HELP PLEASE 🙏 Best telescope for 12 years old - CELESTRON

[Elka]

Hi All! Please help !

Santa 😉 is going to get my 12 years old boy a telescope. He is fascinated by the stars etc. please recommend something user & pocket friendly 🙏 that I can order asap? Any of the CELESTRON ones ? Thank you!

Edited December 10, 2023 by Elka

[Mr Spock]

have a look at this page https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes.html Something there for all pockets and suitable for beginners.

[doublevodka]

Hi @Elka if you can give us an idea of budget, we may be able to give you some pointers, the above link is very useful and we're all very good at spending other people's money 😂

[Elka]

Is this one any good to start with? I would love to get something decent enough so he doesn’t get disappointed and helps him grow his interests (happy to upgrade if he stays interested) but not too expensive in case it ends up forgotten in a month or two…

knowing my son he would love the Hubble one 🤪 but a one on a tripod will have to do for now x

@Mr Spock

@doublevodka

Edited December 10, 2023 by Elka

[Peter Drew]

I have two of these.  I bought them to take the Starsense system for another project.  The telescope itself is surprisingly good but the accessories are marginal quality at best and the mount and tripod are inadequate.      🙂 

[Elp]

I wouldn't get anything in this price range as a starter if you're looking at a traditional telescope "look" (long tube on a tripod), it'll likely be inadequate (the tripod definitely will be). Large aperture binoculars that can be mounted onto a photo tripod will be far better (and more "pocket" friendly, it's also easier seeing with two eyes rather than one). Their experience using these will either develop the hobby further, or you'll know they won't want to pursue it further.

If you absolutely need to get a telescope, a tabletop or larger dobsonian will be more stable (shaky mounts/tripods are priority one in terms of things you don't want with a setup, hence my recommendation for tripod mountable binos).

Edited December 10, 2023 by Elp

[Naughty Neal]

The main sponsor FLO did have a lt80az on offer which would be  a bit better and a nice 9mm eyepiece up grade that would be a better upgrade to the std high power eyepiece supplied.  The true value of these cheaper celestrons is in the star sense fitting for the phone which is a bit of a game changer in to not only directing one to possible targets but akso having info on hand at the eyepiece all in one  place.

[Elka]

@Naughty Neal thanks 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Elka

[Naughty Neal]

StellaLyra 9mm 1.25" LER Planetary Eyepiece | First Light Optics

Celestron StarSense Explorer LT 80 AZ Refractor Telescope | First Light Optics

[Carbon Brush]

I had one of these Starsense equipped scopes for a short time and returned it.
I didn't get on well with the app. But maybe it is just me. Others think it is good.
I would have preferred a screen off the scope - not sitting on top of the tube.
The tripod and accessories aren't that good.

The Starsense ties up a phone - which may or may not be an issue.
You have to link the Starsense app to a phone so you can't keep easily swapping and changing devices.
You don't want to be taking the phone off the scope to take calls while viewing. Use it hands free?
The phone needs to be a reasonably good smartphone. Not a basic 'does it make calls' type.
The app allows 5 installs before negotiation with Celestron for more codes.

The scope itself is OK.

Maybe not the most positive response. But one. based on my experience.

David.

[Carbon Brush]

I knew it was somewhere......

 

[happy-kat]

A wobbly tripod is more stable when it's used not fully extended, sitting to view is often quite comfortable and to be patient to see those moments of detail. Jupiter can be great for observing but is usually being there in the moment of clarity between Jupiter being jiggly again.

[Spile]

I would avoid that telescope. Spend some time reading posts from others in order to get a sense of what is recommended and to save you wasting money. I’ve put my thoughts here https://astro.catshill.com/buying-telescope-start-here/

[Second Time Around]

I think the main reason why people lose interest is that they find it hard to find objects. This is especially so in towns and cities where there are few stars to see with the naked eye to guide you to objects.

