Advice for a Budget Telescope, please

[Dash1st]

Hi,

I was hoping I might get some advice about buying a beginner telescope on a tight budget, under £150, if possible. I've seen things like these, but was unsure if any good for a beginner & are they cheap for a reason.......

Celestron Travelscope 80 22030-CGL Refactor Telescope - Sale price £49.99 was £109.99

Celestron Astromaster 70AZ LT - £78.48

Celestron Astromaster 114EQ - £109.98

Celestron Omni XLT 114AZ - £129.99

My wife & young daughter love stargazing, but we live in a town with lots of light pollution, so ideally I was thinking of possibly buying something that's easy to move (travel with) & setup without too much fuss. Depending on how much success we/they have with this, then we'd look to getting something better in the future.

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated.

Many thanks.

[Neil H]

Hi I am a newbie myself I did have an Celestron powerseeker 114 it was ok not brill  so got binned waste of £65, I was on a tight budget too  I landed up getting a really nice skywatcher 150/750 for £110 off eBay , you may be better off looking second hand as your get a lot more telescope  for your money , if you see something of interest put on a link and the great guys and gals on here will tell if it's worth a look , 99% of the person's in this hobby look after there telescopes

[vlaiv]

How about this then:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-heritage-130p-flextube.html

It is 130mm, very portable, costs £142 and only "modification" I would do to it would be adding a black fabric shroud when observing in light pollution areas.

or can be cardboard based:

[Owmuchonomy]

Hi and welcome.  For your situation avoid anything on an EQ mount.  I would recommend either of these.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes/skywatcher-heritage-100p-tabletop-dobsonian.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes/skywatcher-heritage-130p-flextube.html

Check this out too: https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes.html

[Cosmic Geoff]

The kind of mount you will get bundled with a budget telescope is not going to be great. With the Heritage models mentioned more than once above, you are putting most of your money into the optical tube, (and not spending half of it on a flimsy mount) and if you decide you don't like the tabletop mount, you can put the optical tube on a better mount at a later date.

[Dash1st]

Many thanks to you all for your advice, it is very much appreciated.

I've had a good look at these & I'm sure my wife & daughter would love them. I myself have no idea about telescopes & was wondering if the 130p flex is ok to use in a town & does it need anything to help reduce light polution?

I was also wondering if these are good to take to less light polluted areas, or would something with a telescopic stand, even if it's a bit more expensive to buy, something like the Sky watcher Explorer 130p (EQ-2)?

1 hour ago, Owmuchonomy said:

Hi and welcome.  For your situation avoid anything on an EQ mount.  I would recommend either of these.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes/skywatcher-heritage-100p-tabletop-dobsonian.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes/skywatcher-heritage-130p-flextube.html

Check this out too: https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes.html

Thanks again.

[vlaiv]

Dobsonian mount is very well regarded with amateur astronomers for its simplicity of operation.

It is also often recommended and used because it is the least expensive type of mount - so more of the budget goes into the optics. If you have more money to spend, then I would say have a look at this scope:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-skyliner-150p-dobsonian.html

There are some drawbacks to that scope - it is much larger to carry around, but will fit in car without too much problems.

Only advantage that EQ mount offers is - it can track object with motion in only one axis, and this motion is uniform - so it is well suited to adopting motors to drive it. It has other benefits that are much less important for observing and much more for imaging - like lack of field rotation and such.

Issue with EQ type mount is that cheap models are really shaky and light weight. They are a bit awkward to use for beginner - you need to polar align them and motion of the telescope tube is not straight forward to grasp. With EQ type mount, newtonian (mirror) type telescopes often end up in strange positions for observing - you need to rotate whole telescope in its rings to get eyepiece to suitable position.

With telescopes aperture is very important factor in what it will show you.

For this reason, beginners often go with newtonian type telescope as it offers the most aperture for their money. Because of newtonian construction - they are well suited for alt/az type mounts - that thing with eyepiece being in awkward positions. And in the end cheapest alt-az mount is dobsonian mount.

From all of that you can see why dob mounted telescope is recommended for beginner. Now, 130P flex tube is very lightweight and portable scope, and only drawback is that it is open / truss tube design and my recommendation would be to fashion some sort of shroud for it to stop stray light from entering it. Larger scopes become less portable really fast. They also tend to be fairly bulky really fast.

Here is comparison of different sizes of telescopes and a grown man with height of about 6'.

If you can handle the bulk of 150mm dob (or even 200mm - it is just larger diameter and heavier but same height as focal length is the same - 1200mm) - then go for that one, if not, 130mm will serve you very well.

