M45 nebulosity

[ollypenrice]

This is never simple for my 70 year old eyes but, getting up for a call of nature at six this morning, I went outside to find a truly sensational sky. The stars were ablaze. I picked up a pair of 8x42 bins and had a cruise. The Pleiades nebulosity was easy, an unmistakable glow around and within the cluster. It was an inspiring little tour and unexpected. Recent weather has been astonishing, too, with clear blue skies and temperatures hitting 32C in the afternoons.

Olly

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

Very jealous of those skies. Clouds and rain here

[tomato]

Yes, Olly, I recall being up at 06:00 on our departure day and seeing Orion dominating the sky over Les Granges like I’ve never seen it before or since.

Plenty of nebulosity here in Shropshire, but not of the inspiring kind.

[Peter Drew]

Interesting.  My astronomical interest goes back far in time when the Pleiades nebulosity was considered visible only by the amateur photography performance available at that time.  Nowadays, this feature seems to be visually observable through small telescopes and even 8x42 binoculars under ideal conditions.  Has the nebulosity become brighter or were earlier observations, usually dismissed as light dew on the optics, actually valid?      🙂

[ollypenrice]

21 hours ago, Peter Drew said:

Interesting.  My astronomical interest goes back far in time when the Pleiades nebulosity was considered visible only by the amateur photography performance available at that time.  Nowadays, this feature seems to be visually observable through small telescopes and even 8x42 binoculars under ideal conditions.  Has the nebulosity become brighter or were earlier observations, usually dismissed as light dew on the optics, actually valid?      🙂

I thought that naked eye observation of nebulosity was recorded a long time ago, but can't remember the source for this. I'm also pretty sure that there's line about it from in one of the Romantic Poets but, to my embarrassment, I can't find that, either! If I'm right, that would be pre-photographic.

I've never found aperture to be much help because, with it, the FOV diminishes and you need some background sky for reference against which to detect nebulosity. I think that this is why my view the other morning was so convincing. I had a vast region of very dark, dry sky with the cluster in the middle of it and the cluster itself did not have a dark background. I suppose it could be bloat from the densely packed cluster stars but the bins are good - Leica - and give very pinpoint stellar images. I was convinced, certainly.

Olly

[JTEC]

Perhaps you  mean these lines from Tennyson’s poem Locksley Hall, written, acc to Wiki, in 1835:

‘Many a night I saw the Pleiads, rising thro’ the mellow shade,

Glitter like a swarm of fire-flies tangled in a silver braid.’

Those were the days … 

 

[Mr Spock]

Heavy LP here but I can pick it up in the 4" easily enough.

[Peter Drew]

I was in no way disputing such claims for this observation any more than those of the HH, Sirius Pup or central star of the Ring Nebula.  I was more commenting on the apparent shift from "impossible" to relative commonplace of these observations over the decades.  Equipment and general observing skills have definitely improved but one would have thought that much would have been negated by light pollution and other modern impacts on seeing conditions.     🙂

[Rusted]

46 minutes ago, Peter Drew said:

I was in no way disputing such claims for this observation any more than those of the HH, Sirius Pup or central star of the Ring Nebula.  I was more commenting on the apparent shift from "impossible" to relative commonplace of these observations over the decades.  Equipment and general observing skills have definitely improved but one would have thought that much would have been negated by light pollution and other modern impacts on seeing conditions.     🙂

Perhaps carrots are cheaper now? 😉

[ollypenrice]

5 hours ago, JTEC said:

Perhaps you  mean these lines from Tennyson’s poem Locksley Hall, written, acc to Wiki, in 1835:

‘Many a night I saw the Pleiads, rising thro’ the mellow shade,

Glitter like a swarm of fire-flies tangled in a silver braid.’

Those were the days … 

 

The very one! Thanks. The 'silver braid' does imply nebulosity, I think.

4 hours ago, Peter Drew said:

I was in no way disputing such claims for this observation any more than those of the HH, Sirius Pup or central star of the Ring Nebula.  I was more commenting on the apparent shift from "impossible" to relative commonplace of these observations over the decades.  Equipment and general observing skills have definitely improved but one would have thought that much would have been negated by light pollution and other modern impacts on seeing conditions.     🙂

Very little LP here and, though I didn't measure it, it will have been SQM22. That's the best we get and the night was truly of the best.

Olly

[Beulah]

Sometimes, those early morning wake-ups are rewarded with some of the most brightest star scapes I have ever seen, which somehow isn't replicated when observing earlier in the evening. Perhaps the eyes are so incredibly well dark-adapted after a sleep, even though it is thought that 40 minutes is all it takes for the eyes to adapt.

[JeremyS]

On 13/10/2023 at 08:06, ollypenrice said:

getting up for a call of nature at six this morning, I went outside to find a truly sensational sky. 

Indoor plumbing not reached your part of France, Olly? 🤔

😊

[andrew s]

1 hour ago, JeremyS said:

Indoor plumbing not reached your part of France, Olly? 🤔

😊

My thoughts exactly. The other possibility is, at 70, he may have forgotten where it was or was reverting back to the days when he made toy binoculars from used loo rolls.