Therefore I'd very much recommend that you look at Celestron Starsense scopes. These make it very easy to find objects with a free smartphone app - indeed my 8 year old grandson picked up how to use it in minutes.

Go to https://www.firstlightoptics.com/celestron-starsense-explorer-series.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiA35urBhDCARIsAOU7Qwnbi6bN7TTF30Xxg8ALXRvQWIoxQcdIdhMIofHouUaaA4qQKzz4AKcaAiaJEALw_wcB

By the way, the 70mm one you linked to is the model I bought for my grandkids.

First Light Optics has the next model up (the 80mm) on special offer.  However, although it has a larger aperture it's on the same mount and is likely to be a little more wobbly due to the increased weight and tube length.  It'll also have a smaller field of view and so show less of the sky at once.  So my choice would still be the 70mm.

Finally, one of the other advantages of Starsense Explorer telescopes is that they'd be very easy to sell secondhand and for a good price.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Second Time Around

[Elp]

20 hours ago, Second Time Around said:

I think the main reason why people lose interest is that they find it hard to find objects

True. Id also add they expect to see space agency type views which just aren't typically possible, especially on a budget, imaging setups get near especially when imaging hydrogen alpha bandpass on emission nebulae (and definitely when post processing any images) or if you've got a large aperture long FL scope on solar system objects but these cost more, and long FL makes it even harder to find objects if you don't have a goto system or are used to the equipment (which requires lots of patience, another thing people lack).

Edited December 17, 2023 by Elp

[Bugdozer]

20 hours ago, Second Time Around said:

I think the main reason why people lose interest is that they find it hard to find objects. This is especially so in towns and cities where there are few stars to see with the naked eye to guide you to objects.

Therefore I'd very much recommend that you look at Celestron Starsense scopes. These make it very easy to find objects with a free smartphone app - indeed my 8 year old grandson picked up how to use it in minutes.

Go to https://www.firstlightoptics.com/celestron-starsense-explorer-series.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiA35urBhDCARIsAOU7Qwnbi6bN7TTF30Xxg8ALXRvQWIoxQcdIdhMIofHouUaaA4qQKzz4AKcaAiaJEALw_wcB

By the way, the 70mm one you linked to is the model I bought for my grandkids.

First Light Optics has the next model up on special offer.  However, although it has a larger aperture it's on the same mount and is likely to be a little more wobbly due to the increased weight and tube length.  It'll also have a smaller field of view and so show less of the sky at once.  So my choice would still be the 70mm.

Finally, one of the other advantages of Starsense Explorer telescopes is that they'd be very easy to sell secondhand and for a good price.

I totally agree. I think many of the "experienced old timers" on here have forgotten just how difficult it can be for a newbie to try and locate an object which is below naked eye visibility. This is why I think automatically recommending Dobsonian telescopes simply because you get the most optics for your budget is something that isn't always the best solution. There are many objects I was never able to see until I started using a goto scope, simply because I couldn't find them by entirely manual guiding. Of course that was back before the days of apps like Astrohopper and Stellarium etc. on phones, but I don't think the potential impact of "location frustration" should be disregarded entirely. I know Spile has said that he likes that Dobsonian scopes don't have the need for a time consuming synchronisation with the sky - however, my experience is that the time taken to hunt around for objects before being able to observe them has always far exceeded the time it takes to sync a goto scope, or even perform a polar alignment. 

[Jules Tohpipi]

20 hours ago, Second Time Around said:

I think the main reason why people lose interest is that they find it hard to find objects. This is especially so in towns and cities where there are few stars to see with the naked eye to guide you to objects.

Therefore I'd very much recommend that you look at Celestron Starsense scopes. These make it very easy to find objects with a free smartphone app - indeed my 8 year old grandson picked up how to use it in minutes.

