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JWST Jupiter

CraigT82

By CraigT82
in The Astro Lounge

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bomberbaz

bomberbaz

Posted
Posted

Loving the aurora diffractions, incredible piece of kit that will continue to blow peoples minds.

I believe there is some doubt building as to the validity of the BB theory given the sizes and density of galaxies in the early universe, simply too much of everything to match existing theories!

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cajen2

cajen2

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If the BB theory is proved wrong, it may well be unnecessary to invoke dark matter and dark energy, which I've always been deeply suspicious of. The only problem is accounting for red shift.

Imagine that they decide there was no BB and the universe is in steady state. There's be cosmologists leaping out of windows all over the world! 🤣

Edited by cajen2
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OK Apricot

OK Apricot

Posted
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1 minute ago, cajen2 said:

If the BB theory is proved wrong, it may well be unnecessary to invoke dark matter and dark energy, which I've always been deeply suspicious of. The only problem is accounting for red shift.

Imagine that they decide there was no BB and the universe is in steady state. There's be cosmologists leaping out of windows all over the world! 🤣

I mean, this kind of gives me chills. You get so used to a prevailing theory and take it at face value, but then you remember; astronomers used to think Andromeda was a nebula within the galaxy and the galaxy was the universe, until new data and theories arrived... 

Even if not and models can be rejiggled, JWST is something else entirely! An instrument like this at our disposal...  😳

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Sunshine

Sunshine

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1 hour ago, OK Apricot said:

I mean, this kind of gives me chills. You get so used to a prevailing theory and take it at face value, but then you remember; astronomers used to think Andromeda was a nebula within the galaxy and the galaxy was the universe, until new data and theories arrived... 

Even if not and models can be rejiggled, JWST is something else entirely! An instrument like this at our disposal...  😳

Regarding the BB, I firmly believe that just as in the last thousand years, long held theories were proved wrong so too today we may well be proved wrong about long standing theories. Our universe is far from being revealed to us and with every miraculous instrument like the JWST is, new light will be cast on our view of cosmology. Now this doesn’t mean I don’t believe the BB theory, just that we as humans have held many theories to be fact which in time have been toppled. Remember the “force” of gravity? just to name one.

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DaveL59

DaveL59

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So if there really was a big bang and as a result all of the stars etc and us formed but its still expanding, then as per a regular explosion, won't at some stage when the energy pushing outward runs out it'd all (well some/most) collapse back toward the originating centre. So we could've have saved $10bn and just waited a while longer and all those interesting bits will be a lot closer for us to observe... 😉 

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andrew s

andrew s

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

So if there really was a big bang and as a result all of the stars etc and us formed but its still expanding, then as per a regular explosion, won't at some stage when the energy pushing outward runs out it'd all (well some/most) collapse back toward the originating centre. So we could've have saved $10bn and just waited a while longer and all those interesting bits will be a lot closer for us to observe... 😉 

Well it was thought that was a possibility  but the expansion is now dominated by dark energy that does not dilute as the Universe expands so the current view is it will go on expanding for ever.

Regards Andrew 

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Malpi12

Malpi12

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1 hour ago, cajen2 said:

and the universe is in steady state.  There's be cosmologists leaping out of windows all over the world! 🤣

I am sure you meant only some of them, the others of us who fondly remember Fred Hoyle will have a big smile :)

 

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cajen2

cajen2

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11 minutes ago, andrew s said:

Well it was thought that was a possibility  but the expansion is now dominated by dark energy that does not dilute as the Universe expands so the current view is it will go on expanding for ever.

Regards Andrew 

.....if it actually exists, that is....😉

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bomberbaz

bomberbaz

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Hmm perhaps in my statement above which sparked this BB theory discussion I should have been more precise in what I meant. 

There are some who are thinking the actual mechanics for the BB aftermath are not as first thought, I wasn't meaning the BB never happened, just that it "might" have developed differently following the "dark ages".

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andrew s

andrew s

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36 minutes ago, cajen2 said:

.....if it actually exists, that is....😉

All scientific theories are subject to revision on the basis of new observations and JWST should provide many new insights just as the discovery of the CMB favoured the BB theory over the SS theory. 

In the meantime it is wise, in my opinion,  to be clear what is the accepted best theory and which are more speculative or fringe. 

Regards Andrew 

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cajen2

cajen2

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Just stirring the pot....😉

Seriously, though, I've been expecting a cosmological paradigm shift for a while now. I wonder when the tipping point will come: if the JWST discovers more things that are problematical for current theories....

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Paul M

Paul M

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I'm just about of an age that I remeber, at least by the books vailable to me at the time (low-end secondary modern education), the Steady State theory being on an almost equal footing to the Big Bang. And whilst I realise that the BB fits observational evidence and theoretical models reasonably well, I have a school boy hankering for Steady State cosmology.

Am I alone in hoping that JWST delves close enough to the "edge" that a new pysics is required to explain observation?

Lets do away with dark energy and dark mattter.... please! 🥳

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andrew s

andrew s

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5 minutes ago, Paul M said:

I'm just about of an age that I remeber, at least by the books vailable to me at the time (low-end secondary modern education), the Steady State theory being on an almost equal footing to the Big Bang. And whilst I realise that the BB fits observational evidence and theoretical models reasonably well, I have a school boy hankering for Steady State cosmology.

Am I alone in hoping that JWST delves close enough to the "edge" that a new pysics is required to explain observation?

Lets do away with dark energy and dark mattter.... please! 🥳

What would you like to replace them? 😊

Regards Andrew 

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