Back to basics - my ultimate system...

[andrew s]

... or if you prefer my posers system.

Having fully automated my main setup and shipped it to PixelSkies I have nothing to get my hands on. This together with the BAA back to basics drive made me consider the ultimate solar system manual rig with a bit of clusters and bright M and NGC objects thrown in for good measure. 

The logic such as it was, was to avoid long cool down and dew hence the Mewlon (no refractors for me) . The lack of availability of Monocentric eyepieces led to the Abbe Orthoscopics. Portable. But, mainly it was just about how good things looked as well as working as near perfectly as possible!

Its a personal choice and no chance of getting it as SWMBO decreed no more telescopes as the cost of shipping the kit to Spain, hence, the lack of a budget.

So here it is costed by and all available from FLO.

What would you choose?

Regards Andrew

PS Missed of the telescope cost £4545.00. I wounder if FLO would give a discount for a one off purchase!

 

Edited May 21, 2020 by andrew s

[JeremyS]

That's quite a few Tak and Berlebach shout outs, Andrew.  Are you feeling OK? Its not even a 5:2 low day. Perhaps it's the heat?

🙂

 

[Alan White]

I was sad that a Tak diagonal was not in the list Jeremy.
and a Tak mount to round it off, as much as I love and desire an AZ100.

Edited May 21, 2020 by Alan White

[andrew s]

1 hour ago, JeremyS said:

That's quite a few Tak and Berlebach shout outs, Andrew.  Are you feeling OK? Its not even a 5:2 low day. Perhaps it's the heat?

🙂

 

You obviously missed the "basics" reference 😜. Chocolate and alcohol high.

1 hour ago, Alan White said:

I was sad that a Tak diagonal was not in the list Jeremy.
and a Tak mount to round it off, as much as I love and desire an AZ100.

I think the Tak diagonal is a prism 😏 Still looking for all reflecting eyepiece design. 

Not sure Tak mounts are in the same class as their optics?

Regards Andrew 

[andrew s]

Actually @JeremyS I went for the Mewlon as it's a pure Dall-Kirkham design and also the Abbe  orthoscopics are (as I understand it) the original design. Not to mention an unhealthy love of quality optics.

Regards Andrew 

Edited May 21, 2020 by andrew s

[JeremyS]

28 minutes ago, andrew s said:

Actually @JeremyS I went for the Mewlon as it's a pure Dall-Kirkham design and also the Abbe  orthoscopics are (as I understand it) the original design. Not to mention an unhealthy love of quality optics.

Regards Andrew 

Are you sure it's the quality optics and not their smell and that of the wooden Berlebach?

[John]

It certainly looks a great setup.

If you get a chance, it is nice to have the chance to own and use something that is in or around the top tier performance wise.

There is a certain satisfaction from gazing at, say, a nice tight double star under steady seeing and thinking that it's quite probably as good as it is going to look though anything of that aperture than an amateur can own.

Mind you, you also realise just how good the regular stuff has become these days, often at much lower cost

 

 

 

 

[andrew s]

31 minutes ago, John said:

Mind you, you also realise just how good the regular stuff has become these days, often at much lower cost

I did consider a OO VX 6L or 8L 1/10 PV on their Dobsonian mount plus half the orthoscopics as a practical back to basics system. 

Again a classic optical design and the Dobsonian mount is not too far removed from one William Herschel would have recognised but, in mahogany. 

Regards Andrew 

[andrew s]

44 minutes ago, John said:

There is a certain satisfaction from gazing at, say, a nice tight double star under steady seeing and thinking that it's quite probably as good as it is going to look though anything of that aperture than an amateur can own.

For me to find a nice nice tight double I would have to add the encoders and Nexus DSC. So Back to the slippery slope that led to full automation.

Regards Andrew 

Edited May 21, 2020 by andrew s

[JeremyS]

1 hour ago, John said:

There is a certain satisfaction from gazing at, say, a nice tight double star under steady seeing and thinking that it's quite probably as good as it is going to look though anything of that aperture than an amateur can own.

Spot on John. Last night I ended my observing session with the C9.25 by looking at Porrima and Izar. Of course they were easily separated, but they just didn't give me the satisfaction that I have when using the Tak TSA 120. For the perfect Airy discs and diffraction rings provided by an unobstructed refactor cannot be matched. Mind you, the views of M13 and M92 were better with the C9.25 as they were much better resolved, perhaps due to more fainter stars being seen.

I'm glad I don't have to chose between the two instruments.

And when @andrew s gets his Mewlon I might ask him for a look through.

[JeremyS]

2 hours ago, andrew s said:

Actually @JeremyS I went for the Mewlon as it's a pure Dall-Kirkham design and also the Abbe  orthoscopics are (as I understand it) the original design. Not to mention an unhealthy love of quality optics.

Good enough reasons to me, Andrew! Sounds like a great plan

[JeremyS]

There’s a good review of the Mewlon here http://www.scopeviews.co.uk/TakMewlon180C.htm , @andrew s, by Roger Vine. He does mention long cool down time tho. Maybe worth considering a Tak refractor?  No central obstruction either.

[andrew s]

8 minutes ago, JeremyS said:

There’s a good review of the Mewlon here http://www.scopeviews.co.uk/TakMewlon180C.htm , @andrew s, by Roger Vine. He does mention long cool down time tho. Maybe worth considering a Tak refractor?  No central obstruction either.

Thanks Jeremy but it's just a dream as SWMBO has ruled it out and in reality I don't  think I would use it. My eye sight is not that good and I never mastered star hopping.