Go to https://www.firstlightoptics.com/celestron-starsense-explorer-series.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiA35urBhDCARIsAOU7Qwnbi6bN7TTF30Xxg8ALXRvQWIoxQcdIdhMIofHouUaaA4qQKzz4AKcaAiaJEALw_wcB

By the way, the 70mm one you linked to is the model I bought for my grandkids.

First Light Optics has the next model up on special offer.  However, although it has a larger aperture it's on the same mount and is likely to be a little more wobbly due to the increased weight and tube length.  It'll also have a smaller field of view and so show less of the sky at once.  So my choice would still be the 70mm.

Finally, one of the other advantages of Starsense Explorer telescopes is that they'd be very easy to sell secondhand and for a good price.

Absolutely this. Nowt kills the hobby faster than being new and not being able to find nowt. 
 

Slipstream in using a mobile phone with a 12-year-old to give informed guided tours of the sky, and the job’s done - as a first dip into the wonder of it all. 

[DaveL59]

Can't disagree re the LT70AZ. It's a fair scope but let down by the mount and tripod which are a bit wobbly. But as a package its light and very easy to plonk outside when there's a clear bit of sky and does fine on the moon and major planets. The original eyepieces are OK, the diagonal is average at best. If you have a phone that is supported the guidance is pretty good.

I altered the one I bought with wood legs and a new yoke that makes it somewhat better, got an Svbony dielectric diagonal and 7-21mm Svbony zoom eyepiece which makes it easier to use and better views. I adjusted the focuser to make it more stable and added a cheap electric focus motor too, which takes away all the wobbles when trying to find focus. As-is tho its usable, just needs patience and a gentle touch when making adjustments and allowing it all to settle before taking in the view.

My aim when I bought this was to make a carrier to use on my other scopes and then give the LT70 to my daughter/grandaughter who have some interest but wouldn't be able to find much being in SE London. They things its pretty good tho haven't had much chance to use it, having moved and in the midst of sorting the house and garden.

Perhaps worth looking at the LT80 version for a bit more aperture which would give a brighter image, that'll have the same weaknesses overall with the tripod and diagonal/eyepieces of course, since you pretty much get basic components supplied with the kit. Much like kit lenses with DSLR cameras 🙂 Updating to a better diagonal/eyepieces doesn't have to cost a fortune however, plenty of choice out there.

[saac]

On 10/12/2023 at 23:06, Elka said:

Is this one any good to start with? I would love to get something decent enough so he doesn’t get disappointed and helps him grow his interests (happy to upgrade if he stays interested) but not too expensive in case it ends up forgotten in a month or two…

knowing my son he would love the Hubble one 🤪 but a one on a tripod will have to do for now x

@Mr Spock

@doublevodka

For a first telescope for a 12 year old I think you would be hard pressed to do any better - it has everything that any 12 year old would want from a first telescope. Importantly, it is at a price that should hopefully keep things manageable. It will deliver what your boy is looking for -  bags of fun, excitement and learning.  He will get decent views of the moon and if he is persistent in his searching and use of the Star Sense app he will find Jupiter and Saturn. This scope will show Jupiter as a small white disc around which will appear small points of light which are the innermost moons of Jupiter as seen by Galileo. Likewise, Saturn will appear as a small white disc and, while the rings will not appear clear and distinct, he will notice that something unusual is there.   If he sticks with it and really gets good at searching he will find star clusters and even a sense of the Andromeda galaxy (it will be a very faint washed out cloud like feature - but a galaxy it will be!). For a 12 year old it is the imagination that will be fired by a telescope like this and to be honest that is way more important at that age and stage than the capability of the scope. I wouldn't look to  spend much more at this stage - see how he gets on with it first.  Remember to come back to SGL for help on setting it up, using it and finding targets.   Take a look at First Light Optics for some comments on the scope - their list price may be a little higher but their customer service is exceptional.

Jim  

Edited December 17, 2023 by saac

[Naughty Neal]

23 hours ago, Second Time Around said:

I think the main reason why people lose interest is that they find it hard to find objects. This is especially so in towns and cities where there are few stars to see with the naked eye to guide you to objects.

