will I see these nebula?

[popeye85]

I have just compiled a observing list containing a few nebula for the next time I get a clear night ( think one is due in the next month or so) but I'm not sure if these targets are do-able with my setup.

The scope is a 8"dob with varity of mag, a oiii filter and in skies with low lp.

proposed targets:

The North america nebula

Helix Nebula

Soul Nebula

Network nebula

plus any observing tips or other nebulas you an suggest would be much appreciated!

 

Thanks

popeye.

[MarsG76]

Yes you will be able to see those, try with and without the OIII filter, and make sure your eye are very well night adapted... this is crucial for seeing the most with in the nebulae.

Do not forget about the Orion Nebula and the Rosette that are in the late night sky in the east.

 

[popeye85]

ahh forgot about the rosette nebula! will need to add tht to the list-athough might wait till later onin the year when they appear at a more socalbe time!!

[N3ptune]

rem

 

 

[newtyng5]

NA nebula, and soul could be tricky, but you say your in low LP. So should be okay in a low power/WF eyepiece. The veil is hard to spot, but I have in reasonable LP, and helix is fine. Good luck, and enjoy

[newtyng5]

Ohh forgot about observing tips. Try the crab nebula (m1) supernova remnant. Rises at a reasonable time. One of my faves 

[Stu]

The North America Nebula can be tricky if you happen to have poor transprency on the night you try, so try again on a different night if you have trouble. It's a big object so max field of view needed to see the edges, similar to the Rosette and other large nebulae. (Typo corrected  )

[MarsG76]

19 hours ago, popeye85 said:

ahh forgot about the rosette nebula! will need to add tht to the list-athough might wait till later onin the year when they appear at a more socalbe time!!

If you could use a UHC filter.. Lumicon or Astronomik in my experience.. it makes the Rosette much easier to see....

 

[John]

12 hours ago, Stu said:

..... similar to the Rosette and other large men's.

?????

[Stu]

34 minutes ago, John said:

?????

Don't you just love autocorrect  

[scarp15]

Be prepared for at this time of year, condensation issues occurring, particularly concerning filters

If the weather permits, gain observing periods when there is a new moon or no moon

Become dark adapted and situated under a dark sky location

Begin a session with bright easier targets i.e. planetary nebulae whilst your eye and mind become accustomed

Research your targets particularly if you can determine drawings made by other observers

Good transparency is a determining factor so have a plan B such as brighter open clusters

Realistically it may be mid Oct for the next chance (unless you can plan an early morning start), there will be a shift in circumstance, check your planisphere to consider what's up, Cassiopeia and Cepheus will still be good. It is a good policy to attempt to observe larger and faint nebulae when they are approaching or have reached their local meridian. Your 8" Dob will show you a lot. Perhaps you could include NGC 281 Pac man Nebula, bright emission in Cassiopeia. 

[ollypenrice]

The NAN is very big. Don't expect to see it all in one go in an 8 inch Dob. It's more a binocular target in my view, or even naked eye.

As Orion rises, try M78.

Olly

[Red Dwarfer]

1 hour ago, ollypenrice said:

The NAN is very big. Don't expect to see it all in one go in an 8 inch Dob. It's more a binocular target in my view, or even naked eye.

As Orion rises, try M78.

Olly

Do you hold a OIII filter or similar over one of the binocular eyepieces to see the nebula ? It's just I've read that the concentration of stars in the nebula are visible to the naked eye in good conditions but to see the nebula you need the appropriate filter - is this your experience as well ? 

What about low power scopes with low magnification for the NAN - I'm going to try ( for the umpteenth time ) the NAN and Witch's Broom in a 130P Goto tonight with an OIII - and UHC filter if no luck ??

[scarp15]

The prominent, apparent feature to look for initially, is the Gulf of Mexico region, from there you can sweep across the expanse of nebulosity. With any telescope a 2" ultra wide field eyepiece at low power is most suitable, I prefer to use a UHC filter, it will respond to an OIII also. I have observed this with my 76mm refractor, which captures more the entirety of the nebula profile. I prefer though the view in my 8" and 14" dobsonian for enhancing the characteristic features of this and the Pelican nebula region. Some promise for clear skies forecast here in the N/E also, hoping to plan on getting out later, the moon is setting at midnight. 

[Stu]

25 minutes ago, Red Dwarfer said:

What about low power scopes with low magnification for the NAN - I'm going to try ( for the umpteenth time ) the NAN and Witch's Broom in a 130P Goto tonight with an OIII - and UHC filter if no luck ??

I've used a variety of smallish fracs to observe the NAN in good conditions. Probably the best was an old Televue Genesis with 500mm focal length which gave around 5 degrees field of view. Lovely.

[John]

It took me years to get a decent view of the NAN and then it was with large astro binoculars. I can now trace parts of it with my 102 F/6.5 Vixen refractor helped by a UHC or O-III filter but even the 3.8 degree true field that scope gives me is not quite enough to get the whole NAN in.

Personally I find observing the Veil Nebula a lot more rewarding

[scarp15]

The NAN really is best for a SQM 21+ location, in this circumstance this immense cloudy emission nebula is potentially bright, engaging and dramatic.  It is characteristically quite unlike the Veil, the subtle filament textures of this supernova remnant is expressed in a way that for many observers can equal or eclipse those of captured images, a fulfilling subject to observe.  

