read the same kind of thing. For example, in a book about binaries by Bob Argyle, there is mention that sometimes finding colour in stars is "pychological in origin." Of course, he wasn't referring to such sights as Betelgeuse, Rigel, Antares et al

[Beulah]

Rather than plagiarise an existing thread after doing a little research, see what people are saying here: http://cs.astronomy.com/asy/general_discussion/f/32/t/31185.aspx

[ollypenrice]

I have indifferent eyesight, a half metre scope and an extremely dark site. No colour, sad to say, in any DS objects. Star colour is better in smaller apertures. I was also married to a colour blind woman.

Some do report DS colour and I so envy them! The luck of the draw, I guess...

I fight back by imaging!

Olly