AZ EQ 6 Any ideas

[alan potts]

I have had this mount for a while now, almost going back to when they first came out and have never been over pleased with it as I just don't feel it guide well enough compared to what I read others can do without actual guide camera and scope..

At the moment I have this in my observatory with an 800mm APO and 60mm finder and DSLR on, way short of it's max load. I use a combination of 3 star Alignment and Polar alignment as it is very difficult for me to see the pole star for the roof but at a push I can see it but have often thought with these programs there is really no need. I have never believed the polar align was that great after using the scope fitted in any case.

So over a period of nights I have done a few 3 star alignments using the centre focus aid of the camera to position, fairly acurate I would have thought. After goto was decent without being heartstoppingly spot on.

Last night it suddenly tells me after 2 star alignment following Park, it was 2 and 3 degrees out, terrible goto confirmed this it had not been touched me or anyone, I corrected it and all appear well again. Apart from putting the camera and cable on nothing has moved, has this happened to anyone else as it's the second time I can recall this now and is somewhat annoying and wastes time.

How good is this Polar alignment program, is it to be trusted. The clear movement is something of a headscratcher.

Any feed back would be nice, even if it's I expect too much from it.

 

alan

[Dr_Ju_ju]

If you can see Polaris & some of the stars around it, then a Polemaster should get better results, failing that both PHD2 and Sharpcap have drift Polar Alignment tools in-built

[alan potts]

Well not a very good responce to my problem but then maybe people didn't want to tell me it was me being dumb and stupid, I've found my own answer by reading the instructions, must try this more often.

[johninderby]

???

[Ouroboros]

@alan potts good, glad you got it sorted. Yeah, it confirms the old adage: when things are really desperate, read the bloomin' manual. 

I don't use your method anyway so I didn't have any advise when I read your post the other day. I polar align using the polar scope and the polar alignment routine in EQMOD controlling the scope from my MacBook. This works better in my experience than the suggested polar alignment routine in the SW manual using the polar scope. 

I can also say that the graticule in the polar scope was misadjusted when it arrived so I had to centre it up using the little grub screws and viewing a distant point and rotating the RA axis. Bit of a palaver. 

 

[almcl]

Alan

Not sure I understood the problem fully, but, as another AZEQ6 user, would be interested to know the solution - if you're happy to share it?

I am still looking for an accurate polar align method other than drift align, as I lack east or west horizons.  

[alexbb]

I didn't see the post until now. You can do a 2 or 3 star align using the handset and you'll see the polar error at the end of the alignment procedure. Then you proceed to the polar alignment procedure where you need to adjust the mount to center an alignment star. Do this a few times and you should be fairly accurate polar aligned. I do this always and my guiding stays between 0.4" in good seeing, close to the pole and 1.0" in strong winds, close to the celestial equator, at low altitude and poor seeing.

Perhaps an explanation to your problems is that the alignment procedure has some bugs and choosing some star combination reports a bad alignment. Maybe this is solved in firmware upgrades, but I found this often in the past with my AZ-EQ5 - which has an older firmware. If the polar misalignment is reported to more than a couple degrees and I'm sure it's not, I turn off the mount and restart the alignment using another star combination.

[alan potts]

5 hours ago, Ouroboros said:

@alan potts good, glad you got it sorted. Yeah, it confirms the old adage: when things are really desperate, read the bloomin' manual. 

I don't use your method anyway so I didn't have any advise when I read your post the other day. I polar align using the polar scope and the polar alignment routine in EQMOD controlling the scope from my MacBook. This works better in my experience than the suggested polar alignment routine in the SW manual using the polar scope. 

I can also say that the graticule in the polar scope was misadjusted when it arrived so I had to centre it up using the little grub screws and viewing a distant point and rotating the RA axis. Bit of a palaver. 

 

When I get sorted I may well try your way, I can see the pole star. just but is means pushing the roof a little off its runners.

Alan

[alan potts]

5 hours ago, almcl said:

Alan

Not sure I understood the problem fully, but, as another AZEQ6 user, would be interested to know the solution - if you're happy to share it?

I am still looking for an accurate polar align method other than drift align, as I lack east or west horizons.  

I am not totally sure I have the answer but it was logical as Mr Spock would say, I did an accurate 3 star alignment, really took time, then when it get to Polar Align it showed slightly out, first star up in the list was Sirius, one of the stars in the 3 star align so of course it was not going to find a great deal wrong as you have just set up using it.  It was only when for a change I picked Capella in the Polar Align section it showed as miles out which I guess it was.

Now I am doing 3 star then going to Rigel or what ever but not a star used in setup and it's fine, also the goto slew was really good afterwards, things bang in the middle, much better than I have seen it for ages.

In truth I could have worded it better but thanks for the reply.

Alan 

[david_taurus83]

50 minutes ago, alan potts said:

I am not totally sure I have the answer but it was logical as Mr Spock would say, I did an accurate 3 star alignment, really took time, then when it get to Polar Align it showed slightly out, first star up in the list was Sirius, one of the stars in the 3 star align so of course it was not going to find a great deal wrong as you have just set up using it.  It was only when for a change I picked Capella in the Polar Align section it showed as miles out which I guess it was.