Therefore I'd very much recommend that you look at Celestron Starsense scopes. These make it very easy to find objects with a free smartphone app - indeed my 8 year old grandson picked up how to use it in minutes.

Go to https://www.firstlightoptics.com/celestron-starsense-explorer-series.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiA35urBhDCARIsAOU7Qwnbi6bN7TTF30Xxg8ALXRvQWIoxQcdIdhMIofHouUaaA4qQKzz4AKcaAiaJEALw_wcB

By the way, the 70mm one you linked to is the model I bought for my grandkids.

First Light Optics has the next model up (the 80mm) on special offer.  However, although it has a larger aperture it's on the same mount and is likely to be a little more wobbly due to the increased weight and tube length.  It'll also have a smaller field of view and so show less of the sky at once.  So my choice would still be the 70mm.

Finally, one of the other advantages of Starsense Explorer telescopes is that they'd be very easy to sell secondhand and for a good price.

Not only easy to sell but also pretty easy to move the unit and use on another telescope should someone finds the need to upgrade the telescope.

My Starsense is used on my f12.5 80mm acromat  & my f11.2 100mm ed, the original birdjones scope ota and tripod long  gone to the scrappy.

I saved the mirrors  which looked in good nick and unmarked.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Naughty Neal

[Second Time Around]

54 minutes ago, DaveL59 said:

Can't disagree re the LT70AZ. It's a fair scope but let down by the mount and tripod which are a bit wobbly. But as a package its light and very easy to plonk outside when there's a clear bit of sky and does fine on the moon and major planets. The original eyepieces are OK, the diagonal is average at best. If you have a phone that is supported the guidance is pretty good.

I altered the one I bought with wood legs and a new yoke that makes it somewhat better, got an Svbony dielectric diagonal and 7-21mm Svbony zoom eyepiece which makes it easier to use and better views. I adjusted the focuser to make it more stable and added a cheap electric focus motor too, which takes away all the wobbles when trying to find focus. As-is tho its usable, just needs patience and a gentle touch when making adjustments and allowing it all to settle before taking in the view.

My aim when I bought this was to make a carrier to use on my other scopes and then give the LT70 to my daughter/grandaughter who have some interest but wouldn't be able to find much being in SE London. They things its pretty good tho haven't had much chance to use it, having moved and in the midst of sorting the house and garden.

Perhaps worth looking at the LT80 version for a bit more aperture which would give a brighter image, that'll have the same weaknesses overall with the tripod and diagonal/eyepieces of course, since you pretty much get basic components supplied with the kit. Much like kit lenses with DSLR cameras 🙂 Updating to a better diagonal/eyepieces doesn't have to cost a fortune however, plenty of choice out there.

 

I agree with Dave that the mount is a little wobbly, but it's perfectly useable.

As Dave said the weakest point is the diagonal (this changes the angle you look through the scope and makes it more comfortable to view), but at least the one supplied is better for terrestrial use as the image isn't reversed left to right.  So the first accessory to buy would be a proper star diagonal (£20 to £30).  The image will be reversed but much better quality.

As I mentioned above, I'd stick with the 70mm as it'll be more stable than the 80mm and have a wider field of view.

 

57 minutes ago, saac said:

For a first telescope for a 12 year old I think you would be hard pressed to do any better - it has everything that any 12 year old would want from a first telescope. Importantly, it is at a price that should hopefully keep things manageable. It will deliver what your boy is looking for -  bags of fun, excitement and learning.  He will get decent views of the moon and if he is persistent in his searching and use of the Star Sense app he will find Jupiter and Saturn. This scope will show Jupiter as a small white disc around which will appear small points of light which are the innermost moons of Jupiter as seen by Galileo. Likewise, Saturn will appear as a small white disc and, while the rings will not appear clear and distinct, he will notice that something unusual is there.   If he sticks with it and really gets good at searching he will find star clusters and even a sense of the Andromeda galaxy (it will be a very faint washed out cloud like feature - but a galaxy it will be!). For a 12 year old it is the imagination that will be fired by a telescope like this and to be honest that is way more important at that age and stage than the capability of the scope. I wouldn't look to  spend much more at this stage - see how he gets on with it first.  Remember to come back to SGL for help on setting it up, using it and finding targets.   Take a look at First Light Optics for some comments on the scope - their list price may be a little higher but their customer service is exceptional.

