No moon, but how much fog!

[Piero]

Clear evening, but as the title says very very foggy in the field tonight! My plan was to spot the brightest galaxies in Leo, but the humidity level was so high that this plan was far too ambitious! Anyway, an evening outside under the stars (although few!) is always better than an evening at home wishing a clear sky!  

 

Date 10/03/2016
Time 19:50-23:00
Location Cambridge, UK
Altitude 12m
Lunar Phase Waxing crescent 9%
Temperature 3C (E 5 km/h)
Seeing 3 - Moderate seeing
Transparency 3 - Somewhat clear
Telescopes Tele Vue 60 F6
Eyepieces Delos 12, Delos 8, PM2.5x

M42 Ori Neb 75x, 112x
At both these magnifications, I could not spot E and F. Again, some time at 112x I had the impression to discern F, but the view was too ambiguous. I believe the high level of humidity did not help despite the steady air.

Sigma Ori Mlt Star 112x
I tried hard to see whether it was possible to split A and C, but did not succeed. Next time.

Jupiter - Planet 45x, 75x, 112x
With the Delos 8mm (45x) I was able to see the two equatorial belts. Interestingly the view remained intact when the planet was moved near the eyepiece field stop. The belts were detectable without having to refocus. Unfortunately, due to the high humidity levels, I could not see the North and South temperate belts tonight even at higher magnifications (75x and 112x). They were  just invisible. The jovian moons were really sharp even at 112x (0.5mm e.p., 3.2mm f.l.). After many attempts, it results to me that there was a dark feature near the centre of the North Equatorial belt. Due to the poor transparency I am not sure whether this was an artefact of my eye or not, but I believe I saw something in there. No occultation as all the moons were visible. Possibly a large feston? As far as I know the GRS is in the South Equatorial belt, so this is also excluded. The mystery of the Dark Feature!

NGC2903 Leo Galaxy 30x, 45x
Star hopping from Epsilon Leo to Lambda Leo (Alterf). Then move slightly South. There is a rectangle and this target is just below the dimmer star of this rectangle. Invisible at 30x, whereas barely detectable at 45x. Due to the very high humidity, only a very faint shade of brighter gray was visible via averted vision. Jiggling the telescope did not help. To be sure it was detectable I had to go back to this rectangle a few times. Clearly no detail was visible, but just a very faint patch of gray. I want to go back to this target when transparency is better than tonight.
 

[jetstream]

Great report Piero! You are really honing your observing skills with the 60mm, excellent.

[alan potts]

Nice report Piero, I must try to see if I can get E and F with the 70mm ED I have mounted on the Meade 12 inch, it may not be as good optically but it's not bad. I am short of clear sky and still unwell. I was very angry the other night, all of the few street lights were off, and we had a very clear sky. The trouble is I have a needle wellhead in my arm so I can have some sort of medical soup dripped into me, so couldn't risk messing with scopes alas.

Still can't gumble it is the first time I have really been ill since I was 15.

Keep up the fine report work, gives me things to read on my phone whilst they fill me with liquids.

Alan

[Knighty2112]

Nice report. Bagged Jupiter early on in the evening for a short period, and planned to look at it again later on when in a better position. Sadly, we got wall to wall fog roll in that stopped seeing anything at all. ?

[Pete Presland]

Very nice report, the fog was horrible last night.

[Piero]

3 hours ago, alan potts said:

Nice report Piero, I must try to see if I can get E and F with the 70mm ED I have mounted on the Meade 12 inch, it may not be as good optically but it's not bad. I am short of clear sky and still unwell. I was very angry the other night, all of the few street lights were off, and we had a very clear sky. The trouble is I have a needle wellhead in my arm so I can have some sort of medical soup dripped into me, so couldn't risk messing with scopes alas.

Still can't gumble it is the first time I have really been ill since I was 15.

Keep up the fine report work, gives me things to read on my phone whilst they fill me with liquids.

Alan

I'm very sorry to hear that Alan! Hope this isn't the outcome for the tonsillitis you had recently. Take care, the sky will still be there so no need to rush.

I think those targets are right at the limit for my 60+local weather conditions. I believe a 70mm could make a difference as well as a slightly better sky. To my eye the Delos eps show a noticeable improvement compared to the naglers I own. I also thiught about this yesterday while observing Jupiter at 112x. Jupiter's moons were still "points" and the image did not show substantial degradation in terms of resolution. On my nagler 3.5 (103x) or 7+pm2.5x (129x) the moons appear larger and their resolution is a bit more degraded (compared to the Delos EPS). This was found both on and off axis. 

So, this might be a heresy for some but it seems to me that there can be a gain in resolution on and off axis with some eyepieces. I believe that the fact a few people see more planetary details on Pentax EPS vs other optical schemes is consistent with this opinion. 

May I ask you what your thoughts are about this, Alan?

 

 

 

EDIT on Jupiter's Dark Feature.

