what to order to go with my new dob 200p

[Beardy30]

So after months of research I have decided to purchase the 200p skywatcher with the dob mount..but what else do I need to go with it I know I will need a Cheshire but what else ..I would like a new ep, any suggestion? as I understand the 10mm It comes with is pants.  I already have a moonfilter and a barlow..all suggestions welcome.

Thanks:)

[rory]

Telrad or Rigel Finder , or a Right angle finder is worthwhile.

[Beardy30]

many thanks rory I will put it on the list!

[Andy_E]

Apart from a Cheshire (worth its weight in gold) and the possibility of a telrad I wouldn't bother with anything just yet. The 10mm supplied with the scope is no where near as bad as people like to make out (I suspect it's usually just an excuse to buy some new EPs!). Best to use the scope for a while, and get a feel for what sort of EP(s) will complement your set. I've seen so many threads on here with people looking to upgrade kit they've hardly used yet... and I guarantee that after six months they'll want to upgrade again once they actually get a feel for what they wanted in the first place. The reality is you won't know what suits you until you've used your scope for a while... would you like better eye relief? perhaps a wider field of view? or perhaps a tack-sharp high power EP would best suit your needs. All EPS have different characteristics... a nagler is not better than a panoptic, or Pentax XW better than a BGO for that matter, it's just different. But only you can make this decision (we can help you here on the forum of course), and the decision can ultimately only be made once you know what will suit YOU.

Best to cut out this middle spending section. Use your scope for twelve months, get a real feel for what you want in an EP (or other accessories for that matter). Then you'll be in a great position to make an informed purchase of some premium quality equipment (which you will not regret!).

If you find a reliable source of clear skies though I recommend you purchase it .

Hope this helps,

Andy

[cybernautic]

I got the Rigel Quikfinder with mine just because I think it's easier to place on an 8'' scope compared with the Telrad. I put the Rigel in between the focuser and the straight through finderscope. At the moment I'm using the Rigel a lot more than the finderscope itself! It's so easy just to look through and get the scope pointed in generally the right direction (I used it last night to find the Ring Nebula in Lyra). The Telrad does pretty much the same thing. It's bigger but has more circles projected against the sky but I think I'm right in saying you have to fiddle with the mount if you want it between the focuser and the finderscope. The straight through finder is a bit of a PITA and I find I don't spend too long looking through it as it's awkward. I'll probably upgrade to a right angle correct image one instead eventually.

[rory]

I agree with Andy . Bar the Cheshire or some sort of collocation aid , there's no need to Really get anything until your acquainted with your scope. I only mention a telrad or Rigel as many find them a huge help in locating an area of sky with ease. I used mine more than my raci finder. The other thing that I found a worthwhile piece if kit was a drum stool. , I bought a cheap one for about £20 and it worked a treat.

[Beardy30]

Great many thanks chaps..

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[RikM]

The 10mm and 25mm the Skyliner 200P comes with are probably the same ones you have with your 130M. Eyepieces are intensely personal, so it is very difficult to 'recommend' one for someone else.

As above, I would suggest you take a while to get used to your new scope before potentially wasting money on something that isn't right for you. I would highly recommend a Telrad or Rigel QuikFinder, and if you can stretch to it a right angle correct image finder. I think the combination makes finding things so much easier and more comfortable. Talking of comfortable, some kind of stool to sit on is a good recommendation as well. I use a cheap ironing stool that I found at a car boot sale.

The only other thing that I can suggest is a good star atlas. Something like the Sky and Telescope Pocket Star Atlas is well worth the £10 or so from Amazon.

[swamp thing]

Apart from a Cheshire (worth its weight in gold) and the possibility of a telrad I wouldn't bother with anything just yet. The 10mm supplied with the scope is no where near as bad as people like to make out (I suspect it's usually just an excuse to buy some new EPs!). Best to use the scope for a while, and get a feel for what sort of EP(s) will complement your set. I've seen so many threads on here with people looking to upgrade kit they've hardly used yet... and I guarantee that after six months they'll want to upgrade again once they actually get a feel for what they wanted in the first place. The reality is you won't know what suits you until you've used your scope for a while... would you like better eye relief? perhaps a wider field of view? or perhaps a tack-sharp high power EP would best suit your needs. All EPS have different characteristics... a nagler is not better than a panoptic, or Pentax XW better than a BGO for that matter, it's just different. But only you can make this decision (we can help you here on the forum of course), and the decision can ultimately only be made once you know what will suit YOU.

Best to cut out this middle spending section. Use your scope for twelve months, get a real feel for what you want in an EP (or other accessories for that matter). Then you'll be in a great position to make an informed purchase of some premium quality equipment (which you will not regret!).

If you find a reliable source of clear skies though I recommend you purchase it .

Hope this helps,

Andy

^^^ This.

First rate advice here from Andy

[Optical Dob]

You could Trick or Treat yourself to a Telrad or Rigel finder.

[laowho]

Sky Safari Plus ($15) or Sky Eye (free version available) for your iPhone or tablet.

[Astro Imp]

Looks like the above posts have covered all the bases, I would definitely take Andy's advice very seriously. It is very easy to get carried away and regret impulse buying later.