Jim  

 

I've found this 70mm will clearly show that Saturn has a ring, and that'll be a real wow moment!  It'll also show not only the 4 main moons of Jupiter, but also it's 2 main belts.  Mercury and Venus will show phases like the Moon, and on the Moon itself you'll be able to see a multitude of mountains and craters.

One warning though - don't look at the sun with it as you could severely damage your eyesight.

As Jim said most galaxies will be a faint smudge, certainly from urban locations.  However, the many clusters visible, even in town, will be well worth a look.  Another advantage of the 70mm over the 80mm is that'll give a better view of the Pleaides (AKA the Seven Sisters) as you'll be able to see the whole of this naked eye cluster.

Also visible will be a lot of double stars.  These are stars too close to see as more than one with the naked eye but resolve into 2 or more components with the scope.  They also often show beautiful colours. 

The database contains a huge number of objects, and many of them are described on screen or read out.

We'd love to hear what you get and what your experiences are!

[Second Time Around]

1 hour ago, Naughty Neal said:

 

1 hour ago, Naughty Neal said:

Not only easy to sell but also pretty easy to move the unit and use on another telescope should someone finds the need to upgrade the telescope.

My Starsense is used on my f12.5 80mm acromat  & my f11.2 100mm ed, the original birdjones scope ota and tripod long  gone to the scrappy.

I saved the mirrors  which looked in good nick and unmarked.

Another good point.  The Starsense Explorer Technology can be used on other scopes and many of us have done a simple modification to do just this.

This makes a Starsense Explorer scope an even better choice.

[Mal22]

5 hours ago, Bugdozer said:

I totally agree. I think many of the "experienced old timers" on here have forgotten just how difficult it can be for a newbie to try and locate an object which is below naked eye visibility. This is why I think automatically recommending Dobsonian telescopes simply because you get the most optics for your budget is something that isn't always the best solution. There are many objects I was never able to see until I started using a goto scope, simply because I couldn't find them by entirely manual guiding. Of course that was back before the days of apps like Astrohopper and Stellarium etc. on phones, but I don't think the potential impact of "location frustration" should be disregarded entirely. I know Spile has said that he likes that Dobsonian scopes don't have the need for a time consuming synchronisation with the sky - however, my experience is that the time taken to hunt around for objects before being able to observe them has always far exceeded the time it takes to sync a goto scope, or even perform a polar alignment. 

Agree entirely with this. It’s not just that those who are more experienced forget how difficult it is starting out, I also think that perspective on cost also goes out the window. Yes, a lot of us have rigs that cost thousands of pounds, and we’ve gotten used to it eating up our wallets, but I constantly see responses to new starters along the lines of “well, if you’re spending £120, I’d recommend saving up more and going for this £400 dob instead which is much better”. 
Anyone new to a hobby needs a bit of instant gratification in the early days to “catch the buzz”.  The Starsense Explorer seems like a very sensible choice with that in mind. 

Edited December 17, 2023 by Mal22

[bosun21]

27 minutes ago, Mal22 said:

Anyone new to a hobby needs a bit of instant gratification in the early days to “catch the buzz

My first ever scope was a 4" reflector on a ramshackle alt/az mount. My first look at the moon and the planets was all the gratification I needed for me to begin a life long love affair. I do agree that the recent generations seem to require a bit more. Perhaps all the technology in todays society has something to do with it.