Beginners set up £1k

[Rdl81]

Hi all

I am looking to get into astronomy and would like to purchase a telescope. I am a keen amateur photographer with a canon 5d3 dslr. I would like to get a set up that is a good starting point for around this amount of money and then look to build upon it in the future if I get into it. Any recommendations in terms of equipment and any useful resources in where to get started in terms of how to use it correctly etc. I am. Ew to this forum but I have found forums so helpful in the past and I hope I can become a useful member of this one.

Regards

RDL

[baggywrinkle]

High and welcome to SGL.

Do you want to do visual or imaging?

£1K is a reaonable budget for both. But the scopes required are quite different and imaging requires a good EQ driven mount. Visual would allow a purchase of a very good Goto Dob whcih at a pinch would allow up to 20 secs exposures for DSO work and not much more.

Get a copy of Make Every Photon Count, it is a well recommended book for those going down the imaging route.

[rowan46]

I think its pretty certain that you want go down the imaging route So I don't think its a good idea to get a tracking dob. my guess is that with a 5d you probably have a few lenses.  So I would use the camera on a mount for imaging and a manual dob to satisfy your visual astro cravings and of course the book

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts/skywatcher-heq5-pro-synscan.html

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-skyliner-150p-dobsonian.html

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/making-every-photon-count-steve-richards.html

It doesn't leave you much change but it gives you something to build on or better still just get the book and then decide if imaging is still where you want to go as it is rather expensive. If you know what you are doing and buy second hand you can get a good imaging kit for around 1200- 1500 buying new will cost you 1500 plus. The kit mentioned will give you good wide field shots and adequate deep space shots using just camera and lens. If you want good deep space shots you are going to need to go guided and probably  a fast apochromatic refactor the book will tell you what you need and how you do it. Welcome by the way to sgl

[swag72]

If you are wanting to pursue imaging then definitely the advice about getting the book 'Making Every Photon Count' is top drawer. Get this before you do anything else. Read it ....... twice, then take a deep breath and start putting a plan together.

Visual and imaging have very different requirements, and AP has very different requirements to daytime photography, forget everything you know and start from the beginning.

Take a look in the imaging section and be realistic about what you want to achieve - People generally list their kit alongside their images, it will give you a good starting point. Perhaps for starters you could just try using your lens' - Many people do this to great effect, you don't always need a telescope.

[ronin]

As it appears that imaging is the intention then you need a good solid motor driven equitorial as a start. Probably bettr if you consider a goto equitorial, they locate thing for you so less time spent finding something. Also future expansion for a guide scope if you do that. Look to an HEQ5 if serious, an EQ5 should get shorter duration images but not as solid as the HEQ5.

Aperture is to an extent much less important, you simply take a bit longer exposure, or more of them. If you go for a refractor then not an achro, you need an ED or apo, if a reflector the ask here if they can achieve focus. Manufacturers will say DSLR attachment, that means you can attach one, not necessarily that you can get it to achieve focus. (Sneaky).

To an extent forget what you know for normal photography, when in that do you take 20, 60 second exposures of a moving object and stack them ? As well as the previous you need to take a similar number of darks to determine noise etc and subtract the darks from the exposure. So you might use a camera but that is about the end of it.

People could possibly suggest clubs near you if location was a bit more specific.

[LouisJB]

Something like an HEQ5 pro and 150PDS would be a good staring point. It would be in budget (just) but you'll need a coma corrector too, plus various accessories. So to stay in budget maybe look for the mount second-hand, that should save you enough to get the rest within budget (just about). Accessories are things like camera T adapters etc.

Alternatively ED80 refractor is often recommended a lot, on a similar mount would be good. For this I think you'll need a reducer/flattener. I don't know much about that but factor it in as a required cost in a similar way to the coma corrector for a Newtonian.

Then given that, possible next step is guiding. You'll need a second tube (or an OAG setup) and a camera (web-cam type camera) and a laptop. This should allow you long exposures required for DSO and longer exposure imaging. Cost for this varies a lot depending how you approach it. Not sure there is a single answer here, but assuming you already have the computer to run software then you'd probably spend upwards of £250-300 to get started with that.

[Rdl81]

Wow thanks for all the replays a lot of that is like a foreign language to me to so I think I will start with the book and go from there I had perhaps foolishly thought that you could use the some equipment for both astro photography and normal astronomy.

