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M57 Central Star

Damo636

By Damo636
in Observing - Discussion

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alan potts

alan potts

Posted
Posted

I tried for 1 hour last night with a selection of Radian's and Nagler's with the 12 inch LX and I checked the collimation, I could not see the center star. It may be worth pointing out thet the sky last night was unbelieveable. I could see stars below the sting with the naked eye, very rare.

It may also be worth saying M57 is almost overhead for me, I guess I must rank as a beginner in the scale on the calulator.

Alan.

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alan potts

alan potts

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Well Damo, again last night I gave it another one and a half hour stint. This time, from time to time I thought I was seeing something, but I would have said it was not in the center of the Ring. Is there some other star in there?

I used a 10mm Radian giving me X 304 and UWA 6.7mm giving me X454, it was the higher power that I thought I could see something, the lower power was more pleasure to view. Just to focus at 454 was not easy.

The sky was again excellent, I don't know the correct way to assess this but if I said I don 't see how it could be better, that will give you some idea. Two night or the run, naked eye star below the sting and you could see the larger star cloud in the Milky Way right down to 5 degrees above the horizon. In short, nights don't come much better than this and I can't be sure I nailed it. It's worth having a go at the next Star Party and post the results.

Alan.

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swamp thing

swamp thing

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Posted

Apparently so, just had a read of S.J. O'Meara,s messier objects and yes there is another star in there.

In fact the other star off centre is fainter?? How bizarre, perhaps the old variable theory on the central star isn't quite dead after all.

Deffinitily worth another look. Sounds like we need a few more people to take up the challenge. Only a 10" scope myself at the moment but if it clears I'll have a crack at it.

Have a look through this too:

http://www.astropix....E_SUM_N/M57.HTM

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alan potts

alan potts

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Last night again I tried, and tried. I have to say for me it was a no show on the center star but I keep seeing a glimmer of something off center. I am beginning to believe it is because I want to see a star. This has got to be taken up at a Star Party!

Sorry chaps,

Weather was again fantastic, I could see M7 without optics, You would never do that in Engalnd.

Alan.

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alan potts

alan potts

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Steve,

Maybe the LX 200 isn't the best 12 inch scope for such a job and maybe my eyes are not what they were 25 years ago. I think with the sky that I have here and to a 95% degree I control my own dark if you know what I mean. I don't see how any one would pick this up from an urban site with any 12 inch scope. I believe it would have to be: in the middle of nowhere, with young eyes, with the same seeing I have here and a good quality 12 inch scope.

It will not stop me looking, time for a bigger gun I think.

Alan.

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Damo636

Damo636

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I have had a few goes at this myself since but cannot say for sure if I have bagged the elusive central star. I say for sure because in the early morning of 11th July (Ihave started keeping notes) the conditions were unexpectedly amazing here (Milky Way clear as a bell) and I spent from midnight until 2.30am observing M57 in the hope of glimpsing the prize. The 14.1 & 14.7 mag stars just beyond the nebula were just about visible with averted vision so I knew the conditions were pretty good. I experimented with different magnifications and on a couple of occasions using the 7mm XW/1.6x Barlow 340x, I thought I glimpsed something just slightly off centre. Now, I would not bet my life it was the central star as it may have been my brain willing me to see something that wasn't really there but it has given me added encouragement to keep trying. I think for a 12" scope to resolve this target its going to take one of those very rare nights of absolutely perfect seeing. Another target I have had a go at in the same region is IC1296. Both these targets are right on the limit of a 12" scopes capabilities apparently with IC1296 actually supposed to be even tougher to resolve. Needless to say, even though I got myself parked in the correct grouping of stars I still couldn't resolve this particular faint fuzzie :embarassed: In fairness though, its not an ideal time of year for faint galaxy hunting so I will return here a little later in the year :smiley:

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Mr Q

Mr Q

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Nice tries Damo and Allan - I guess the article saying at least a 16" can detect it in dark skies may be right but no harm trying though, except for some frustration. That's the way I felt for years unknowingly thinking the star was at about 14th or just under. Now I finally know it wasn't my scope or my observing skills that failed me after all those years and in the end, that was a partial success knowing for sure it IS out of my equipment's grasp.

But there is nothing better than a good challenge to keep our observing skills sharpened. :Envy:

Good luck with 1296!

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John

John

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Posted

It is an interesting thread, this :smiley:

I'll give it a few goes with my 10" Orion Optics which has a decent mirror set with the hi-lux coatings. I'm not that hopeful but having a good session on M57 is hardly a chore :smiley:

When looking for point source objects that are on the edge of visibility (eg: supernovae, faint planetary moons etc) I've found this is when you notice small differences in things like eyepiece light transmission, light scatter within the optical system etc. I think the Pentax XW5mm would be my eyepiece of choice for this mission - the XW's have superb light transmission I've found :smiley:

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alan potts

alan potts

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I agree John, it has got me at it. I had another half hearted try last night but the conditions were only fair at best, still no clouds. Didn't see the center star goes without saying. still had some very nice views of all the clusters in and around Scorpius. Nice part of the sky shame it's not overhead.

Alan.

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John

John

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I had a try at this last night. Great views of M57 but no sign of any stars in the central region. I got the brightish one to one side of it and could just pick out a pair on the other side which looked around mag 12 or so. Looking at photos the central star will be a fair bit fainter again than these so my limiting mag last night was not enough. This was with the 10" F/4.8 Orion Optics newt with magnifications between 200x and 342x

I agree that the nebulosity in the central part of the nebula is going to add to the challenge as it will drown out a faint star embedded in it.

Many other lovely objects on show last night though so far from a disappointing session :grin:

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swamp thing

swamp thing

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I had a bash last time out with my 10" F/4.5 Dob (@ 240x) from a VLM 6 site with steady seeing. No luck, although I did get the same result as you Alan. Kept thinking I could occasionally glimpse something off centre. Strange, what is this effect.......wishful thinking possibly :D

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alan potts

alan potts

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I am sure it is visible with a 16 inch. I am sure it would be from my house as there is no light from cities, or towns for that matter. I tried for it last night but just got set up on and after ten minutes it was obvious that a thunderstorm was going to spoilt it. I when out even though it had been stormy all day, these days give me the clearest skies. It is almost as it the rain washes all the rubbish out of the air. Anyway I didn't get on M57 long enough to see anything.

I don't know but I believe this is an object that needs some time to see this star, I don't believe it is a 5 minute job even if your eyes are dark adaped.

i'm not giving up!

Alan.

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