12" Dob Choice...

[Ian McCallum]

I'm eyeing up two possibilities regarding a 12" Dobsonian.  They are the StellaLyra or the Sky-Watcher versions...

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/stellalyra-telescopes/stellalyra-12-f5-dobsonian.html
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/telescopes-in-stock/skywatcher-skyliner-300p-flextube-dobsonian.html

The StellaLyra version comes with a dual speed Crayford focuser, a fan for cooling down the primary mirror and a decent RACI finder as standard.  It weighs in at a combined weight of 50kg.

The Sky-Watcher 300P flextube is more expensive, doesn't have a RACI finder, dual speed focuser or cooling fan for the primary mirror and weighs 11kg more than the StellaLyra.  It's also about £250 more.

The choice should be obvious, but unfortunately the only one in stock is the Sky-Watcher version.  The StellaLyra is out of stock till perhaps early next year.

Any thoughts?🤔

[Mike73]

I had the Skywatcher 300P and had some fantastic views through it, I also stepped up to 12" from the 8" Skywatcher (which I think is what you currently have?) and it was completely worth it. 

Thinking about it I've had a 8", 10",12" and 16" and out of all of them the 12" was probably my favourite (for DSO's).

[John]

I think both will perform pretty much the same.

The Stellalyra has some nice features though such as the RACI finder as standard and a nicer focuser.

11kg is a lot of weight difference - even 50kg seems a lot to me for a 12 inch dob

My Orion Optics based 12 inch F/5.3 dob weighs in at 27kg in total - that makes a lot of difference to how easy the scope is to set up and move about once set up. Very important factors to me.

 

 

Edited October 3, 2021 by John

[Ian McCallum]

5 minutes ago, Mike73 said:

I had the Skywatcher 300P and had some fantastic views through it, I also stepped up to 12" from the 8" Skywatcher (which I think is what you currently have?) and it was completely worth it. 

Thinking about it I've had a 8", 10",12" and 16" and out of all of them the 12" was probably my favourite (for DSO's).

It is indeed the 200P I have, at the moment.  I suppose my next question would be the difference in cool down time between the two telescopes above, one having a fan and other not?🤔

[Ian McCallum]

1 minute ago, John said:

I think both will perform pretty much the same.

The Stellalyra has some nice features though such as the RACI finder as standard and a nicer focuser.

11kg is a lot of weight difference - even 50kg seems a lot to me for a 12 inch dob

My Orion Optics based 12 inch F/5.3 dob weighs in at 27kg in total - that makes a lot of difference to how easy the scope is to set up and move about once set up. Very important factors to me.

 

 

Here's a quote from the 300P specs page... 

Quote

Tube weight is approx 27 kg. Mount / rocker-box weight is 34 kg.

And from the StellaLyra model page...

Quote

Shipped weight OTA	30kg / 66lbs 2oz
Shipped weight Base	20kg / 44lbs 1oz

 

[Andy ES]

I should think the skywatcher could be more practical if you have got to take it out to a dark site

if you don’t have a van ??

 

 

[John]

3 minutes ago, Ian McCallum said:

Here's a quote from the 300P specs page... 

And from the StellaLyra model page...

 

These are basically the same scope as the StellaLyra 12:

https://www.apm-telescopes.de/en/telescopes/dobsonians/gso-12-f-5-dobsonian-gsd-980

https://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/language/en/info/p1190_GSO-12-inch-f-5-Dobsonian-Telescope-Deluxe-Version.html

 

[Mike73]

21 minutes ago, Ian McCallum said:

It is indeed the 200P I have, at the moment.  I suppose my next question would be the difference in cool down time between the two telescopes above, one having a fan and other not?🤔

Well I think a lot depends on where you store it?

I used to keep mine in the shed where it was already fairly close to ambient temperature. It was just a case of get out out, align the Telrad have a cuppa tea and then start observing usually starting with my old favourites using low power EP's then gradually increase the magnification as the evening went on. My 10" and 16" both had fans but I never used them when I was observing.

If I was going to a dark site I'd drive 15 minutes out of town with the windows down so the mirror wouldn't warm up and go through the same setting up process that I would do at home.

[johninderby]

Just checked the current price of the Orion Optics UK 12” dob with 1/10 pv mirrors. Ooh Err Ouch 🙀🙀🙀

[John]

4 minutes ago, johninderby said:

Just checked the current price of the Orion Optics UK 12” dob with 1/10 pv mirrors. Ooh Err Ouch 🙀🙀🙀

I've just checked myself - new, they are expensive scopes

Luckily, mine was bought pre-owned and the mount custom built and cost considerably less.