Good luck and enjoy.

[Itabot]

Yeah +1..... First rate advice from Andy 

[Qualia]

+ 1 for Andy E's post. Spot on . That 12 month waiting gap, the advice about cutting the middle section, getting a feel for what is required are real goals to aim towards. Most outstanding and honest advice.

[Charic]

Beardy30..........another +1 for Andy_E
I purchased my scope with the advice from this site, same with the lens. So it was buy-it and hope for the best, and sure enough, i`m happy so far. I`ve not had the full dark sky experience yet, still waiting for the right opportunity.
That said, since I bought the BST 8mm, its probably the only lens I use at present. I get on very well with the 9x50 finderscope, I find my target, then straight into the 8mm. For my wide angle views, Im using the BH 7x50s for now (much wider view than the telescope). The supplied 25mm lens isnt too bad, its just that its not getting used. On the supplied box, there is the `K` mark, assuming its the kelner mark, but the 10mm box is without the mark, so not sure if both lenses are the same build, but the BST build quality leaves them standing. Check out the Explore Scientific 120` 9mm lens. That will stop you in your tracks, size and price wise? Seriously though, if you want to buy something right now, then my choice would be change the 10mm. Take care.

[Space Beagle]

That's such a good post by Andy_E, it maybe should be the law for us lot!

If only I had had that advice a few years ago!

Mind you I still like to chop and change some kit (ok, eyepieces mainly!) still, even after reading all the wise advice here, he he!

I hope to pop out in the back garden to use it all a little more soon too!!

Doc

[Andy_E]

Feel like some sort of sage . Of course, your EP collection will continue to evolve (mine included), but I never feel 'let down' by any of my EPs or that in any way I'm missing out on substantially better views. Each suits me in it's own particular way. Like many of us I've bought and sold loads of glass in my time ... some of which I probably shouldn't have parted with any cash for in the first place! There are still one or two EPs in my case that I'd quite like to replace even now.

+ 1 for Rory's drum stool idea though!

[ramstar]

If you are considering the Telrad I would suggest you think about buying one of the risers that go with it - particularly if you have any problems with backache. I did and it's made looking through it a lot easier

[Beardy30]

Vixen NPL have been recommended to me esp the 15mm and 8mm

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[rory]

You'll get a lot of recommendations regarding e /p's . And npl's are good budget eyepieces. But I'd still hang fire for a while ( yes it's hard to resist , I know) until you have some hands on with your dob.

[Andy_E]

Rory is spot on I'm afraid (aren't we a boring bunch, sorry!). It really is impossible to recommend EPs properly until you know the exact specifications you're after. Decent plossls (such as the NPLs) are often recommended as a first upgrade... and to some extent this is good advice. However, I personally think plossls are a poor match to a dobsonian telescope due to the (by todays standards) pretty restricted AFOV. Even my Radian (at 60deg) on occasion feels a little tight... but I'll always forgive it!

[lestergibson]

Get a drum stool or something similar like an ironing chair. Makes life more comfy at the ep.

[Rob63]

I quickly added a right angled finder to my 200p Dob, my neck is much happier now !

[Beardy30]

So which eps do you recomend Andy??

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[Andy_E]

I think the best I can do is offer a report on the EPs I own (though I have owned more in the past), describing their pros and cons and why they seem to suit my needs (or not in some cases). I should state that there are other members here who have a far greater knowledge than I on the subject, and have undoubtedly had experience with a greater number of EPs. Another thing to consider is that all my EPs serve the same scope (the seemingly ubiquitous 10” f4.7 dob mounted newt) and opinions are given on this basis... though I will give my impressions of how they performed in a 6” f8 where my memory allows! The 10” dob has been built 'slightly' bottom heavy to make the use of weightier EPs easier to deal with... yours will not be.

There are of course other peoples EPs I've tried in the past (T6 naglers, a few plossls and similar models to my own but in different focal lengths) but having not had extended periods of use in getting to 'know' them (the EPs) I feel it unfair to give comment. One thing you will notice is the lack of a wide field low power EP in my collection. I have owned a 32mm in the past but found it largely unusable as the majority of my observing is done from a back garden with moderate-low light pollution. The larger exit pupil given provided unsatisfactory levels of contrast and sky glow, though it did perform from darker skies (this is something you'll have to work out for yourself over the coming months based on your observing habits).

A final thing of note is that a lot of them have been purchased S/H... their previous owners may not love them as much as I do. On at least one occasion I am aware of the sale was due to a previous owner simply not being able to get on with the EP (the WO UWAN)... what's good to my eyes may be uncomfortable to use for another.

All EPs are used without coma corrector.

This is not a review, only my impressions of each EP, as I have not had the opportunity to compare similar focal lengths to my own from different manufacturers/EP designs.

Please forgive the brevity of each description... there's lots to get through!