😊

Regards Andrew 

Edited October 14, 2023 by andrew s

[ollypenrice]

1 hour ago, JeremyS said:

Indoor plumbing not reached your part of France, Olly? 🤔

😊

Indoor plumbing? You mean - ahem - waste products - flowing through the walls of one's house? How disgusting!

Far better to stroll outside and empty the body while filling the mind with the perfect Platonic purity of distant starlight. All this while relishing the cool, moist morning air ahead of  yet another day of blazing October sunlight under crystal skies.

 

34 minutes ago, andrew s said:

My thoughts exactly. The other possibility is, at 70, he may have forgotten where it was or was reverting back to the days when he made toy binoculars from used loo rolls.

😊

Regards Andrew 

Toy binoculars? How dare you! My loo roll binoculars are quite outstanding and nothing I've ever used from major manufacturers has replicated the naked eye view so perfectly.

lly

 

Edited October 14, 2023 by ollypenrice

[Rusted]

Sorry, but there should a strict forum rule about criticising cardboard rolls!
While rather heavy, the material is thermally neutral and often stiff enough.
Pale imitations like CF and Aluminium do not raise the value of the instrument one iota.
Some of the finest planetary views ever have been obtained thanks to its use.
Regardless of optical design or supposed commercial value of large and costly APOs standing nearby.

We stand on the shoulders of John Dobson. Every time we imitate his genius in design.
He revolutionised and destroyed a sad attachment to the past and very deep pockets.
Crippled by inferior equatorials and centuries of making poor choices of materials.

He revolutionised the use of large apertures and brought them down to affordability for many.
Who would otherwise have been limited to inferior but expensive design only a fraction of the size.

Raise your glasses [or spectacles] to the humble bog roll. The poster tube. The carpet roll liner.
The Sonotube, and all the copycat, spiral cardboard, concrete formers. 
Without which, our hobby and science would have remained vanishingly small.
In comparison with today's thriving, global industry, dealers and countless hobbyists and enthusiasts.  

[Peter Drew]

The Bog Roll Binocular.   Cheap, lightweight, perfect colour correction, simple collimation, steady image, spares readily available.  What's not to like?    🙂

[Padraic M]

Had a similar experience myself last night --- spent a few hours between midnight and ~2am alternating between Jupiter through the C8 and touring widefield with the binocs. Similar estimated SQM here - just under 22, but last night I think was particularly clear. I could see the equatorial bands quite clearly, whereas I normally have to make myself believe that I can see them.

I could see more of Andromeda's extremities than I normally see, and I definitely considered that I saw the Pleaides nebulosity.

In fact, one problem I had was, with so many stars to be seen, it was getting difficult to make out some of the constellations.

Woke up again around 5am, and Saturn was smiling in the window at me, but given that I'd only had a few hours' sleep at that stage, I decided not to get up. I'm setting up tonight for some AP, but while it's beautifully clear at the moment, the forecast isn't good for after midnight.

[Captain Scarlet]

I think a sheet from the loo-roll’s former life will have wiped away the nebulosity 😉

Seriously though I too can see that haze around Merope in my binocs (also Leica) and have long accepted that it is indeed nebulosity and not light cloud or dew.

Magnus

[Albir phil]

Yes I to am one of those older person who makes early morning calls of nature,but I have begun to not mind it as it gets me out on my roof here in Spain when the skies are ablaze with stars.By the way my 🚽 is not on my roof.😃

[Rusted]

6 hours ago, Albir phil said:

Yes I to am one of those older person who makes early morning calls of nature,but I have begun to not mind it as it gets me out on my roof here in Spain when the skies are ablaze with stars.By the way my 🚽 is not on my roof.😃

Do not dismiss the idea too quickly!
There's nothing like a nice bit of evaporative cooling during a heatwave.

[Rusted]

8 hours ago, Peter Drew said:

The Bog Roll Binocular.   Cheap, lightweight, perfect colour correction, simple collimation, steady image, spares readily available.  What's not to like?    🙂

Interocular distance need not be a great difficulty. Even for those of us with eye on stalks. 
Flocking and baffling can be a bit of a pain but well worth the extra effort.
I have been experimenting with low IR emissivity coatings on the outside of the main tubes.
Dewing is always a problem during an "all nighter." Anything which exacerbates this is clearly to be avoided.
Dew shields are not the obvious panacea one might have hoped for. Often leading to nose-heavy handling.
I spent some years perfecting a full motion, binocular lounger to maximise limiting magnitude during moments of good seeing.
Greatly preferring paddles for the motion controls. Instead of the usual buttons.
Comfort is always a priority during a long observing session. 

[Peter Drew]

The more I use my "BRB' the more I like it.  The soft white outer casing has proved comfortable and warm to the hands during the current cold snap and can be peeled back to provide perfect IPD.  The material  is a bit of a dew magnet and I am on the lookout for one of the, nowadays rare, Izal models which I believe do not suffer from this problem.  I also have a longer focus "kitchen roll binocular" for Moon and planets.   🙂