Tal 100RS vs 127 MAK?

[Shure]

Hi,

As every beginner I've been around the houses trying to decide which scope will be best for me and I seem to have nailed it down to these:

TAL 100RS with EQ5

SW 127MAK(or Celestron) with Synscan

If you were to buy only one scope as a beginner which should it be?

Thanks in advance

Chris

[CGolder]

I have owned the mak and its a cracking scope, the AZ Goto mount is slightly disappointing with the 127 and has some wobble, it was too much for me but some don't mind it. I brought a eq3-2 and it was very good. I didn't really miss the go to as the main targets in such a scope tend to be solar system targets and easy to find.

I haven't owed a tal RS but they seem to get good feedback on here.

[nightfisher]

I have a tal00rs and a mak (omc140)

the tal is a proper grab an go scope, very well made, with excellent optics, a very good all rounder, highly recommended.

the 127 mak is also a really good scope but maks suffer long cooldown times, and are not the best for dso (galaxy and nebula)

both scopes are very good

[RikM]

I have a SW 127 Mak and have to agree, it's a lovely little scope for lunar/planetary but the AZ autotrak mount is not the best. I normally put it on my EQ3-2.

Rik

[John]

I'd go for the TAL100 - nothing wrong with the 127 mak but the cooldown times can be long before you are sure you are getting the best views wheras the refractor is ready to go amost straight away. With the UK weather, believe me that is a very useful feature !.

The Mak will also need some form of dew prevention whereas the refractor has a decent dew shield already.

[Shure]

Is it fair to say that the Tal woul be the better all round scope?

If I were to only ever buy the one scope it would also be the better choice given the mount and better DSO possibilities? I presume the mount would also be better if I were to get into imaging?

Apologies for all the questions

EDIT: I should also ask if I am choosing the right refractor at the £400 mark? From the reviews I have read the Tal seems to be a winner but am I missing something.

Thanks

Chris

[RikM]

The Tal would probably be the better 'all rounder' and an EQ5 fitted with an RA drive would at least give you a taste of imaging to see how you like it.

Rik

[CGolder]

The evostar 102 is a nice scope, its the only scope i ever regret selling

[GazOC]

How about the Evostar 120mm? £350ish with a mount and 20mm more aperture than the tal.

Evostar - Skywatcher Evostar 120 (EQ3-2)

[nightfisher]

How about the Evostar 120mm? £350ish with a mount and 20mm more aperture than the tal.

Evostar - Skywatcher Evostar 120 (EQ3-2)

Yep, evo 120 is a good scope, i had mine for about 10years, but for some reason i now prefer the tal100rs, the optics just seem a little sharper, and being a bit lighter it sits better on the mount, its a modern classic, if i could only have one scope i would choose the tal

[perrin6]

Would someone please tell me what the Tal 100 RS & Skymax 127 will show on Jupiter? GRS? Ovals in the NEB. Please give me some idea.

[GazOC]

Going "by the numbers" you'd expect the Tal to be better colour corrected than the larger Skywatcher. Theres also a secondhand ED100 in that sort of price bracket that would better colour corrected than either scope.

[John]

Would someone please tell me what the Tal 100 RS & Skymax 127 will show on Jupiter? GRS? Ovals in the NEB. Please give me some idea.

My 4" Vixen ED refractor will show me that level of detail, under good seeing conditions, so I'm sure the TAL100 and Skymax 127 would too, with a bit of patient observing.

[spaceboy]

Hi Shure

All my advice is based on me asking the same kinds of questions at one time. Having owned a 127 MAK and extensive searching of the internet for reviews and some sound guidance from other SGL members.

There are so many factors to take in to consideration when buying scopes. You should try to look down the time line and consider what it is you want from the scope in the long run. Will it ever be housed in an observatory, do you want to image - observe & image or just observe. How much do you really want to spend ? how much experience have you had observing ? and what are your IT skills ?

THE MOST IMPORTANT QUESTION.... Have you ever observed / imaged before and if not what expectations do you have ??

For serious imaging you will need the sturdiest mount money can buy, ED optics and then you can spend a small fortune on imaging equipment. You will also probably need to have a fair bit of knowledge in IT / photography to get the best from your images.

For observing & imaging almost the same applies but depending on how far you want to take the imaging you could get OK images from relatively cheap modded web cams and achromatic refractor / MAK* or even a reflector.

For observing you can make do with a suitably rated EQ/AIZ mount and the TAL or MAK. *Depending on if you have the scope set up outside permanently will be the deciding factor to which of these you choose.

The 127 MAK will in my mind no doubt out perform the RS100 and although they both have roughly the same focal length the MAK has greater aperture (more light to the EP) so will allow fainter magnitude stars to reach the eye. The downside of the MAK is they are dew magnets and unless you have an obsy you will be looking at between 1 - 3 hrs for it to cool down to the level you would get it's best views. The Tal should take around 1hr depending for obvious reasons where the scopes are stored inside.