[NGC 1502]

Definitely agree with the above SW Heritage 130p.  Not a toy, could be all the telescope you ever need.

Plenty of online info about adding a necessary light shield at very low cost. Possibly in the future getting better eyepieces because the mirrors in the scope are great and worth the upgrade.  You may need a higher power eyepiece early in your ownership than the two supplied, not to replace them but to complement them for low, medium and high power.

Ed.

[Dash1st]

1 hour ago, vlaiv said:

Dobsonian mount is very well regarded with amateur astronomers for its simplicity of operation.

It is also often recommended and used because it is the least expensive type of mount - so more of the budget goes into the optics. If you have more money to spend, then I would say have a look at this scope:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-skyliner-150p-dobsonian.html

There are some drawbacks to that scope - it is much larger to carry around, but will fit in car without too much problems.

Only advantage that EQ mount offers is - it can track object with motion in only one axis, and this motion is uniform - so it is well suited to adopting motors to drive it. It has other benefits that are much less important for observing and much more for imaging - like lack of field rotation and such.

Issue with EQ type mount is that cheap models are really shaky and light weight. They are a bit awkward to use for beginner - you need to polar align them and motion of the telescope tube is not straight forward to grasp. With EQ type mount, newtonian (mirror) type telescopes often end up in strange positions for observing - you need to rotate whole telescope in its rings to get eyepiece to suitable position.

With telescopes aperture is very important factor in what it will show you.

For this reason, beginners often go with newtonian type telescope as it offers the most aperture for their money. Because of newtonian construction - they are well suited for alt/az type mounts - that thing with eyepiece being in awkward positions. And in the end cheapest alt-az mount is dobsonian mount.

From all of that you can see why dob mounted telescope is recommended for beginner. Now, 130P flex tube is very lightweight and portable scope, and only drawback is that it is open / truss tube design and my recommendation would be to fashion some sort of shroud for it to stop stray light from entering it. Larger scopes become less portable really fast. They also tend to be fairly bulky really fast.

Here is comparison of different sizes of telescopes and a grown man with height of about 6'.

If you can handle the bulk of 150mm dob (or even 200mm - it is just larger diameter and heavier but same height as focal length is the same - 1200mm) - then go for that one, if not, 130mm will serve you very well.

Thanks for your very detailed explanation, which has now made a lot more sense of everything to me. The decision I now have to decide upon is, do I go for the 130p flex or spend the extra & buy the bigger 150p, either way I now think I won't be wasting my money on buying one of these. I know the 150p would allow my wife & daughter to see far more space, but I think I will end up buying the smaller 130p flex, purely just for the fact it is smaller & would be easier to move about & store.

But once again, I do thank all who have replied, you have certainly helped stop me from wasting money on one of the cheaper telescopes.

[Raph-in-the-sky]

It might be a bit more expensive than what you had in mind but 200mm Dobson can go for about £200 on the second hand market.

Also keep in mind that the eyepiece you will receive with most scopes are rubbish. I would set a £100 on the side for a couple of decent eyepiece (on this forum it basically means BST starguiders)

[vlaiv]

41 minutes ago, Dash1st said:

Thanks for your very detailed explanation, which has now made a lot more sense of everything to me. The decision I now have to decide upon is, do I go for the 130p flex or spend the extra & buy the bigger 150p, either way I now think I won't be wasting my money on buying one of these. I know the 150p would allow my wife & daughter to see far more space, but I think I will end up buying the smaller 130p flex, purely just for the fact it is smaller & would be easier to move about & store.

But once again, I do thank all who have replied, you have certainly helped stop me from wasting money on one of the cheaper telescopes.

I find it good idea to view a few youtube videos of people handling said scopes to get the idea of the size/bulk involved. More than once I was surprised by the size of telescope in person versus the idea of size I got from looking at pictures of a given telescope on the internet - they always look smaller on pictures for some reason

150p is large enough to be life time telescope, and so is 200p but I do believe they will be too bulky for you to start with.

Also, advice on additional eyepieces is sound one, but you don't have to rush into it - there is plenty to see with stock eyepieces.

[Mic2020]

I am a newbie and I bought second hand from FaceBook Market place. I paid £60 for the Skywatcher 130 and EQ2 Mount and for what I paid I think I got a good deal. Look around I think second hand you will get a lot more for your money. The money I saved has allowed me to buy additional equipment and books. Good luck in your search.