[ollypenrice]

2 hours ago, Red Dwarfer said:

Do you hold a OIII filter or similar over one of the binocular eyepieces to see the nebula ? It's just I've read that the concentration of stars in the nebula are visible to the naked eye in good conditions but to see the nebula you need the appropriate filter - is this your experience as well ? 

What about low power scopes with low magnification for the NAN - I'm going to try ( for the umpteenth time ) the NAN and Witch's Broom in a 130P Goto tonight with an OIII - and UHC filter if no luck ??

I've never been able to get on with this technique but I know it works for some people.

Like Stu, I had an old F5 Genesis (was it the same one??) and this was the dream instrument for these very extended nebulae.

Olly

[Stu]

2 hours ago, Red Dwarfer said:

Do you hold a OIII filter or similar over one of the binocular eyepieces to see the nebula ?

You can get binoculars that you can fit filters to. I had a pair of Canon 15x50is binoculars which I could fit 2" filters to the objectives. I used one OIII and one UHC (wasn't going to buy another OIII!) and it worked very well. Both NAN and Veil visible under a dark sky. I also had some 20x85s (I think) which you could fit 1.25" filters to the eyepieces. Didn't get on as well with these for comfort reasons but still quite effective.

[Red Dwarfer]

6 hours ago, scarp15 said:

The prominent, apparent feature to look for initially, is the Gulf of Mexico region, from there you can sweep across the expanse of nebulosity. With any telescope a 2" ultra wide field eyepiece at low power is most suitable, I prefer to use a UHC filter, it will respond to an OIII also. I have observed this with my 76mm refractor, which captures more the entirety of the nebula profile. I prefer though the view in my 8" and 14" dobsonian for enhancing the characteristic features of this and the Pelican nebula region. Some promise for clear skies forecast here in the N/E also, hoping to plan on getting out later, the moon is setting at midnight. 

 

6 hours ago, Stu said:

I've used a variety of smallish fracs to observe the NAN in good conditions. Probably the best was an old Televue Genesis with 500mm focal length which gave around 5 degrees field of view. Lovely.

 

6 hours ago, John said:

It took me years to get a decent view of the NAN and then it was with large astro binoculars. I can now trace parts of it with my 102 F/6.5 Vixen refractor helped by a UHC or O-III filter but even the 3.8 degree true field that scope gives me is not quite enough to get the whole NAN in.

Personally I find observing the Veil Nebula a lot more rewarding

 

4 hours ago, ollypenrice said:

I've never been able to get on with this technique but I know it works for some people.

Like Stu, I had an old F5 Genesis (was it the same one??) and this was the dream instrument for these very extended nebulae.

Olly

 

3 hours ago, Stu said:

You can get binoculars that you can fit filters to. I had a pair of Canon 15x50is binoculars which I could fit 2" filters to the objectives. I used one OIII and one UHC (wasn't going to buy another OIII!) and it worked very well. Both NAN and Veil visible under a dark sky. I also had some 20x85s (I think) which you could fit 1.25" filters to the eyepieces. Didn't get on as well with these for comfort reasons but still quite effective.

Update on North America and Veil - I had a quick try earlier tonight with the ED80 and UHC filter on 32mm lens and could see the best nebulosity at the Gulf of Mexico region ( when I say best , I mean only - but at least it`s a start ) ... did try a few times to move upwards to see more of the nebula but that brightest region was the only part visible ... It was the same case with the Veil in the small frac , the upper part had the most nebulosity , the lower part less so and that bit in the middle nowhere to be found ... if the clouds hold off , as they are forecast to do , I will try again tonight with the 130P 

[John]

Pretty good for an 80mm aperture scope I'd say

 

[Stu]

Excellent dark adaptation really helps seeing these objects. In my experience this can take anything up to 45 mins, possibly longer to reach it's very best, and resets every time you look at a bright light.

Dark and transparent skies are also very important, transparency is key here I think. I've observed the whole lot very nicely under mag 20.5 ish skies but with excellent transparency using a 4" scope.

Looking back at a previous report, I had an excellent view in Devon using the FC-100 with a 21mm Ethos and a x0.5 reducer and Lumicon OIII filter, Mag 20.45 sky and excellent transparency. Theoretically that gives a 5.6 degree field but I suspect it doesn't work out quite that wide.

[scarp15]

Good outcome, the more often you are able to visit this subject the more familiar you will become and you will begin to see and understand more of this immense complex. I had the good fortune to observe this last night after the moon had completely set from a dark sky location using my 14" dobsonian.

[DavidJM]

21 hours ago, scarp15 said:

The NAN really is best for a SQM 21+ location, in this circumstance this immense cloudy emission nebula is potentially bright, engaging and dramatic.  It is characteristically quite unlike the Veil, the subtle filament textures of this supernova remnant is expressed in a way that for many observers can equal or eclipse those of captured images, a fulfilling subject to observe.  

Might be a daft question but what is a SQM21+ location?

[Marci]

A location which scores higher than 21 on a Sky Quality Meter: https://www.globeatnight.org/sqm.php#Observations

The value represents magnitude per square arc-second... aka a squim... and 21 pretty much translates to the dark blue / grey on the scale yonder: http://darksitefinder.com/maps/world.html