Now I am doing 3 star then going to Rigel or what ever but not a star used in setup and it's fine, also the goto slew was really good afterwards, things bang in the middle, much better than I have seen it for ages.

In truth I could have worded it better but thanks for the reply.

Alan 

What guide scope do you have? Have you tried Sharpcap? I use it on a portable setup. It's very good.

 

[alan potts]

6 minutes ago, david_taurus83 said:

What guide scope do you have? Have you tried Sharpcap? I use it on a portable setup. It's very good.

 

I don't use a guide scope at the moment but I have the SW ED 50mm coming from FLO next week. I have a fair selection of scopes that could be used, like the Bresser Vario scope, I do not have sharpcap either.

Alan

[david_taurus83]

Ah I see. You mentioned guiding and I thought you were having guiding issues. Have you tried the DARV method using your DSLR?

[bottletopburly]

can recommend sharpcap pro and use the pa feature once you get the guidescope , eqmod ,and get platesolving setup in APT , forget 3 star alignment  .

[almcl]

4 hours ago, alan potts said:

 It was only when for a change I picked Capella in the Polar Align section it showed as miles out which I guess it was.

Now I am doing 3 star then going to Rigel or what ever but not a star used in setup and it's fine, also the goto slew was really good afterwards, things bang in the middle, much better than I have seen it for ages.

Interesting, Alan.

I've always accepted the last star of the 3 star align and never been particularly confident in the result.  I must try your tactic and see what accuracy it produces.  

Thanks for sharing!

[alan potts]

8 hours ago, bottletopburly said:

can recommend sharpcap pro and use the pa feature once you get the guidescope , eqmod ,and get platesolving setup in APT , forget 3 star alignment  .

My trouble is it takes me a long time to to understand how to set these things up, eqmod, platesolving and the like, I use APT, it's done by someone I know here, oddly I find photoshop fairly easy but I have used it for years.

Alan

[alan potts]

6 hours ago, almcl said:

Interesting, Alan.

I've always accepted the last star of the 3 star align and never been particularly confident in the result.  I must try your tactic and see what accuracy it produces.  

Thanks for sharing!

Not says this is the answer, someone else that replied said they had had the same issues, and it needs a firmware update or select a different set of alignment stars. Doing this seems to work though but it appears there are other better ways albeit in programs that you have to pays a little for, Sharpcap.

 

[Ouroboros]

@alan potts Just a thought, but I understand SharpCap needs good sight of the area round Polaris by  the camera attached to the finder/guide scope. Do you have that? 

[bottletopburly]

4 hours ago, alan potts said:

My trouble is it takes me a long time to to understand how to set these things up, eqmod, platesolving and the like, I use APT, it's done by someone I know here, oddly I find photoshop fairly easy but I have used it for years.

Alan

what is your set up scopes finders cameras etc  

[alan potts]

2 hours ago, bottletopburly said:

what is your set up scopes finders cameras etc  

I won't go into too many details because of where I am. but it is fairly extensive

2x 70mm ED CF, 1x 115mm APO F7 with flattener and Reducer to 0.79, about 640mm, 1x M/N 190mm SW. And for the other end, 180mm Mak SW, 12inch Sc , 18 inch Sumerian with J, Nichol mirror. Only 1 mount AZEQ 6

Baader Vario 60mm, SW ED 50mm, 2x 50mm finders, and 1x 60mm finder.

Canon 7Dmk2 and Mk1, 40D modded. 300mm F 4  500mm F4, F/F Canon 1DS mk 2, a few other lenses all L type.  Mammut 429 camera colour and ASI 290mini, both never used.

5 Thinkpad laptops of varing specs all decent but a few years old now.  Photography I understand very well, AP just scratching the surface then someone repaints it.

 

Another example, Polemaster, saw there were some easier to follow instruction by a fellow mod, read them twice, crossed polemaster off the list. In truth I'm rubbish at IT.

[alan potts]

2 hours ago, Ouroboros said:

@alan potts Just a thought, but I understand SharpCap needs good sight of the area round Polaris by  the camera attached to the finder/guide scope. Do you have that? 

I can see the pole with a bit of effort but but with the finder being highest point this will help a lot. When I built the obsey I intended it for the sole use of the SC 12 inch, so no need for the pole to be seen as the mount don't require this. As I had angle-iron I could use as runners so I didn't bother buying new, could have used an extra foot, no more. Paying for it now, but it could be rectified for about 40 quid and a bit of work, which I can easily do myself..

[michael8554]

Hi Alan

Is this a permanent setup in your observatory? 

If yes, then set up PA with Drift Alignment, which only requires views to the south, and east or west.

Then a Star Alignment to get a sky map for GoTo's, then Park and switch off.

That's it, no need to do every night.

Next time switch on, Unpark, set time and date, and then GoTo a star near your target and Synch.

Michael