For the size the MAK is an absolutely amazing piece of kit which has been reviewed to give some of the sharpest views free from false colour on the market. It will perform visually and give superb images but this is no grab and go scope so unless you have some method of keeping it outside I would go with the RS100 as you will find you will get more use out of it. But again this raises question to if you want an image set up or visual. The Tal has some of the best optics you can get is superb as far as achromatic go. It would be a good choice for budget imaging but if it's visual you require aperture is often king. A Evostar 120 by nature should offer more than the Tal RS100 as there is 3/4" more light gathering aperture but due to the increase in glass you also get an increase in CA & false colour which can to some people become a distraction when viewing brighter objects ("or so I'm told") and will not provide an great platform for imaging in the future. For visual observing, reflectors really come in to play as they offer large aperture for more light grabbing. I take it from your question you have not considered a reflector ?

I hope this helps and has given you some thing to think about.

SPACEBOY

[Shure]

Hi Spaceboy,

I was considering the SW 200p but I had ruled this out due to its size presuming that its too big to be a good grab and go scope. I haven't actually been able to see these scopes in the flesh as yet. It was todays plan but being a bank holiday my local shop is closed.

The scope will be primarily used for observing only in which I'm guessing the 200p will win hands down but how is it as a grab and go scope?

I have no experience at all so I will be learining from scratch...

Any advice is more than welcome.

Thanks for all the responses so far.

Thanks

Chris

[ollypenrice]

I really think you have to handle them and look through them. Few people live far from an astronomical society and there you will get to see a big selection for sure.

Google Federation of Astronomical Societies for a list of clubs.

Olly

[kniclander]

Hi Spaceboy,

I was considering the SW 200p but I had ruled this out due to its size presuming that its too big to be a good grab and go scope. I haven't actually been able to see these scopes in the flesh as yet. It was todays plan but being a bank holiday my local shop is closed.

The scope will be primarily used for observing only in which I'm guessing the 200p will win hands down but how is it as a grab and go scope?

I have no experience at all so I will be learining from scratch...

Any advice is more than welcome.

Thanks for all the responses so far.

Thanks

Chris

not sure if you've decided against a dob (apologies if you have) but an 8" dob is pretty "grab and go" and in terms of performance you are right that it will outperform the others .. the downside is (if you see it as a downside) that you have to nudge it to keep what you're looking at in view. For me that limits the max mag to about 150 to 200x although I know others are comfortable using their dobs at much higher powers. Unless you have unlimited funds, there's always a trade off...

[CGolder]

I would agree you need to see these scopes in the flesh, the 100 is a very long scope.

[Astro_Baby]

Deviating a little, the SW200 especially when coupled with an EQ mount is absolutely NOT a grab and go unless you are a bodybuilder. It's big and relatively heavy when on an EQ mount. The counterweights alone are 10kg and the scope is almost the same weight, throw in the tripod and the mount plus any accessories, eyepieces, power etc and it's portable bit it's not what I would consider grab and go by a long way.

I can't say about the 127 not having owned one, I have owned a smaller Mak (celestron nexstar 4) which has a better mount than the 127 and it was a good little scope but the TAL could outperform it.

It's a tough call on this, between the two scopes the OP asked about. The TAL would have the better optics I suspect but the 127 would have GoTo. You could upgrade the EQ5 to GoTo later I guess.

The TAL would be a bigger scope, it's around a meter long and quite heavy but that's down to Rssian bombproof building.

Personally in would go for the TAL as the new ones have a great focuser, killer finderscope and come with really good quality accessories like the diagonal and the EPs.

It really is a tough call though.

I am passionate about my own TAL and if I could only keep one of my scopes it would be the Tal I would keep ( my other scopes are a SW200, a Skymax 180 pro, two classic Unitrons and until recently the Nexstar 4)

[spaceboy]

I was considering the SW 200p but I had ruled this out due to its size presuming that its too big to be a good grab and go scope.

As Astro_baby says... this is no grab and go scope. The views are superb but hassle of tripods, counter weights and polar alignment makes this a more plenty of time to spare back garden scope.

not sure if you've decided against a dob (apologies if you have) but an 8" dob is pretty "grab and go" and in terms of performance you are right that it will outperform the others .. the downside is (if you see it as a downside) that you have to nudge it to keep what you're looking at in view. For me that limits the max mag to about 150 to 200x although I know others are comfortable using their dobs at much higher powers. Unless you have unlimited funds, there's always a trade off...

