Skywatcher GOTO system - useful, lazy or a waste of cash?

[DarrenH]

Evening,

So, I'm looking at getting my first scope. I've been leaning towards Skywatcher Dobs, specifically the 250px and 300p. The GOTO feature, which seems rather handy, really adds quite a bit onto the price of these scopes.

Prices from FLO:

250px - €662.55 

250px goto - €1203.95

300p - €1046.20

300p goto - €1689.82

I like the sounds of the goto system, but undecided if it's worth the extra outlay. I'm kinda being pulled towards the 250px with goto, but the man-child on my shoulder is saying bigger is better....

Help? 

[Dbswales]

I don't have a DOB but I have a goto on my 130PDS. I don't use the synscan but prefer to use Stellarium and Eqmod. Once I've got the setup PA, I star align on a couple of stars from east to west, making sure I realign the scopes reticule in a Stellarium and I'm sorted. Bang on with every search with the goto. As you're going to be observing, I'd guess goto will save you time but I'm sure there's a lot to be gained by 'star searching'. I personally don't do much observing preferring to do AP but with a nice big DOB, you'll have loads of great stuff to see. 

Im sure you'll enjoy it whatever you decide and welcome SGL. it's great here as the information that the members give you will make your hobby so much easier. 

Good luck and don't forget to post your progress. 

[Gazabone]

Personally I use both GoTo and manual setups and enjoy both.  I find star hopping quite difficult as I usually struggle to equate what I see in the ep to the star map I'm working from but that is probably simply lack of practice.

i intend to upgrade my manual Skywatcher 250P manual scope to the 300P GoTo.  Partly aperture fever kicking in but also given the limited opportunities of clear skies with the moon tucked away on the other side of the planet, I want to get to look at  my chosen targets quickly and tracked, not take up time looking for them.  I do quite enjoy finding them by myself using the coordinates, either celestial or altaz (I did a bit of diy on the Dob to use coordinates and it works pretty well). 

 

Not it sure if my ramblings help but good luck with your choice and happy viewing. 

[DarrenH]

Cheers for the replies.

I'm not the most patient person in the world I admit, so the goto system has that in it's favor.

 

Are theses Dobs any good at astrophotography? I have a Canon 1100D that just sits around collecting dust, so wouldn't mind putting it to use. It's not a deal breaker by any means though.

[Lorne]

56 minutes ago, DarrenH said:

Evening,

So, I'm looking at getting my first scope. I've been leaning towards Skywatcher Dobs, specifically the 250px and 300p. The GOTO feature, which seems rather handy, really adds quite a bit onto the price of these scopes.

Prices from FLO:

250px - €662.55 

250px goto - €1203.95

300p - €1046.20

300p goto - €1689.82

I like the sounds of the goto system, but undecided if it's worth the extra outlay. I'm kinda being pulled towards the 250px with goto, but the man-child on my shoulder is saying bigger is better....

Help? 

 

 

The manual 350 Dob is over 100Euro less than the 300 Goto

*** Dontcha just love spending others people's money!!!  ***

[DarrenH]

I like your thinking!

I'd not really paid much attention to anything above the 300..

14" is some beast though! 

[Lorne]

It is a beast, (as is the 16!)

I had the 12 flextube and it was on the edge of portable, I could get the complete scope through a standard door to set up in my garden plus easily transported in my car in 2 pieces. If you got the 14 the base would need dismantled to move it around, not really a problem but if you only have a short viewing time you would want to maximise it. 

 

[DarrenH]

Hmmm dismantling...not so keen tbh. It'll be stored in my 'man-cave/home cinema room' as that's the only cat free room in the house (19 cats = destruction). Having to take it apart to go down one flight of stairs to then reassemble doesn't appeal. 

[Dave In Vermont]

Whoa! Next someone will talk this poor, new fellow into a 20" Dob " cause you can fit it in a car pretty well....." And thus ends his kids' college-fund!

I wouldn't suggest you venture above 300mm. Most would be satisfied with a 130mm, or maybe stretch up to a 200mm Dob. Aperture-Fever is never a pretty sight. I'd sit down. Count to 10 slowly. And ask myself if I want to find things myself? Or take stock of myself and admit I can get frustrated easily - and like the the idea of a telescope that does most of the work of finding things way out yonder in the inky-blackness of the Universe? If 'yes,' I'd vow to learn about the Universe too and do so as I use my Go-To telescope. Getting the best of both worlds.

