Who uses their refractor without a diagonal?

[iPeace]

Next session, I am going to try this. Just interested in who does this, and why.

Just to verify: this does give newtonian image orientation, correct? So you need to reverse direction on both axes when hopping or tracking?

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

It does give Newtonian orientation. I only use the refractor without diagonal when imaging

[John]

Always use a diagonal with my fracs. Happy to adjust when using the dob.

Only time that I don't use a diagonal is when initially checking collimation or optical axis alignment.

Good luck with the experiement Mike

[Star Struck]

I tried it with binoviewers to avoid having to use a 1.6x or 2x barlow to get focus.

Bit uncomfortable, so probably will not do it too often.

Tony

[iPeace]

Just to expand on why I would consider this at all. I actually prefer correct-image views, and have a very nice amici prism diagonal for this. But what if I didn't, and there was not one to be found? If I was resigned to not having correct image, then why put a diagonal in the path at all? I have yet to try a newtonian, but if all of those who use and love them can cope with the rotated image, then why not? Granted the mount will have to be a bit higher, but otherwise?

[Alien 13]

The view will be the same as a straight through finder so it could be easy to adapt if you use both.

Alan

[iPeace]

3 minutes ago, Alien 13 said:

The view will be the same as a straight through finder so it could be easy to adapt if you use both.

Alan

Hadn't thought of that. Have yet to try a straight through finder, as well.

[DRT]

1 hour ago, iPeace said:

Who uses their refractor without a diagonal?

A Pirate?

[iPeace]

1 minute ago, DRT said:

A Pirate?

The advantages just keep piling up!

[DirkSteele]

I have tried it a few times.  I think there is an improvement in the image seen in the eyepiece, in particular less scatter, which improves contrast (its not huge, but noticeable) but at remotely high altitudes it becomes quite uncomfortable and my neck is good a holding a grudge so I do not really do it.  Just an occasional experiment.

However, if I had one of these I might consider it more often!

[iPeace]

5 minutes ago, DirkSteele said:

I have tried it a few times.  I think there is an improvement in the image seen in the eyepiece, in particular less scatter, which improves contrast (its not huge, but noticeable) but at remotely high altitudes it becomes quite uncomfortable and my neck is good a holding a grudge so I do not really do it.  Just an occasional experiment.

However, if I had one of these I might consider it more often!

Agreed, it would be a sedentary affair, as with binoculars on a deck chair. We'll see how it goes.

[Dave In Vermont]

I suppose that if I had the scope pictured below, it would be more doable.

Otherwise I'd need to start practicing Yoga.....

Dave

 

 

[John]

Apparently straight through viewing is popular in Japan. Don't know why this is but Japanese scopes are usually supplied with extension tubes which allow eyepieces to come to focus without a diagonal. My Tak and Vixen have this facility.

I'm getting curious now. I'll have to extend the legs on my Uni 28 tripod and give it a go !

 

[dweller25]

I would think straight through viewing with the simplified rear optical setup will give slightly better views.

BUT - it's not for me - my back complains too much

[iPeace]

3 minutes ago, John said:

Apparently straight through viewing is popular in Japan. Don't know why this is but Japanese scopes are usually supplied with extension tubes which allow eyepieces to come to focus without a diagonal. My Tak and Vixen have this facility.

I'm getting curious now. I'll have to extend the legs on my Uni 28 tripod and give it a go !

 

That's the spirit!

[chiltonstar]

I do with my f13 4" frac, looking at planets (generally low angle!) as it is reasonably comfortable. Not near the meridian though!!

Chris

[iPeace]

8 minutes ago, Dave In Vermont said:

I suppose that if I had the scope pictured below, it would be more doable.

Otherwise I'd need to start practicing Yoga.....

Dave

 

 

And how about with your Mak?

[Stu]

I think @Timebandit does this with his 120ED

[John]

Of my scopes, the Vixen 102mm F/6.5 seems the best candidate for this. The eye lens of the eyepiece is around chest height at that angle. I'll give it a go tonight if clear

[Dave In Vermont]

9 minutes ago, iPeace said:

And how about with your Mak?

With my Mak?! Let's see here.....

1. Build 7-foot pier to hoist it up high on.

2. Find a Dentist's Chair.

Piece o' cake!

Dave

[iPeace]

3 minutes ago, Dave In Vermont said:

With my Mak?! Let's see here.....

1. Build 7-foot pier to hoist it up high on.

2. Find a Dentist's Chair.

Piece o' cake!

Dave

Yes, yes, just thinking you could try it on Jupiter seated behind the Porta, just for the hell of it.

I can see you building your own dentist's chair, but I stray from the point.

[John]

Actually it will be interesting to check out some double stars with the scope in this mode and compare the views with old records such as these from 1855:

 

[iPeace]

I recall Sir Patrick showing us his first scope, a 3" frac, lovely brass job, that one also didn't have a diagonal. Made around 1910.

Things have moved on, but still, if he could make it work and map the Moon...

[iPeace]

19 minutes ago, John said:

Of my scopes, the Vixen 102mm F/6.5 seems the best candidate for this. The eye lens of the eyepiece is around chest height at that angle. I'll give it a go tonight if clear

That setup is just so nice.

[John]

Mind you, this 1990's Japanese postage stamp seems to disprove my theory regarding Japanese observers viewing straight through (I'm just going to slip into my Kimono):