An 8" Dob is a better option regards a more portable and large aperture instrument but again it's not a small scope to lug around. Dobs do require modifications to get them just the way you want them ( smooth AZI movement for 1 ) and the constant nudging is not everyones cup of Earl Grey.

I have no experience at all so I will be learning from scratch...

Any advice is more than welcome.

As Olly suggested you should find your self a local club before you spend a penny. Do not get in to astronomy with any misconceptions to what you are going to see. If possible find a club and a member scope that would be in your price range and make sure they don't have big money EP's in the focuser. See how difficult set up and packing away is. Ask what modifications they want or have done. This way you will get a better idea what a scope in your budget will offer. There is no substitute for actual experience. Everyones perception is different and what we may all see as an amazing smudge on the sky may be a WHAT??? or WOW!!! moment for you.

Regards portability and views you will find you either get one or the other. Most members signatures list several scopes and this can be one of the reasons. No one scope will give you everything you want so you have to make a compromise to what it is you want most. If you want both my suggestion would be buy a pair of quality binoculars for portability and get a large aperture scope for in the back garden. (SORRY if I am assuming you have a garden) Binoculars allow you to see plenty of objects in the sky but if there is something you really want to check out you have the scope. If you keep to a sensible size you could always take the scope to a dark site if absolutely necessary. Either way you could get the binoculars now and look in to getting a scope after you have had a chance to look through some.

SPACEBOY

[Shure]

Just thought I'd give abit of an update to this thread.

I'm still trying to decide on the scope although this is now looking more like the 200p dob.

My heart wants the Tal the head wants the 200p and the MAK is coming in contention for the GOTO as I am also wanting to try some lunar/planatary imaging with a webcam.

Chances are it'll be the Dob but I am still deliberating. In the mean time I have ordered the Opticron Aspheric WA bins for general use.

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

Don't you love the way we can confuse the hell out of anyone asking for an opinion on just two scopes, and within 5 or 6 posts at least 4 new options are proposed

Still, it does make sense to consider you options.

Considering the set-up time of an 8" EQ-mounted scope, I would not worry too much. I can set my C8 on Great Polaris mount up in around 5-10 minutes. I have the counterweights in place on the mount, and the angle of the equatorial axis set correctly, so it is a matter of setting up the tripod, attaching the mount to the tripod, and attaching the scope to the mount. If I want to do visual stuff, just pointing the equatorial axis north is sufficient to track visually.Otherwise, I set the polar alignment using the built-in polar-axis finder (another 5 min maximum). The main issue is cooling down time, which I shorten considerably by storing my kit in a garage, which is usually around outside temperature, or just above.

That said, the Mak is probably the more compact of the two, so the easiest to take along on vacation. But then I am a catadioptrics kind of guy.

[Stardust]

I've got both of those scopes.

The 127 is very compact, I can pop it on my Porta mount for quick looks. and will stow away nicely in the car for holidays. Lightweight portable set up.

The new TAL100RS with its crayford focusser is in MHO a far better allrounder. Yes you need a more stable mount but I think it's the better bet. If I had to sell one of these scopes I'd keep the TAL.

I had one of my best session on Jupiter with the TAL at Kelling last September.

It was around 2AM and I spent over an hour observing. I had the GRS and structure in some of the cloud belts. It stunned me, I wasn't expecting that.

I had a couple of people looking and one commented that there was a bit of colour fringing. His mate said yes ok but this £1000 cheaper than your scope and just as sharp.

You really wouldn't be dissapointed with the TAL, I asked all these questions before buying mine and very glad I bought one. They come up secondhand, infact there is 100r on ebay local to me. But having had the new RS to compare aginst the older R,

I'd still shell out on the RS even though I like secondhand prices. The focusser is sooo much better. It must look good because some who was selling gear at Kelling asked what focusser I'd put on it.

Hope that's of some help.

[PaulG]

Just thought I'd give abit of an update to this thread.

I'm still trying to decide on the scope although this is now looking more like the 200p dob.

My heart wants the Tal the head wants the 200p and the MAK is coming in contention for the GOTO as I am also wanting to try some lunar/planatary imaging with a webcam.

Chances are it'll be the Dob but I am still deliberating. In the mean time I have ordered the Opticron Aspheric WA bins for general use.

Good mix of telescopes under consideration.

When I was in the same boat I asked myself

What did I want to point my telescope at ?

Did I want to view only or image ?

In my case it was simple, I wanted to view planetary only and image the Moon.

The telescopes I now own are a 120mm Refractor and a 127 MAk.

Out of the two I would keep the Refractor as visually the Refractor is more pleasing to my eyes.

Good luck with your choice.

Paul

[GrahamS]

Go with your heart, you'll not regret it. Get the Dob in the future, the scope will complement each other. Thats what I intend to do. I went for the Tal, not regretted it.