[Dash1st]

3 hours ago, Mic2020 said:

I am a newbie and I bought second hand from FaceBook Market place. I paid £60 for the Skywatcher 130 and EQ2 Mount and for what I paid I think I got a good deal. Look around I think second hand you will get a lot more for your money. The money I saved has allowed me to buy additional equipment and books. Good luck in your search.

Now you've thrown a spanner in the works. 🤔

You got me looking & I've found the same telescope as you have shown locally, but he's asking for £100, but it comes with an EQ2 motor. I looked it up online & it seems to be £195, without the motor, but is a motor any good or just a gimmick?

What do I do? 😵

[Marvin Jenkins]

Seriously, you are at the beginning of potentially a long journey. You need to learn the night sky and what to look at, and I am sure you will.

The only reason for an eq mount is to track an object, but at eq 1 or 2 level this is not really feasible as the way the mount is made is just not very good. I know as I have one with an Orion 130 newt installed.

The scope is to heavy for the mount. After a simple focus adjustment it takes a few seconds for the mount to stop wobbling, which makes focusing a real trial and error.

My heart felt advice is buy a Heritage 130 flex tube. Proper scope, galaxy capable under dark skies for a great price without throwing an eq1/2 in the tip after a year.

At the beginning go aperture without the useless complication of a useless low end eq mount and tripod.

Marvin

[joe aguiar]

Motor is good depends which one norn simple single axis motor is $50 

100 seems ok but depends if it's like new condition u may get cheaper if it's used bit more or if person just wants it gone

joejaguar 

[vlaiv]

27 minutes ago, Dash1st said:

What do I do?

Start by watching a few videos on youtube - this one in particular:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHdDs2PLIrk

then this one to get the idea of size of the telescope in question:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Kujf1tTnAk

and in the end this one to get the idea of what is involved with operating eq mount:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TNrPLHB21k

As a contrast to those, have a look at these - which feature 130mm dob scope:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEs_MMcJ7JA

or this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVgOG5JzZGQ

another one from different manufacturer but same model:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-muZ9KRMY40

 

[Nyctimene]

20 minutes ago, Dash1st said:

What do I do?

I'd stay with the decision for the 130 P Flextube, and avoid any EQ mount type for a Newtonian design telescope, that is used visual - for the reasons vlaiv mentioned above:

6 hours ago, vlaiv said:

Issue with EQ type mount is that cheap models are really shaky and light weight. They are a bit awkward to use for beginner - you need to polar align them and motion of the telescope tube is not straight forward to grasp. With EQ type mount, newtonian (mirror) type telescopes often end up in strange positions for observing - you need to rotate whole telescope in its rings to get eyepiece to suitable position

A Dobsonian telescope can be used intuitively, even by children. No hassle with polar aligning etc., just carry it out, plonk it down and observe. The 130 P Flextube is a joy to use - very compact, lightweight, versatile, with excellent optics. Many other pleased owners on here. Have a look at the huge thread on the CloudyNights forum (the AWB scope mentioned there is just the US brand - same built):

https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/463109-onesky-newtonian-astronomers-without-borders/

It's my most used grab-and-go scope (together with two eyepieces, the ES 26mmf/62° LER,  the Seben 8-24 mmf Zoom, and the Baader 2.25x turret Barlow).

Stephan

 

[Marvin Jenkins]

This is to simplify things not frustrate. My first scope Orion Space Probe 130 Newtonian on an EQ 2 mount no motors.

Served me well for my first year, but never polar aligned it, just plonked it on the ground in the direction of what I wanted to look at!

I have to say I got my first glimpses of amazing things due to it being a five inch scope under dark skies

The bug bit and I bought a SW NEQ5 mount with all the mods of Goto with polar alignment scope. Even with all that switched off and just casting around the sky on the EQ5 manually, my starter Orion was a totally different scope. With no change in scope I could see objects like the Ring Nebula!!!

There is a saying... No Mount, no scope. Keep it small Dob at the beginning and you will not go wrong.

Marv

[Raph-in-the-sky]

12 hours ago, Dash1st said:

Now you've thrown a spanner in the works. 🤔

You got me looking & I've found the same telescope as you have shown locally, but he's asking for £100, but it comes with an EQ2 motor. I looked it up online & it seems to be £195, without the motor, but is a motor any good or just a gimmick?

What do I do? 😵

I also started with a 130mm on EQ2. It's not intuitive and kind of wobbly  ... I wish I had gotten a dob straigh away

[BinocularSky]

+1 for the Heritage 130.

I teach astronomy courses and it is one that I recommend as the nearest thing to an ideal "absolute beginners" scope. I also have one for my granddaughters to use when they visit.

