Help! my images are grayed out in deep sky stacker after using N.I.N.A

[Quetzalcoatl72]

It was the first time last night I used imaging software to capture deep sky objects, it was also the first time using a camera connected to a laptop. I was so amazed by the quality i was capturing. Until I went back and found that i couldn't view my pictures, but in N.I.N.A I could see them clear as day. I really hope I haven't lost these or I'd be heartbroken! Below is a 3min sub, I did 20 of these, but loading them into Depp Sky Stacker shocked me as they turned out grayscale and you could only see a dozen stars. The image files are fit's which i can't even view at all now, never used that format and I'm not using it again if it ruins my images, what's the actual point on that!? How do I fix this? I may have to use a different processor, i've been using dss for years

Edited May 31, 2021 by Quetzalcoatl72

[vlaiv]

That is sort of normal.

When you capture data it is linear. You can preview it debayered and stretched - like Nina is showing you - but data is still linear and not debayered - as DSS is showing you.

Make sure you have debayering turned on in DSS to produce final color stack and process stack in image processing app like gimp once you are done stacking - and it will look again like one in Nina - but with more detail and less noise.

[Quetzalcoatl72]

38 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

That is sort of normal.

When you capture data it is linear. You can preview it debayered and stretched - like Nina is showing you - but data is still linear and not debayered - as DSS is showing you.

Make sure you have debayering turned on in DSS to produce final color stack and process stack in image processing app like gimp once you are done stacking - and it will look again like one in Nina - but with more detail and less noise.

I'm unsure as i've never processed images other than dss, i have gimp but i need to figure out how to use it. I think i enabled debayering in dss here: and there's still something wrong, i can see colour though

[vlaiv]

Now stack your image and save it as 32bit TIF or Fits after stacking.

Open in gimp and do simple 3 point level stretch to start with.

Step 1 - do a round of levels - move top slider until you start saturating the target (don't saturate it - back off a bit). Apply levels.

Step 2 - do another round of levels - this time move middle slider left - to bring out faint stuff. Don't worry if background becomes bright. Don't over do it - you don't want the noise to show too much. Again apply.

Step 3 - move left slider to the base of histogram. This sets black point / restores background as dark.

[Quetzalcoatl72]

16 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

Now stack your image and save it as 32bit TIF or Fits after stacking.

Open in gimp and do simple 3 point level stretch to start with.

Step 1 - do a round of levels - move top slider until you start saturating the target (don't saturate it - back off a bit). Apply levels.

Step 2 - do another round of levels - this time move middle slider left - to bring out faint stuff. Don't worry if background becomes bright. Don't over do it - you don't want the noise to show too much. Again apply.

Step 3 - move left slider to the base of histogram. This sets black point / restores background as dark.

while changing the levels i can tell there's something seriously wrong, the actual nebula is pixellated

[vlaiv]

Try saving as 32bit floating point instead of 32bit integer?

[Quetzalcoatl72]

8 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

Try saving as 32bit floating point instead of 32bit integer?

Tried both, it's actually pixelated upon stacking i noticed!

[vlaiv]

1 minute ago, Quetzalcoatl72 said:

Tried both, it's actually pixelated upon stacking i noticed!

Did you by any chance shoot it in 8bit format?

In Nina, you should be able to choose what sort of format camera produces. There are two different formats in which images are stored - 8bit and 16bit.

Posterization will arise from shooting in 8bit format.

[Quetzalcoatl72]

4 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

Did you by any chance shoot it in 8bit format?

In Nina, you should be able to choose what sort of format camera produces. There are two different formats in which images are stored - 8bit and 16bit.

Posterization will arise from shooting in 8bit format.

It is set to 16 bit depth on the camera tab. bit scaling is off

in image options debayer image, debayered HFR and unlinked stretch are all set to 'on'

[vlaiv]

What DSS settings are you using and can you post 32bit floating stack for inspection - to see what might be the problem?

[Quetzalcoatl72]

Just now, vlaiv said:

What DSS settings are you using and can you post 32bit floating stack for inspection - to see what might be the problem?

I haven't done anything with the settings, all default, automatic etc, except selecting the monochrome fit files setting with bilinear interpolation. I'll upload the stacked 32 image and a raw fits

m27-Stacked-32.TIF 2021-05-31_01-19-32__-10.00_180.00s_0002.fits

[Quetzalcoatl72]

m27.txtuploaded the dss data file just in case

 

[vlaiv]

Ok, something is seriously wrong with DSS and the way it stacked the data.

Single sub is just what I would expect. Here is histogram of it:

There are like three normal peaks - red, green and blue peak as this image is not debayered so contains all three color pixels.

But stacked image is sooo strange.

Background is perfect, here is green channel:

It is nice and uniform noise - looking just beautiful

If I do histogram of just that "part" of the image - it looks wonderful:

Just as it should. But if I examine actual nebulosity - everything falls apart. Everything except background is highly posterized:

Not only that - histogram looks very weird as well:

So it is not perfectly posterized - with single spikes every so often - it has some very strange repetitive patterns.