And realize you can do so painlessly and ask for some ideas from the people here - and they are quite happy to assist you! Honest!

An 8" reflector is an awesome instrument that is capable of giving one the ability to find new and amazing things out there for the rest of your life. Or maybe keep going up to 10" or 12" instruments.

Reel in your wallet for a few, and give it a think?

Dave

 

[DarrenH]

Dave,

Me posting here is basically me thinking out load. I actually had an account on here a year or two ago and never purchased.... (I forgot the details of said account before anyone complains).

Nothing is set in stone. 14" is too big. 10-12" I can live with as that 'should' fit through my 'cave' door.

Forums are part of my decision process.

[Dave In Vermont]

I understand the process - having been down this path a few times. As my signature below rather indicates.....

My 12" LX90 SCT is a monster! Moving it around - disassembled - is a lengthy undertaking. Hence once it's in place outdoors, it will live under a waterproof 'Roofer's Tarp' for the duration of the warm-weather season. A 12" Go-To Dobsonian would be walk-in-the-park by comparison - but still a bit of work to do and best done after working out the details of requirements. Like where least likely to not get hit by a car, you know - small details.

Carry on! Do ask any questions.

Dave

[Louis D]

You could also look into "push to" telescopes with Digital Setting Circles (DSCs).  They don't track, but they can be handy to find difficult objects like Uranus and Neptune.  They can also be handy in light polluted skies where star hopping simply isn't an option.  In the past, this was a less expensive option than full goto on large dobs.  On smaller scopes, I don't think there's much to be saved with DSCs over full goto.

[John]

If stairs are involved I'd not go above a 10" dob.

My 12" dob is an Orion Optics (UK) and quite a bit lighter than the Skywatcher 12" but I'd still not want to take it up and down stairs even in it's 2 sections.

I've seen and used the 14" and 16" Skywatcher dobsonians. Great scopes but really need 2 people to set them up and are pretty much immovable once in place for a session.

 

 

[MarkVIIIMarc]

I was going to buy a Z8 but they were out so I got a Z10. It is everything I can move carefully in my car and when I'm not doing the website I'm moving and loading furniture for work. My wife's van is a more proper vehicle for it.

[Putaendo Patrick]

Don't get me wrong, but if this is your first telescope and you've had little experience of astronomy, I reckon you're heading for massive overkill with anything over 250mm. Many people in this hobby tend to become interested in one area; lunar and planetary, nebulae, galaxies, double stars etc. not forgetting the entirely different field of astrophotography. And most people will favour one type of telescope for the purpose; fast or slow reflectors, achro or apo refractors, Maks, SCTs etc. Add to these the enormous range of eyepieces, barlows, filters etc. and their respective price ranges.

Until you have more of a feeling where astronomy will take you, I would start out much more gently with perhaps a 200mm fully manual Dob - these are excellent scopes which will keep you fascinated for quite a while. After six months or a year, if you want to, you should be able to sell it on easily without too great a loss, and this loss might well be very much less in the long term than buying a more expensive scope which turns out to be unsuitable.

[Colinlp]

Make life easy for yourself, a big scope is a pain in the rear if you have to set it up every time you want to use it, 200mm or 250mm maximum if you ask me. A goto is also a good idea if you ask me, I'm the first to argue that they de skill the hobby but for beginners they help keep the interest up in that you will at least get to see the faint objects out there and not miss them altogether through inexperience

[DarrenH]

Morning,

Thanks for the comments.

Size - I had a little vino last night, so talks of the 350 were just drunken ramblings. In regards to the comments about getting a manual  200, that was kind of the original plan, but after thinking upon it for a few days I decided that the 250 would be better in the long run. Where I live is really rural (everyone is a farmer or a smallholder), so selling equipment on will be very challenging. The idea is the 250/300 would be here to stay, negating the need for possible upgrading/selling in the future.

Weight/stairs - as long as it physically can go up/down stairs the weight isn't such an issue. I do a lot of manual work, so lifting and shifting is easy peasy. I can leave it outside too if need be (covered of course). Only really needs to be bought in when the boss is home (she works away 3 weeks a time) or if the weather is poor.

Astro - Appreciate that is a different subject altogether. Something I will look into further down the line perhaps. Need to make use of that camera somehow!

Land - We have a couple acres of garden and roughly 25 acres of pasture for the horses so the majority of my viewing will be done within the confines of the gardens and surrounding fields. There is a couple of small villages within a few km radius but little pollution is fairly minimal, so skies are good. Once summer hits we can go for weeks with crystal clear skies every night. Last year it rained maybe 2-3 times in 4 months, then just the odd cloudy day.