Here is a member's image of Jupiter for last night. So, unless my eye "interpreted" that area as a little bit darker, I guess it was an artefact. 

[andrew63]

Some interesting information on your nights work ! It's a glorious morning here but also was very hazy in the night.  I'm looking at DSO  with the ST80 and find also how small amounts of mag. can make a big difference to the view - i guess you have less light to play with in the first place.

 I also think that the 'view' through the 80 might be pretty similar to your TV60, in terms of what can be seen.  Even with more aperture, perhaps the greater contrast levels given by the quality of your lens would more than make up for it - possibly even eke out more subtle details ?

http://www.theskyscrapers.org/ngc-2903-spiral-galaxy-in-leo

andrew

[laudropb]

Another nice report Piero. Set up last night but the clouds rolled in and put pay to that.

[alan potts]

2 hours ago, Piero said:

2 hours ago, Piero said:

I'm very sorry to hear that Alan! Hope this isn't the outcome for the tonsillitis you had recently. Take care, the sky will still be there so no need to rush.

I think those targets are right at the limit for my 60+local weather conditions. I believe a 70mm could make a difference as well as a slightly better sky. To my eye the Delos eps show a noticeable improvement compared to the naglers I own. I also thiught about this yesterday while observing Jupiter at 112x. Jupiter's moons were still "points" and the image did not show substantial degradation in terms of resolution. On my nagler 3.5 (103x) or 7+pm2.5x (129x) the moons appear larger and their resolution is a bit more degraded (compared to the Delos EPS). This was found both on and off axis. 

So, this might be a heresy for some but it seems to me that there can be a gain in resolution on and off axis with some eyepieces. I believe that the fact a few people see more planetary details on Pentax EPS vs other optical schemes is consistent with this opinion. 

May I ask you what your thoughts are about this, Alan?

 

 

 

I'm very sorry to hear that Alan! Hope this isn't the outcome for the tonsillitis you had recently. Take care, the sky will still be there so no need to rush.

I think those targets are right at the limit for my 60+local weather conditions. I believe a 70mm could make a difference as well as a slightly better sky. To my eye the Delos eps show a noticeable improvement compared to the naglers I own. I also thiught about this yesterday while observing Jupiter at 112x. Jupiter's moons were still "points" and the image did not show substantial degradation in terms of resolution. On my nagler 3.5 (103x) or 7+pm2.5x (129x) the moons appear larger and their resolution is a bit more degraded (compared to the Delos EPS). This was found both on and off axis. 

So, this might be a heresy for some but it seems to me that there can be a gain in resolution on and off axis with some eyepieces. I believe that the fact a few people see more planetary details on Pentax EPS vs other optical schemes is consistent with this opinion. 

May I ask you what your thoughts are about this, Alan?

 

 

 

EDIT on Jupiter's Dark Feature.

Here is a member's image of Jupiter for last night. So, unless my eye "interpreted" that area as a little bit darker, I guess it was an artefact. 

Piero,

Think I have made a mess of the quote, my computer sometime has a mind of its own.

My illness is from catching measels from my son after the throat issues. Part of my face is paralised to a minor degree but it isn't very nice, I think I am on the mend but it's slow.

In my books Naglers are as good as it gets for 82 degrees FOV and that for me is the real issue, I imagine no matter who you are a smaller field will be easier to control. I never noticed a real difference in on axis detail between any of the TV eyepieces but if I had a gun to my head I would say Delos are about as good as you get and on a par with the shorter Pentax XW's. I often use an orthoscopic in a driven scope to sit along side to see just how good any are on any given night. I really don't see a lot to get out of bed about between them and Delos'ssss which for me are great planetary eyepieces and easier on the eye.

Naglers are better for me as wide field without the expense of Ethos. Before I sold it I did spend a good while comparing the 5mm Nagler to the 5mm XW and the latter was better but not by much, however I would be happy to use the Nagler over the Pentax when using a Dobsonian for the ease of use. For my driven scopes I often think the other way. When talking this level of quality it is often down to really important things like how they look in the case as oppossed to any real image quality issues. I still rate the first view of Jupiter with the 9mm Nagler as the finest I have ever seen and either side power wise that night in the cases were 8mm D&E and 10mm D&E, That night 9mm was the sweetspot.

Alan

[andrew63]

5 hours ago, alan potts said:

Nice report Piero, I must try to see if I can get E and F with the 70mm ED I have mounted on the Meade 12 inch, it may not be as good optically but it's not bad. I am short of clear sky and still unwell. I was very angry the other night, all of the few street lights were off, and we had a very clear sky. The trouble is I have a needle wellhead in my arm so I can have some sort of medical soup dripped into me, so couldn't risk messing with scopes alas.

Still can't gumble it is the first time I have really been ill since I was 15.

Keep up the fine report work, gives me things to read on my phone whilst they fill me with liquids.

Alan

Hope your feeling well soon Alan.  Childhood infections can be nasty in adults.

