m31 on a great night wasted because I'm a numpty

[Bluesboystig]

Last night was super clear so I tried my first m31. Faffed around failing alignment and got all flustered, so in the madness I didn't realise the camera was set on JPEG and not RAW!!😱 Anyway, I processed the files to see what came out of them and to get used to the process. This is my first m31 (heavily messed up), but just wanted to share. Equipment: WO z61 with flattener, Canon EOS 2000d, Star Adventurer GTI, Optolong L-Pro. 67x70" subs at ISO 800 (no calibration frames because I wanted to calibrate manually on Siril but realised I have no idea how to do that, if anyone can point me in the right direction that would be great). Processed in Siril: crop, background extraction, noise reduction, green noise reduction, stretching. GIMP: some more gentle stretching. Considering it was from a bunch of JPEGs and not calibrated I'm weirdly happy with it? It's of course very noisy, and a total scrap.. 

 

[Swoop1]

A tad noisy it may be but scrap it aint!

[callisto]

6 minutes ago, Swoop1 said:

A tad noisy it may be but scrap it aint!

Ditto 

[Mark2022]

Hardly "scrap". If I compare what I produce to what others achieve (and  I do) I think all of my efforts are 'scrap' but the thing is, if I just appreciate what I have captured on its own merits, I'm delighted. It's like if you play guitar and then compare yourself with Nuno Bettencourt.

[alacant]

On 15/09/2023 at 12:43, Bluesboystig said:

calibrate manually on Siril

Hi

Good idea. 2000d? So you need only take flat frames in camera. Subtract the offset  manually on the calibration tab. 

Both In-camera bias and dark frames on modern eos' serve only to introduce extra artefacts, especially but not limited to noise, so making processing more difficult than necessary. 

Of course, try both ways to see which you prefer..But hey, the image is good as it is.

Cheers and HTH

Edited September 20, 2023 by alacant
Spel

[Albir phil]

I think that ain't scrap if it is then I give up.

[tomato]

The subject is nicely framed, it is focussed well, the core is not too overblown in comparison to the outer arms region, the dust lanes are visible, the satellite galaxies show up well, the stars are tight and there is good colour. 
Where is the scrap in that?👍🏼

[Bluesboystig]

2 hours ago, alacant said:

Hi

Good idea. 2000d? So you need only take flat frames in camera. Subtract the offset  manually on the calibration tab. 

Both In-camera bias and dark frames on modern eos' serve only to introduce extra artefacts, so making processing more difficult than necessary. 

Of course, try both ways to see which you prefer.

Cheers and HTH

So to do this, do I need to preprocess without using the scripts? I.e going step by step manually? Or do I use a script without DBF and then calibrate manually on that tab? Apologies if the question is a bit stupid, total beginner here.. Thanks so much

[Clarkey]

Overall it is not a bad result at all. Certainly better than my first few attempts. Every astrophotographer makes these sort of mistakes sometimes - just live and learn... I took a whole night of luminance frames once.......in blue😭

[alacant]

It's quicker to load the flat sequence, enter the offset value,  pre-process and stack.

Use the flat you just stacked to calibrate the light frames with the same offset; this time register before stacking.

That's it.

To begin with Siril, especially as there's so little to do for DSLR images anyway, I'd recommend doing everything manually. An understanding of what's happening and why is important for troubleshooting when the scripts don't work, and (I find it) quicker anyway... By the time you've moved stuff to where the script expects it to be etc. etc...

HTH

Edited September 15, 2023 by alacant

[Bluesboystig]

1 hour ago, alacant said:

It's quicker to load the flat sequence, enter the offset value,  pre-process and stack.

Use the flat you just stacked to calibrate the light frames with the same offset; this time register before stacking.

That's it.

To begin with Siril, especially as there's so little to do for DSLR images anyway, I'd recommend doing everything manually. An understanding of what's happening and why is important for troubleshooting when the scrips don't work, and (I find it) quicker anyway... By the time you've moved stuff to where the script expects it to be etc. etc...

HTH

Brilliant! And no bias frames either? I’ll give it a go for sure, thanks for the help.. I’m sure dr google will help answer the long list of questions I‘ll have for sure

[alacant]

12 hours ago, Bluesboystig said:

no bias frames either

No. Just enter the bias value. Instead of a bias filename, simply enter the offset:

=2048

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by alacant

[Paul M]

I'm not geared up for M31, but I'd be mighty pleased with this image.

The thing is, it's big, real big, but it ain't easy!

[alacant]

5 minutes ago, Bluesboystig said:

google

Everything you need is here:

https://siril.readthedocs.io/en/latest/

 

[Bluesboystig]

4 minutes ago, alacant said:

Everything you need is here:

https://siril.readthedocs.io/en/latest/

 

Thank you so much!!

[teoria_del_big_bang]

And I thought I was hard on myself, no way is that worthless. We all have sessions that do not go just as we hoped, sometimes due to weather or equipment issues but more often than not due to issues of our own making. I think as we progress these self induced issues get less and less but certainly in my case never go altogether.  Important thing is that we learn from these issues and endeavour to make sure they do not occur again.

I am impressed that despite finding out the images were the wrong format you still took the time to process them and did not just throw the towel in straight away and by doing so still produced  a very acceptable image.

So please lighten up and don't be so hard on yourself, all in all a good effort and next time with correct settings you know it will be better still 🙂 

Steve

Edited September 15, 2023 by teoria_del_big_bang

[Mandy D]

I concur with @teoria_del_big_bang. We learn more from things going wrong than we can ever learn from them going right first time, every time!

[Bluesboystig]

Thanks @teoria_del_big_bang and @Mandy D, I really appreciate your encouraging comments (and everyone else’s for that matter). I think I’m just keen to get sharp results and get rid of all that noise. I’m currently 2h into shooting the Heart Nebula, clear UK skies are such a rarity. Hopefully I’m getting something useful

[Mandy D]

@Bluesboystig Good luck with the Heart Nebula!

[Paul M]

And another thing, it's important that we remain happy to share our images/thoughts/problems, so that we can all continue to learn and not set such a high bar that newcomers are intimidated by other's efforts.

I'd like to think that I'm a trailblazer in that matter! I'll share images, however trashy they are, if only because there is some aspect that particularly interests me. An example being sharing an image that contains just a few pixels, barely above the visually painful noise, of a gravitationally lensed supernova. 

Surely there is something to be learned from every image? Whether that be some esoteric processing technique that might not interest astronomers, or something purely astronomical that doesn't interest imagers.

[AstroMuni]

On 15/09/2023 at 11:43, Bluesboystig said:

This is my first m31 (heavily messed up), but just wanted to share.

Thats a great image and you can even make out NGC206 in it. You should be proud of what you have achieved 👍

Edited September 20, 2023 by AstroMuni

[Bluesboystig]

Planning to image m31 again asap properly, and ideally putting the hours in! Can't wait