In order of focal length;

Baader Hyperion 21mm

Recently a very little used EP (soon to be replaced by an ES 68 24mm). Bought rather hastily as a reaction to the 8mm. The 68deg frames larger subjects very well, being neither too narrow or uncomfortably wide. I have found that I prefer this AFOV for viewing star clusters as I don’t feel my eye having to wander around (as with my 82degs). A nicely built EP, and for it's focal length not overwhelmingly heavy (unless you compare it to a plossl!). Eye relief WAS comfortable (at around 20mm) but having spent a large amount of time with nagler-esque designs is starting to feel a little a little much. Optical quality is good, the centre of the image showing as much contrast and sharpness as some of the more exotic EPs in my collection. In the 6” f8 (as memory serves) this was an excellent performer. HOWEVER, at f4.7 it begins to show a number of abbreviations at around 50% out (to my eyes). Due to the fact this focal length was primarily chosen for larger star clusters, this becomes somewhat unacceptable. Others may vary on this.

Televue Panoptic 19mm

In contrast to the above this is a much used EP. Needless to say build quality is very 'televue'. As above I particularly like the 68deg AFOV in the lower powers (though this may just be on the cusp). Contrast and sharpness are hard to separate from the Hyperion in the centre of view, but edge abbreviations are far better controlled, perhaps 95% of the FOV is excellent. Eye relief again feels a little distant, but due to the better controlled abbreviations seems to matter less (my eye feels less like it is 'trying' to focus I assume). A favourite for scanning through galaxy clusters, but at 19mm feels a little tight on some of the more open star clusters. This baby is staying!

WO UWAN and ES 82 (16mm and 14mm respectively)

I have decided to deal with these together as they are the closest to a matching pair in my EP collection. The 16mm is slowly becoming redundant due to a personal preference for the 14mm focal length. Definitely the 'work horse' section of my collection. Build quality for both is excellent. Eye relief feels similar in both... moderately tight is the best description. My face feels firmly pressed up against the rubber eye-guard... I like this but many do not. Optically hard to separate... abbreviations are well controlled up to perhaps 85-90% of the view. The ES seems a little warmer in tone to me, but I find I don't mind this. Both show nice contrast and sharpness (the ES perhaps has slightly more contrast, but this may be due to the slightly smaller exit pupil). Due to the optical design they are both very light EPs. Used on small/moderate star clusters, galaxies, nebulae and some globular clusters.

Baader Hyperion 8mm

Very similar to the 21mm in most respects, though edge abbreviations are better controlled no doubt due to the higher focal length. Annoyingly heavy for an 8mm. Soon(ish!) to be replaced due to a preference 82deg + AFOV from the mid-higher EP range. Used primarily on globular clusters and occasional smaller nebulae (including planetary nebs).

Televue radian 6mm

I shouldn't like this eyepiece. The 60 deg AFOV seems (when compared to other EPs in my collection) a little tight. Eye relief is also fairly generous at (around) 20mm... though I have similar feelings about this to the panoptic. Despite this, I would feel very reluctant to part with it. At 6mm, the tuth of the matter is this EP does not get used all that often (I'm not particularly one for higher power observing), but when conditions allow the view it gives on planetary nebulas, double stars and (on rare occasion) planets is just a joy to behold. I am aware there are currently better EPs available (the Delos range springs to mind), but for the moment I am happy with it’s performance, and see no reason to replace it in the near future.

As you can see I'm not really a solar system observer, so this has a huge impact on the equipment I use.

What I hope you have gathered from this is the vast amount of decision making that goes in to choosing an eye piece. It is not simply a matter of 'which one is the best'... there really is no best, only what is best for YOU. Just as a helping hand, I've made a list of possible considerations you might want to make over the coming months with regards to EP selection. The list is not exhaustive, they are just what I personally see as MY primary considerations.

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  What sort of observing do you do? This will have some impact on the focal lengths you chose. It will also other features such as AFOV.

  
  
  
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  Where do you observe? Darker skies will allow you to push your exit pupil right up to 7mm (unfortunately we don’t go to 11 in astronomy!). However, even the smallest amount of LP will reduce contrast significantly at this range. If you mainly observe from a garden then you may wish to consider compromising a lower focal length for increased contrast.

  
  
  
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  What sort of eye relief? Would you prefer more, less, or about the same as your current EPs?

  
  
  
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  What AFOV do you prefer? Dobsonian mounts tend to favour higher AFOVs, but this will depend on what you find comfortable.

  
  
  
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  What abbreviations am I prepared to put up with? Most EP designs are a compromise to some extent, and all have their quirks. Some find certain abbreviations more acceptable than others.

  
  
  
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  Weight and design; Some EP designs are VERY heavy... are you prepared to address balance issues with your telescope? What sort of eye-cup design do you find most comfortable? Are ergonomics important to you?

  
  
  
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  What optics do I have? This is a HUGE consideration, as different EPs perform very differently in different telescopes. Make sure any reviews you read are used in conjunction with a similar telescope to your own... otherwise you may be sorely disappointed by your new EP!

  
  
  
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  How much are you willing to spend? Sometimes the deciding factor in EP choice... but remember there's always the second hand market!

  
  
  

There are I'm sure many other considerations to make, but hopefully this will give you something to think about when making your decision. Remember, even the very best of EPs will perform poorly if used by the wrong person and in the wrong context.

Hope this goes some way to helping with your decision making.

Clear skies,

Andy.