[Linda]

I wouldn't go for an extremely big scope. 10" is already pretty big and might be a size that you actually will use. Bigger is not always better, the scope also needs to be manageable and motivating to take outside to use.

 

You pay a lot extra for Goto. If you are willing to put in the hours for trial and error and learning how to star hop, you will after some attempts start finding deep sky objects and more will follow during the next months. Some frustration in the learning process must be calculated, but the reward is big if you manage it. But you must be interested in investing time and effort in it. I don't regret not having bought goto.

[Tinker1947]

I have (its up for sale on here) a 300P Dob and the GoTo works very well the encoders keep track of where you push it instead of slewing, go for it.

[DarrenH]

I'm watching reviews on the various scopes on youtube whilst getting veg seeds ready for germination. The 400 is huge! The 250 does seem a better overall size so far. 

[baggywrinkle]

If you have to move the scope around then the 300 is getting on the limit for easy lifting.

[Davesellars]

The 8" manual solid-tube SW dob is very cheap and so is the 10".  If it were me I'd go for the 10" because of the quite considerable extra light gathering capability and the fact that I'm primarily interested in deep sky objects (if I were just interested in planetary / lunar then you ideally want much longer focal length).    The 8" has a much more friendly focal ratio for eyepieces whereas the 10" and larger dobs start getting in to the realms of where quite expensive eyepieces are required so budget extra for these if you go 10"+.   Eyepieces will last a lifetime so it's worth getting a couple of good ones to start with and then upgrade the scope when you feel ready to do so.

If you've got to lug it around much to set it up and it's a hassle you'll most likely end up not using it or very rarely.

Regarding GOTO etc a lot depends here on your own capability and being able to spend a reasonably amount of time to get used to star-hopping.  It's not for everyone but it's not difficult, really.  Definitely, though invest in a good 50mm or 60mm RACI finder.  That and a good star chart app like Sky Safari or Stellarium and you'll be finding objects relatively easily.   Also, what is your light pollution like there?

Don't underestimate how much extra you'll spend on accessories and eyepieces etc.

Also, I'd recommend before you buy ANY scope purchasing some binoculars and with the aid of a small atlas or star chart app find your way about for a little while and hunt down some of the brighter deep sky objects.   This will do wonders for your star-hopping skills and they'll always be very useful with you when you have the scope.

[DarrenH]

I'm more inclined to go for the collapsible scopes tbh. They make for easier storage when the weather starts to turn sour.

Eyepieces/accessories - Thanks for the heads up. I've a reasonable amount of spare cash each month, so building up the kit shouldn't be a problem. I'll have a gander at that finder in a bit.

I've downloaded Sterllarium, and I'll get the required cables so I can hook my laptop up to the scope and use Stellarium as my navigation. I've watched a few tutorials on youtube. My light pollution is low. Closest neighbors are a few hundred meters up the road. There is a small village 2km directly south and another tiny village about 1km NW. No steetlights or anything like that. We pretty rural around here.

[Size9Hex]

Hi Darren, welcome to the forum. I've got the 250px solid tube, non-go to. It's a great scope in my opinion. I've learned to star hop, it's not tricky, and it is very nice to start properly learning your way round the sky. I've never regretted not getting go-to. Sounds like you are located under dark skies, which will make star hopping even easier than with light pollution. Under dark skies, you can more or less point your scope straight at many targets in a couple of seconds. Good luck with your choice and happy stargazing. 

[mcsheffield]

Hi Darren,

I would rewind a bit, take stock of what you need, not what you want, as that list is rather long lol.  I would always take a smaller & easier to set up mount & scope that you could use most nights at the drop of a hat, over a larger bulker, 2 parter that will need collimating every time you move it from inside to out, that needs advance planning. Its kind of like after the time it takes to move & set up, if you have to put it back together (collimate) you them have to wait for it to cool, would you still be bothered to then watch for 4 hours or so & then do the reverse, or just 2 mins fold up take inside & bed. I have tried both, and know from my experience which got the most use.

Just take you time, don't rush in, get a pair of binoculars & a recliner chair you will get a good start. because of my health I cant even lift my mount lol, but my recliner still gets used after 4 years, and regularly, might take me 5 mins to get to it & then the wife brings some nice hot coffee,  but you will be amazed at what you can see with a pair of binoculars.

just my advice.

Andrew