[Dash1st]

Thanks again for all the information given & the use of your outstanding knowledge, it is hugely appreciated.

My wife has kept saying that she really wanted a telescope on a tripod, but I have shown her all of your replies & I am going to buy her one of the Heritage models, though I'm still not 100% on which to buy the 130 or 150.

Thanks again.

[vlaiv]

23 minutes ago, Dash1st said:

Thanks again for all the information given & the use of your outstanding knowledge, it is hugely appreciated.

My wife has kept saying that she really wanted a telescope on a tripod, but I have shown her all of your replies & I am going to buy her one of the Heritage models, though I'm still not 100% on which to buy the 130 or 150.

Thanks again.

150 model is more serious in about everything. I would not call it "beginner" scope (if there is such a thing). It is bulkier, heavier and will show you more. It also has more focal length - which is good for planets and the Moon, but prevents you from achieving wide field views.

It is nowhere near "grab & go" as 130 model - which can be carried in one hand as you have seen from videos. As a contrast, 150 dob from skywatcher weighs in at about 16kg! Scope is about 6kg and base is about 10kg. While it can be carried easily in parts (telescope and base separately) - it is really not grab & go scope and is quite large.

[joe aguiar]

heres my take on the 130mm heritage scope this is my opnion and may or may not be yours so read and see if its valid or not to you

first I kinda like it but it has 3 issues that I don't like (yes I also did a video on it so far not memtioned on the list  up above)

the first 2 are minor but the 3rd may be more

heres the link  https://youtu.be/ozPVjDfP_UE

1-st the shroud no big deal buy black felt clip it on and there u go $10

2-a good stable stool to put it on $40 maybe

3 biggest issue for me is price its $279 b4 taxes with taxes $325 add these 2 items I just listed and now your closer $375 cdn

The meade has a 130mm which is same ota scope f/5 parabolic BUT on a eq2 mount and tripod, so no shield or table needed. Also I think a eq mount and tripod is worth more then that mini dob base which is made from paricle chip board and vinal coating. The height is also a perfect height even at the lowest tripod setting. You get manual slow motion controls which helps a lot veres keep bumping the scope every 20 secs compared to the mini dob. later on add a clock drive so it can track.

Now on polar align if that confuses new people you don't even have to learn that part to start just point it roughly north turn the tube around and view and use the controls to track. Later if you learn how to polar align then great you only have to use 1 control.

these are my is thoughts I rather for cheaper price OHH sorry the meade Polaris 130mm is $299 so its cheaper and as I said get the tripod mount etc.

if you don't agree that's ok too but these are my thoughts

joejaguar

Edited February 26, 2020 by joe aguiar

[Dash1st]

13 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

150 model is more serious in about everything. I would not call it "beginner" scope (if there is such a thing). It is bulkier, heavier and will show you more. It also has more focal length - which is good for planets and the Moon, but prevents you from achieving wide field views.

It is nowhere near "grab & go" as 130 model - which can be carried in one hand as you have seen from videos. As a contrast, 150 dob from skywatcher weighs in at about 16kg! Scope is about 6kg and base is about 10kg. While it can be carried easily in parts (telescope and base separately) - it is really not grab & go scope and is quite large.

Thanks for the reply.

My wife has it in her head that because the 130 is smaller she won't see the thing's she'd like to. But to be fair to her she has had an interest in astronomy for years & watches regular YouTube astronomer's & she does read quite a lot about space & astronomy, hence my thinking about the 150. But we do have a big car & I don't think the weight is too much of an issue, though I personally like the idea of the smaller 130, for its grab& go ease.

[vlaiv]

10 minutes ago, Dash1st said:

Thanks for the reply.

My wife has it in her head that because the 130 is smaller she won't see the thing's she'd like to. But to be fair to her she has had an interest in astronomy for years & watches regular YouTube astronomer's & she does read quite a lot about space & astronomy, hence my thinking about the 150. But we do have a big car & I don't think the weight is too much of an issue, though I personally like the idea of the smaller 130, for its grab& go ease.

There is not much difference in light gathering capacity between 5.1" and 6". If you want real improvement then go for 8"

8" dob is seriously good scope and it will show you a lot. It's a bit more bulky than 6" - with 26Kg total - split into 16kg base and about 10kg scope. It has same focal length so field of view will be the same as with 6" - not much difference there.

I love my 8" dob (also skywatcher model) and it has shown me a lot.

I do have to point out that most people get underwhelmed by what they see at eyepiece if they are used to "Hubble like" images on internet - things don't look like that at all in telescope - again youtube helps a bit there:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jI7IPPmu76U