 

 

[Ian McCallum]

1 hour ago, Andy ES said:

I should think the skywatcher could be more practical if you have got to take it out to a dark site

if you don’t have a van ??

 

 

I plan to keep the 200P for portable use and any larger Dobs would be used at home.  I can't understand how the 300P is the heavier model, given that there's less metal tubing in the OTA?!?🙄

Edited October 3, 2021 by Ian McCallum

[Andy ES]

Ian 

I’ve got a CPC925 so everything else is light as a feather! 😂

[John]

14 minutes ago, Ian McCallum said:

I plan to keep the 200P for portable use and any larger Dobs would be used at home.  I can't understand how the 300P is the heavier model, given that there's less metal tubing in the OTA?!?🙄

The Flextube dobsonians are a little heavier than the solid tube versions although the Skywatcher solid tube 12 inch dob went out of production a while back.

I think those figures for the Skywatcher are incorrect though. I don't think it weighs more than 40kg in total.

 

 

[Ian McCallum]

8 minutes ago, John said:

The Flextube dobsonians are a little heavier than the solid tube versions although the Skywatcher solid tube 12 inch dob went out of production a while back.

I think those figures for the Skywatcher are incorrect though. I don't think it weighs more than 40kg in total.

 

 

From the Sky-Watcher website regarding the 300P's weight...

Quote

Tube Weight	21kg
Tube Dimensions	450(920-1400)
Shipping Weight	20+23 kg

 

[John]

13 hours ago, Ian McCallum said:

From the Sky-Watcher website regarding the 300P's weight...

 

Well at least that's quite a bit lighter than the original figures you had

My old Meade Lightbridge 12 inch dob weighed about that much. Too heavy for me so I moved it on to a new home and eventually went down the somewhat lighter Orion Optics route.

The Explore Scientific 12 inch dob is another option:

https://www.365astronomy.com/Explore-Scientific-12-inch-Ultra-Light-Dobsonian-305mm

Edited October 4, 2021 by John

[IB20]

I’ve sometimes pondered upgrading the 8” to a 12”. These weight figures of 40-55kg has really killed that idea stone dead though. I know I wouldn’t ever be bothered to use such a beast. 

[Ian McCallum]

9 minutes ago, John said:

Well at least that's quite a bit lighter than the original figures you had

My old Meade Lightbridge 12 inch dob weighed about that much. Too heavy for me so I moved it on to a new home and eventually went down the somewhat lighter Orion Optics route.

The Explore Scientific 12 inch dob is another option:

https://www.365astronomy.com/Explore-Scientific-12-inch-Ultra-Light-Dobsonian-305mm

That's a nice bit of kit!👍

[Saganite]

13 minutes ago, John said:

Well at least that's quite a bit lighter than the original figures you had

My old Meade Lightbridge 12 inch dob weighed about that much. Too heavy for me so I moved it on to a new home and eventually went down the somewhat lighter Orion Optics route

And I followed your lead exactly,  for the same reasons, though the  Lightbridge was a very nice scope.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Saganite

[Ian McCallum]

5 minutes ago, IB20 said:

I’ve sometimes pondered upgrading the 8” to a 12”. These weight figures of 40-55kg has really killed that idea stone dead though. I know I wouldn’t ever be bothered to use such a beast. 

I do get sciatica occasionally, so I'd go for a sack barrow or jerry rig up a dolly with castors or something similar...

[IB20]

I think if my circumstances were different and I could house it in a garage on wheels I’d be thinking differently.

At the minute though it’d very much be “Quick there’s a break in the clouds, push the grand piano outside”.

[Ian McCallum]

8 minutes ago, IB20 said:

I think if my circumstances were different and I could house it in a garage on wheels I’d be thinking differently.

At the minute though it’d very much be “Quick there’s a break in the clouds, push the grand piano outside”.

I'm lucky that I live in a ground floor flat, the communal back door being access by two low steps down.  I could do the sack barrow method and build a small wooden ramp, for taking it down the stairs...

[johninderby]

A wheelchair ramp would work nicely.

[Tiny Clanger]

1 minute ago, johninderby said:

A wheelchair ramp would work nicely.

And one of those electric mobility scooters .....

[johninderby]

3 minutes ago, Tiny Clanger said:

And one of those electric mobility scooters .....

Remote controlled of course. 😁

[Tiny Clanger]

Just now, johninderby said:

Remote controlled of course. 😁

I was thinking about that ... a friend used to  work at  a company which made bomb disposal robots , I saw video of one being remote steered round the company car park as a practical  joke to harass a colleague who was trying to park (engineers eh ?!)  it would make an impressive , stable platform but add to the overall weight somewhat . Just a few tonnes ...