[LouisJB]

You could use the same equipment for both, but the requirements for astrophotography are much more demanding on the mount. Depending what tube you get it may make a decent visual tool too, it's just that for visual aperture is really the key thing whereas for imaging the speed (F-number) is all important.

Reading up definitely a good place to start. As is Stellarium (free software) and a good pair of binoculars, if you've not got any already. Learning your way around the sky with the map and bins will be invaluable later when you're outside with a more complex setup (imaging can get more complex, by the time you've added guiding etc there's a number of things required to get right in order to get good images).

[itmo]

Easy way into astrophotography is to get a cheap solid motorized mount for your camera only and use the camera lenses as optics. One good option is to get a single mount which can mount a scope for visual and camera for photography. 

[Jason71]

My advice would be go for visual astronomy first. Learn as much as you can about the night sky and just enjoy your new hobby . I havnt been doing this for long at all and like so many new comers to this hobby ( me included ) wanted to do AP and once I looked into it, it cost so much to get set up with the right equipment plus I knew nothing about it , I don't think I'd of enjoyed it as much as I do now.

I had 1k and it's gone just like that on a telescope , binoculars , two EP's and a tripod for the binoculars . And still need a few smaller bit . You can get equipment cheaper second hand .

If I want to do AP later down the line I will but first it's a matter of enjoyment and learning for me , every one is different though.

No matter which way you go this hobby is not cheep if you really enjoy it lol.

Good luck with which way you go but like most ppl will say read about it ask plenty of questions before you decide .

[swamp thing]

for visual aperture is really the key thing whereas for imaging the speed (F-number) is all important. 

Now the really confusing bit.....when astronomers talk about aperture, they are not referring to the aperture that you as a photographer know. They are referring to the diameter of the objective lens or primary mirror. Confusing huh?

Luckily as an imager the diameter of the objective or primary is of little concern to you. Check out the f/ratios on scopes though as this is the aperture you are used to.

HTH

[brantuk]

Hi RDL and welcome to SGL

Your budget is gonna be very tight for imaging - even if you go second hand - I doubt it can be done brand new for a grand. This is the kind of thing you can get on the used market - but I suggest you get some practical observing under your belt first before delving into astro photography which is both expensive and complex.

1. Making Every Photon Count by Steve Richards - essential reading for anyone starting imaging from scratch.

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/making-every-photon-count-steve-richards.html

2. A used Skywatcher HEQ5 equatorial mount with "goto" and tracking. This will take a good £500 of your budget.

3. Imaging scope - Skywatcher ED80, or William Optics ZS71 or Megrez 72. You should be able to get one of these between £250 and £350 second hand.

4. Guiding Scope - Skywatcher ST80 (circa £50) - this is to lock onto and follow a star whilst feeding back movement corrections to the mount.

5. Guide Camera - Philips SPC900 NC webcam would do it (£40-£80)

6. Imaging Camera - presumably your dslr

7. Dual Mount Bar or Piggy Back rings and Dovetail. Expect to pay £80-£100.

8. Sundry USB leads, USB port, Serial to USB adaptor cable, Camera USB connector, etc - £80-£100.

9. Power Pack - 17ah field pack or Regulated bench supply - around £30-£50.

10. Immeasurable patience, intense concentration, degree in meteorology, ocd, and a certificate in being nuts.

Once you've got all that lot, all you need then is software to connect your PC up. Stellarium or Cirque du Ciel, Deep Sky Stacker, Astro Photography Tool, ASCOM Driver Software, 12DString or CCDCalc, and Windows7 or 8. I'd also recommend a book of objects like "Illustrated Guide To Astronomical Wonders" - annual subscription to Sky at Night and/or Astronomy Now magazines. Whilst you're building up the kit grab a SW 150P or 200P telescope and do couple of months of observing - shouldn't cost more than £100-£150 used. Hope that helps.

(Oh I forgot the dew control - another £100-£200 for a controller and all the heater bands you'll need plus a couple of bhatinov focusing masks).

[Alien 13]

With your given budget there are certainly lots of options to get a real quality setup but not one that can do everything equally well and to be honest if you are like me you may simply not know where your interests lie until you "dip your toe".

If you are 1st and formost a photographer and want easily transportable equipment that can give stunning results on widefield objects then an astrotrack with existing camera and lenses might be the way to go but it is so easy to go down the wrong route.