I'll try now looking at DSS file you included - although that is "encoded" so I will take me some time to figure out what each number means as option.

 

[vlaiv]

What version of DSS are you using, and can you try to use these settings:

I'm guessing that you are not using any calibration files, right? In that case, dark flat and bias settings should not be important, but if you using them - just set everything to average as well.

[Quetzalcoatl72]

5 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

I'm guessing that you are not using any calibration files, right? In that case, dark flat and bias settings should not be important, but if you using them - just set everything to average as well.

Yes just lights for now, the cameras fan kept fluctuating due to a dying power bank so it wouldn't stay -10

[Quetzalcoatl72]

2 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

What version of DSS are you using, and can you try to use these settings:

4.2.2

[vlaiv]

Just saw your screen shot again - you are using 4.2.2 version

I have 4.2.5 version. Maybe try to update to latest version as well - 4.2.6?

In the mean time, if you want to keep 4.2.2 version - maybe try one more option if above does not work - check this checkbox as well:

I don't have that option in 4.2.5 so it has been removed - maybe that is culprit?

[Quetzalcoatl72]

18 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

Just saw your screen shot again - you are using 4.2.2 version

I have 4.2.5 version. Maybe try to update to latest version as well - 4.2.6?

In the mean time, if you want to keep 4.2.2 version - maybe try one more option if above does not work

I don't have that option in 4.2.5 so it has been removed - maybe that is culprit?

installed 4.2.6, does not have that option, i tried the other options, align rgb channels made it worse, kept intersection mode and create super pixels, this is the result. it looks better but upon close inspection it still has that pixellated feel. I may be forced to try another stacking software if this does not work. I'm going out tonight but I'm still concerned about the subs, can I still keep taking them? is it just the processing that's making it all wrong?

m27new.TIF

[vlaiv]

6 minutes ago, Quetzalcoatl72 said:

installed 4.2.6, does not have that option, i tried the other options, align rgb channels made it worse, kept intersection mode and create super pixels, this is the result. it looks better but upon close inspection it still has that pixellated feel. I may be forced to try another stacking software if this does not work. I'm going out tonight but I'm still concerned about the subs, can I still keep taking them? is it just the processing that's making it all wrong?

This is highly strange.

No, subs are fine - at least, they appear fine.

Here is single sub that you posted and I just made it mono and stretched it:

There is simply no effect visible - sub looks really nice (except for focusing issue - do pay attention to fix your focus).

It is stacking that is lacking (rime?). Try Siril for stacking.

I got recommendation to try it out and it really looks ok (still haven't downloaded the latest version).

[Quetzalcoatl72]

4 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

There is simply no effect visible - sub looks really nice (except for focusing issue - do pay attention to fix your focus).

It is stacking that is lacking (rime?). Try Siril for stacking.

I got recommendation to try it out and it really looks ok (still haven't downloaded the latest version).

yes, just stacking. I wish i could just get the images i saw in nina, that's all, they were amazing to me. I did my first 5min sub too on m13, those images are just as broken too.

most likely collimation, focus was as accurate as it could get manually with bahtinov, i'm always viewing through cables running across the sky which can't be helped

[Quetzalcoatl72]

if i mess with the level up on the top i can get the nebula out, but it's super green

[vlaiv]

33 minutes ago, Quetzalcoatl72 said:

if i mess with the level up on the top i can get the nebula out, but it's super green

That again is normal - ASI533 is the most sensitive in green and you need to color correct the image.

Again, Siril will do that for you - it won't do full color correction - but will scale R, G and B according to stars in the image. That will be sufficient to provide you with nice color and neutral cast.

[Quetzalcoatl72]

19 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

That again is normal - ASI533 is the most sensitive in green and you need to color correct the image.

Again, Siril will do that for you - it won't do full color correction - but will scale R, G and B according to stars in the image. That will be sufficient to provide you with nice color and neutral cast.

tried using siril, nothing works downloaded scripts, giving me errors, i'm thinking of selling my camera and going back to using a dslr, at least i can actually see the pictures i take

[vlaiv]

8 minutes ago, Quetzalcoatl72 said:

tried using siril, nothing works downloaded scripts, giving me errors, i'm thinking of selling my camera and going back to using a dslr, at least i can actually see the pictures i take

Don't be so disheartened.

You don't have many lights, right? How about uploading those (you can either zip them or maybe use google drive or something) - and I'll try stacking those in DSS to see if I can figure out where the problem is?

[Quetzalcoatl72]

5 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

You don't have many lights, right? How about uploading those (you can either zip them or maybe use google drive or something) - and I'll try stacking those in DSS to see if I can figure out where the problem is?

I'll try APP in the meantime, i just downloaded a trial version

M 27.zip