 

andrew

[Pondus]

Very good report (again) .

I can confirm the dark feature on the NEB. Was out testing the little Heritage fl650 f5 last night

(I have to cross an extremely slippery wooden terrace and dont dare carrying the 8" dob over it when icy.)

Could easily detect the 2 main belts at 27x.

The dark feature NEB obvious at 81x, definitely hints of North and South temperate belts.

Pretty good seeing, horrendous transparency.

Rune

Edit : Eyepiece used was baader zoom ..

[Piero]

45 minutes ago, Pondus said:

Very good report (again) .

I can confirm the dark feature on the NEB. Was out testing the little Heritage fl650 f5 last night

(I have to cross an extremely slippery wooden terrace and dont dare carrying the 8" dob over it when icy.)

Could easily detect the 2 main belts at 27x.

The dark feature NEB obvious at 81x, definitely hints of North and South temperate belts.

Pretty good seeing, horrendous transparency.

Rune

Edit : Eyepiece used was baader zoom ..

Thank you Rune for confirming this!!   

Happy to know that I didn't make that up!   Seeing and transparency were quite poor over here last night, otherwise the North and South temperate belts are generally visible on my 60mm at 75x.

It's funny how much detail can be captured even by small telescopes, isn't it?

 

[Pondus]

12 minutes ago, Piero said:

Thank you Rune for confirming this!!   

Happy to know that I didn't make that up!   Seeing and transparency were quite poor over here last night, otherwise the North and South temperate belts are generally visible on my 60mm at 75x.

It's funny how much detail can be captured even by small telescopes, isn't it?

 

Indeed. Part of my session last night was to see at what magnifications details on Jupiter was revealed in a small telescope.

Had really low expectations when I bought a low priced Scope, With a pretty short FL, but I have been overwhelmed by its capacity.

It is also interesting to read reports from the experienced members here, who owns up to 18" dobs, but still alot of their reports come from using small Scopes,

love to see they still cherish their small 4"  telescopes.

Edit : The dark feature must have been a barge / Brown oval I think.

Rune

[alan potts]

17 minutes ago, Piero said:

Thank you Rune for confirming this!!   

Happy to know that I didn't make that up!   Seeing and transparency were quite poor over here last night, otherwise the North and South temperate belts are generally visible on my 60mm at 75x.

It's funny how much detail can be captured even by small telescopes, isn't it?

 

I have used about x180-214 on the 12 inch meade and also around the x120-130 mark on the 70mm APO piggyback scope and as you say it is amazing just what you can see. It is true you see more in the 12 inch mirror but then look how many times bigger it is, I never see it as proportionate to the scope size. As you would expect the larger scope sets goals for you to pick out in the smaller.

[Stridor]

 

16 hours ago, Piero said:

Clear evening, but as the title says very very foggy in the field tonight! My plan was to spot the brightest galaxies in Leo, but the humidity level was so high that this plan was far too ambitious! Anyway, an evening outside under the stars (although few!) is always better than an evening at home wishing a clear sky!  

 

I went out last night with pretty much the same plan as yourself, Galaxies in Leo and Canes Venatici, but as you rightly say... the moisture in the air was a major problem ; I did bag a handful of galaxies, and Jupiter was still pretty good at 127x mag, but eventually had to give up because it was like looking through a Net curtain!

[Piero]

Sorry have problems with this post on my phone. Anyway, below there is an image of that 'dark feature'! 

 

5 hours ago, Pondus said:

Indeed. Part of my session last night was to see at what magnifications details on Jupiter was revealed in a small telescope.

Had really low expectations when I bought a low priced Scope, With a pretty short FL, but I have been overwhelmed by its capacity.

It is also interesting to read reports from the experienced members here, who owns up to 18" dobs, but still alot of their reports come from using small Scopes,

love to see they still cherish their small 4"  telescopes.

Edit : The dark feature must have been a barge / Brown oval I think.

Rune

 

[jetstream]

You seeing this feature at this mag is a testament to VG optics and more importantly observing skill, great catch Piero!

I love seeing "festoons" whether loop or bridge and when projecting up not touching anything else I call them "hooks". These will show a blueberry color or slightly purple in my scopes, very nice sights.

[Piero]

20 minutes ago, jetstream said:

You seeing this feature at this mag is a testament to VG optics and more importantly observing skill, great catch Piero!

I love seeing "festoons" whether loop or bridge and when projecting up not touching anything else I call them "hooks". These will show a blueberry color or slightly purple in my scopes, very nice sights.

Thanks Gerry!  

I was really curious to know what that was about! This is the third festoon I have seen with my 60! Festoons are doable then!  

[Astro Imp]

Another nice report Piaro. 

The mist/fog has been really bad here the last few nights so much so that the belt stars of Orion were barely visible and then only because I knew where to locate them. 

Hoping for better skies but it's nor looking good ATM.

Good luck and keep posting your always interesting reports.