Interesting review, however, cool down was from a warm room, a silly place to keep it.

I am unconvinced by central obstruction voodoo. The MTF of a suitably sized obstructed telescope can easily exceed that of the largest realistic sized refractor.  

However, I am not going to be drawn into an argument about it. I know there are strong views especially amongst refractor aficionados.  Thierry Legault the French astro-photographer who uses both has a very balanced view on his web site.

Regards Andrew 

[ollypenrice]

On 21/05/2020 at 17:50, andrew s said:

 

Not sure Tak mounts are in the same class as their optics?

Regards Andrew 

They're not! The EM200 Temma Junior was my worst ever astro-investment. Despite its exorbitant price it came without GoTo, other than via a primitive planetarium to which it frequently failed to connect. It was more reliable running in TheSky6 but non-connection remained a permanent anxiety.  Sometimes it would guide very well indeed and sometimes it wouldn't, with no rhyme or reason, in a permanent setup. With use its nylon gears developed backlash and I sold it on, fully declared, at an eye-watering loss. When working well it was more accurate than an EQ6, when not working well it was less accurate. It is not a patch on the Avalon Linear Fast Reverse or the Mesu. The one thing I really did like about it was the polar alignment system it employed.

Olly

[mikeDnight]

On 21/05/2020 at 14:53, andrew s said:

... or if you prefer my posers system.

Having fully automated my main setup and shipped it to PixelSkies I have nothing to get my hands on. This together with the BAA back to basics drive made me consider the ultimate solar system manual rig with a bit of clusters and bright M and NGC objects thrown in for good measure. 

The logic such as it was, was to avoid long cool down and dew hence the Mewlon (no refractors for me) . The lack of availability of Monocentric eyepieces led to the Abbe Orthoscopics. Portable. But, mainly it was just about how good things looked as well as working as near perfectly as possible!

Its a personal choice and no chance of getting it as SWMBO decreed no more telescopes as the cost of shipping the kit to Spain, hence, the lack of a budget.

So here it is costed by and all available from FLO.

What would you choose?

Regards Andrew

PS Missed of the telescope cost £4545.00. I wounder if FLO would give a discount for a one off purchase!

 

If I could change just one thing (possibly two), it would be the 4mm Ortho for either a 3.4mm Vixen HR or 4mm TOA. I know they are more expensive but its not my money, so it doesn't count. Plus, both would be much more comfortable to use at high power than the 4mm Ortho. I haven't used the TAO but the HR is stunning! Also, is the StellaMira diagonal good enough?  I might be inclined to lean more towards the Baader BBHS mirror diagonal if you want to avoid prisms. Mrs S won't mind when you tell her it will be the last outfit you'll ever need. I've always found that a promise like that is good for at least two or three scopes!

Edited May 24, 2020 by mikeDnight

[Helen]

Nice list Andrew!   I keep looking back at the Mewlon as an option for my travel set up for time spend away on UK. Double mounted with my tak 100 would be awesome!!

I've been wondering whether to set it as a reward to myself if I ever get the big programming routine I'm working on for my PhD sorted out 🤔. Or maybe my first published paper..... Might be useful for 67P return in the new year....

Helen

[andrew s]

20 hours ago, Helen said:

Nice list Andrew!   I keep looking back at the Mewlon as an option for my travel set up for time spend away on UK. Double mounted with my tak 100 would be awesome!!

I've been wondering whether to set it as a reward to myself if I ever get the big programming routine I'm working on for my PhD sorted out 🤔. Or maybe my first published paper..... Might be useful for 67P return in the new year....

Helen

Rewarding oneself is highly recommended especially if it involves astronomy.

Good luck with the PhD what is the program for or is it a state secret ?

Regards Andrew 

[Helen]

Indeed Andrew!!

My PhD is analysing the Rostta Mission amateur campaign - the data and the campaign management. I'm working on an automated analysis routine (particularly where meta data is missing) and also looking at developing tools and routines for ensuring the meta data is complete in future campaigns.

Helen

[andrew s]

24 minutes ago, Helen said:

Indeed Andrew!!

My PhD is analysing the Rostta Mission amateur campaign - the data and the campaign management. I'm working on an automated analysis routine (particularly where meta data is missing) and also looking at developing tools and routines for ensuring the meta data is complete in future campaigns.

Helen

Sounds very interesting. Hope it goes well.

Regards Andrew 

[jetstream]

On 21/05/2020 at 15:53, andrew s said:

I am unconvinced by central obstruction voodoo. The MTF of a suitably sized obstructed telescope can easily exceed that of the largest realistic sized refractor.  

[coopman827]

Voodoo is real.

[jetstream]

On 24/05/2020 at 09:09, mikeDnight said:

4mm Ortho for either a 3.4mm Vixen HR or 4mm TOA.

me too, the Vixen HR's are my best eyepieces.

[jetstream]

Someday I'll have a Mewlon, one is on the top of my list actually.

The only thing is the gymnastic ability required to use one, exacerbated by a manual non goto mount. A dobsonian is much easier to use for me over my AZ EQ6 and TSA120. The TSA 120 appears technically perfect to my semi educated eyes but my 10 VX shows so much more...

IMHO you will love every bit of the 180mm Mewlon, including the optics.

@Stu might be able to add to the conversation.

[andrew s]

I am in shock. My wife just offered to buy me a telescope! 

I take it all back, whatever I may have implied in the past.

Watch this space.

Regards Andrew 

[jetstream]

On 31/05/2020 at 04:57, andrew s said:

Watch this space.

Watching

Still thinking Mewlon?