The best advice that has already been mentioned is if you are not sure go for something like a SW 150P or 200P and get outside and see if it suits you (if you buy one second hand you might even make money on the deal if you have to sell it).

Alan

[Rdl81]

I am feeling totally over whelmed now I thought my budget was decent but clearly not. I am thinking might be best to start with the observing and then maybe go down the astrophotography route later with that in mind any different book or set up recommendations? Will it be a case of basic set up then selling it and getting something else later?

[dmahon]

Start with the basics then add things later. You'll probably want to upgrade at some point, so start with second user stuff.

1) HEQ5 Synscan mount

2) ED80 (there are lots of types) scope

3) T ring to connect your DSLR

Then later you'll want:

Guide scope

Guide camera

Laptop

EQDIR

Then you might consider reducers/flatteners

Then you may want an astro CCD

Then you might change your scope/mount

Then you'll want an observatory

[cyteen02]

I have a SW 130P, a 99p webcam, and £10 worth of software. I'd love more kit but I'm determine to get my 99p worth of learning from the webcam before I spend serious money. I had one evening of playing before the gales rolled in, and this convinced me I need to learn the software better before I venture out into the cold again.

Do get the book everyone recommends. I read it through and swore this hobby was too overwhelming for me. Then I read it again and decided there were bits I could attempt. So I'm learning the webcam now, and have attempted some constellation pics just using my canon DSLR and the APT software.

See if you can come up with a roadmap of starting small and adding to your equipment through the year as you get nifty with what you have :-)

Remember when you get your first recognisable photo to post it here, to encourage all us other beginners :-)

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[Rdl81]

Thanks guys I am based in the uk, essex to be exact I might see if any locks clubs I can go to to get an idea of what I am getting I to before taking the Inge and spending money. I will get the book and I think I like the idea of a second hand obv eroding scope to start with. Where are good places to find second hand equipment for sale?

[Alien 13]

Thanks guys I am based in the uk, essex to be exact I might see if any locks clubs I can go to to get an idea of what I am getting I to before taking the Inge and spending money. I will get the book and I think I like the idea of a second hand obv eroding scope to start with. Where are good places to find second hand equipment for sale?

Astromart is one place http://www.astromart.com/ and e-bay is ok if its a local seller and you can check it out and collect.

[LouisJB]

Some great advice here. Do lots of reading, the more the better!

I'd definitely consider and recommend getting a good imaging capable mount (like the HEQ5 pro, definite thumbs up from me) as a solid yet manageable imaging platform and either using your camera + lenses direct or a modest tube (130PDS, ED80, 150PDS) and trying some visual and some easy imaging targets. Doing this will teach you a lot and you'll then be better off when making further educated purchases. There's much to learn, trying to jump in and do it all at once will likely put you off altogether! (and possibly lead to expensive mistakes also).

In terms of kit.

There's a classified section on here

I got my HEQ5 pro synscan from here: http://www.astrobuysell.com/ - do be careful though and watch out for scams, there's a guide on the site.

and of course stuff turns up on flea-bay....

Another approach is to get a simple cheap telescope to learn the ropes then sell it afterwards. That is essentially how I jumped in (basic, cheap 130P on EQ2), the idea being you won't really know what you want until you've dabbled, then when you know more and replace it later on, you can sell the starter equipment (I've not got around to selling the starter kit yet).

It's amazing what you learn by getting out there, even with some simple equipment, reading books is great, but at some point you do need to get your hands dirty too.

[Rdl81]

Are those classified sites us only are there any uk equivalent?

[Rdl81]

Also where is the classified forum here can't seem to find it

[Alien 13]

Also where is the classified forum here can't seem to find it

You need a set number of posts to view it, cant remember how many.

Alan

[tingting44]

Are those classified sites us only are there any uk equivalent?

you need 50 posts

[Astro Imp]

Astro Buy and Sell mentioned in post#19 above is UK based.

For a local group to visit try :- http://stargazerslounge.com/forum/157-essex-cloud-dodgers/

[Rdl81]

Hmm ok fair enough I have sent email to local astronomy society to see if I can pop along there as think that would be a good place to start. As for 50 posts seems like a lot for a beginner maybe worth having a beginners scope section that beginners can view so do t need to make first purchase a new scope just my 2 cents