What is the future of the well known names such as Tele Vue, Takahashi, Astro Physics, TEC, Pentax, Vixen etc ?

[Stu]

12 minutes ago, icpn said:

I think TV are finished as they have not had anything new out now for a few years and seemed to concentrate then on night vision devices then. I doubt Uncle Al is designing anything new so they will just survive on what designs they have now.

The question that arises for me there is what new designs could there be? They have most bases covered nicely so anything new would likely be more about marketing than actual real gains.

[Ags]

Well, I think sales of the Nagler 3-6 zoom have probably crashed recently...

[Nik271]

As far as I see the high end brands have a very specific (and quite stable) customer base: the visual observers. It is in visual where the top quality of the optic matters most, most imagers will be happy with 1/4 wave error on axis as long as the focus plane is flat and free from aberrations off axis. 

Additinally where one sees most benefits of good quality glass is at high matgnifications, planetary and double stars, which are not affected by light pollution and can be done from the cities where most of us live. 

So I don't think the customers base will dwindle, sufficiently many people will always want to look through a telescope with their own eyes. And as they get more experience they will want to get a premium scope for the best view possible. Hence there will always be a market for top quality scopes.

Now whether the existing brands will manage to keep up on top is another matter, especially those that rely on a specific individual's reputation. I hope they do. Takahashi will probably be fine (provided they get on with it at last and upgrade their focusers 🙂  )

 

 

 

Edited September 29 by Nik271

[John]

1 hour ago, Ags said:

Well, I think sales of the Nagler 3-6 zoom have probably crashed recently...

Interestingly, I managed to acquire a nice used one recently and I'm presently comparing it with the Svbony 3-8mm zoom, when the clouds allow 🙂

If it was not for the rise in interest in night vision devices used with scopes I wonder if TV might have dropped their 2 inch 55mm Plossl by now ?

 

 

 

 

Edited September 29 by John

[Bivanus]

2 hours ago, icpn said:

I think TV are finished as they have not had anything new out now for a few years and seemed to concentrate then on night vision devices then. I doubt Uncle Al is designing anything new so they will just survive on what designs they have now.

Well now, that of course depends on one's definition of 'survive' , because for some people survival is eating less than Wagyu A5 and Beluga Caviar , as per 'what designs they have now' tell me the truth brother , would you not buy into a little set like the one below , dreamed by a CN user ? Because I would 🤩

 

[Emperor!Takahashi!]

I've enjoyed reading this thread. Something that interests me is the various ways in which humans experience temporality. Our minds define our experience of the world with sets of reference points (telescope manufacturers in this case, although there are so many examples from other domains of life). But we live in a world in which those reference points shift faster than (what I think is) most people's ability to reconstruct an understandable and comforting reality using other reference points. And this causes diverse emotional responses, which I find complex, compelling, and beautiful.

I think we often overestimate the extent to which our reference points will remain relevant. For me, there's a melancholy that arises when I imagine that an elegant thing like a carefully crafted optical telescope may be approaching the end of its heyday. There are so many elegant things in museums. I wonder what their makers and owners expected.

[Bivanus]

3 hours ago, Emperor!Takahashi! said:

I wonder what their makers and owners expected

You can bet that the ubiquitousness of things being made in China was NOT among those expectations. I have a feeling that Mr. Carl Zeiss is spinning in his grave so fast that it could be used as a power source.

[Mr Spock]

Move with the times or become a dinosaur. There'll always be a market for niche, boutique products, but mass production is catching up. 

So many inexpensive products are now so close to the very best, those well known manufacturers will have to adapt to survive.

[JTEC]

Much talk of premium items being caught up by less expensive mass produced ones - and the astro community has certainly benefitted from this. But there is a difference between catching up with and equalling.  Observing conditions and the vagaries of human vision can make the differences between good and excellent optics and mechanics elusive or even impossible to detect, except on a test bench. It remains the case that some scopes, say, really are better than others, and when everything lines up, that performance edge becomes apparent. It would be interesting to know whether developing technologies might soon enable manufacturers to produce premium quality products hand over fist and more cheaply - and whether they would want to bother. And, if they could, would they then mark the product up to premium prices?
For now, I think that more often than not and with few exceptions, the differences are real and more than ‘niche’. I’m trying hard to think of premium items I’ve owned or used that have been equalled by cheaper equivalents.  YMMV, of course.  Can you think of any?  Try these for starters 🙂

Premium Item                                      Inexpensive Equivalent catching it up

Takahashi FC-100DZ                                                    ?

TEC140 fluorite                                                             ?

Televue 10mm Delos                                                    ?

Televue  6mm Ethos                                                     ?
 

etc etc

 

 

[dweller25]

Good question from the OP.

Here is how I see the future….

1. Vixen - will decline into obscurity 😕

2. Astrophysics is Roland Christen, when he retires AP may fold 😕

3. Stellarvue seem to be open to change and will prosper 👍

4. Takahashi will rely on their optical reputation and the competition will catch up (they are not that far behind now ! ) 🥴

5. TEC will become the new AP 😁

BUT - If I could predict the future I should have won the Lottery by now !! 🤣

 

Edited September 29 by dweller25

[omo]

16 minutes ago, JTEC said:

I’m trying hard to think of premium items I’ve owned or used that have been equalled by cheaper equivalents. 

The 30mm UFF eyepiece could be one. I've never owned a 27 Pan, i liked the 35 though.

[M40]

10 hours ago, Emperor!Takahashi! said:

elegant thing like a carefully crafted optical telescope

I was thinking about the emperor's post whilst listening to some music and it gave me hope that the names will endure. I've always found it relaxing to listen to music without being an audiophile. We have always bought well but I could never justify to myself the extra expense of buying a top end piece of kit as there was always a level of noise so I didn't see the point. But the audiophile market exists alongside very good mass market items.

My noise of yesterday has now been replaced with time and weather constraints and I find myself in a rush to see things. So, once again I can't justify to myself the extra expense of top end kit. When I get it into my brain to slow down and just look, I might just search out that elegant thing. This all leads me to have confidence that at least some of the names will be there.

[Sunshine]

9 hours ago, Mr Spock said:

those well known manufacturers will have to adapt to survive.

And there is the dilemma, would you want the newly released TSA-120 mass market version costing half as much? those who are not experienced enough to know the difference will eat them up. Those with SGL accounts will save up a little longer and opt for the classic version. There will always be a market for the pricey, premium brands as those who are experienced will know why they’re paying more.

[Paz]

Could it be that the larger manufacturers have done the maths on the optimum price/quality point for profitability  and whatever that is is where they are focused. Then if any elements of the top end of the market aren't profitable enough maybe they won't go there.