Orion Nebula in Winter

[RRT26]

Hello again everyone.

Beginner here with following equipment:

Orion SkyScanner 100mm Reflector (New out of the box)
400mm Focal Length
f/4 Newtonian Dobsonian
Altazimuth tabletop mount until my VersaGo gets here

So, it snowed a lot today here in Georgia, the SouthEast US. Tonight I bundled up and went out to look through my scope at the Orion Nebula. I have seen it before but I was thinking with my new eyepiece, the Orion Expanse 6mm, I would be able to see it more clearly. I could see a little more definition in the nebula but not as clear as I expected with a better eyepiece. I have a UHC filter coming as I live around a good bit of streetlights and a 2x Barlow coming as well.

Do you think this will help in observing this sight better or do you think I should go to a much darker area with the filter and barlow as well? Thanks.

[Pete Presland]

Its always worth getting away from light pollution. I would also take the filter and Barlow. Spend plenty of time allowing your eyes to get accustomed to the dark and then the view through the eyepiece.

The Orion expanse eyepiece will give you X66 without the Barlow which will be a nice view, worth trying the Barlow though to get a bit closer look at the Trapezium stars in the centre.

[BGazing]

You will be amazed how much better everything looks once you get away from the light pollution. Filters help too, but, as they say, the best filter is the gasoline filter on your car. 

M42 nebula is a target for a variety of magnifications in a bigger scope, but on your scope I would suggest something around 8mm for a sweet spot (50x, 2mm exit pupil). 6mm is perhaps just  a tad more than I would use (eyepieces permitting).

Make sure you collimate your telescope properly as details might be blurred due to miscollimation.

[Stu]

It is possible that the light pollution was reflecting off the snow making things worse than normal. As others have said, get somewhere as dark as possible and let your eyes get dark adapted as much as the conditions will allow.

Were you able to see the 4 stars of the Trapezium in the centre of the nebula?

[mikeDnight]

To really get the best out of any deep sky object, especially when using a small aperture telescope, you need to shield your eyes from stray light. A dark hood or blanket over your head and eyepiece can make a big difference in how much detail you see, even from a light polluted town. Youll also need to observe an object continuously for ten to twenty minutes to see it well. Your scope is perfectly capable of showing the Orion Nebula well. Just to illustrate, I've attached a sketch of the nebula as seen in a 4" scope from town.

 

 

[Stu]

Sketch doesn't seem to have attached Mike, can you try again?

[mikeDnight]

15 minutes ago, Stu said:

Sketch doesn't seem to have attached Mike, can you try again?

Sorry Stu! I'd attached a sketch using a 70mm scope, then in a panic, edited the post. I've now attached the right sketch! 

[Paul73]

Mike - You must have had some nice dark sky for that rather splendid sketch. Certainly getting the best out of a 70mm scope.

Paul

PS. Uncovering this detail has takes dark sky, real practice & patience.

[BGazing]

Takahashi 100 Mike, that's cheating!

[Paul73]

I’ve had some great views of M42 with my little £100 100mm mini Dob. 

The trick is to not be too greedy. Reaching for too much magnification is a common mistake. With my bigger dob (4x the aperture and more than 10x the price), the real detail jumps out. But, you loose the overall beauty of the nebula flying amongst the star field of Orion.

Paul

[mikeDnight]

2 hours ago, Paul73 said:

Mike - You must have had some nice dark sky for that rather splendid sketch. Certainly getting the best out of a 70mm scope.

Paul

PS. Uncovering this detail has takes dark sky, real practice & patience.

This was the 70mm sketch Paul, which I originally posted by mistake. Not quite as good as the 100mm but still not bad! ☺

[Paul73]

Agreed. Still some nice detail for 70mm. We often forget just what these little scopes can do.

Paul

[JeremyS]

4 hours ago, mikeDnight said:

Just to illustrate, I've attached a sketch of the nebula as seen in a 4" scope from town.

Sorry if you've explained this before, Mike, but how do you actually prepare those wonderful sketches? Do you skecth with a white crayon, or do you do black pencil and the invert the colours? And how do you achieve the stunning effect of the nebulosity? This is just how M42 looks through the eyepiece!

Go well!
Jeremy

[mikeDnight]

3 hours ago, JeremyS said:

Sorry if you've explained this before, Mike, but how do you actually prepare those wonderful sketches? Do you skecth with a white crayon, or do you do black pencil and the invert the colours? And how do you achieve the stunning effect of the nebulosity? This is just how M42 looks through the eyepiece!

Go well!
Jeremy

Hi Jeremy,

It's very simple really! I merely use graphite pencils, darkening the brightest areas, so that when the image is inverted the negative sketch becomes a representation of the positive view. Attached is the original sketch!

 

[JeremyS]

30 minutes ago, mikeDnight said:

It's very simple really! I merely use graphite pencils, darkening the brightest areas, so that when the image is inverted the negative sketch becomes a representation of the positive view. Attached is the original sketch!

Thanks for this Mike. It might be simple for you, but I've never mastered it! :-)

Thanks for sharing your sketches, which I always enjoy studying.

Jeremy

[Buzzard75]

I live in a pretty small city that still has a considerable amount of light pollution and even I have a hard time with my 12". The darker the skies the better. You'll be amazed and just how much detail you can see even with the smallest of scopes.

[Ravenous]

On ‎18‎/‎01‎/‎2018 at 05:11, RRT26 said:

but I was thinking with my new eyepiece, the Orion Expanse 6mm, I would be able to see it more clearly.

The Orion Nebula is one of those objects that can be examined with any power.

6mm is higher power than I'd use - I find 20-30x will show the overall nebulosity well if you are lucky to have a dark sky - just spend a bit more time and the low contrast details begin to emerge.

60x or so is OK for looking at the Trapezium, especially on a still night. (It can be seen at 30x, possibly even lower, providing the atmosphere co-operates.) But high power makes some of the fine nebulous detail fade a bit.

Don't forget to try M78! It's a small and relatively dim target, but it too has a bit of shape to it. Try low power to find it initially.

[Stu]

43 minutes ago, Ravenous said:

Don't forget to try M78! It's a small and relatively dim target, but it too has a bit of shape to it. Try low power to find it initially.

To my shame, I have never looked at M78!! One for next time out, thanks for the reminder  

[John]

M78 reminds me of two eyes peering out through a small pale cloud of smoke

[mikeDnight]

 

[RRT26]

16 hours ago, Ravenous said:

The Orion Nebula is one of those objects that can be examined with any power.

6mm is higher power than I'd use - I find 20-30x will show the overall nebulosity well if you are lucky to have a dark sky - just spend a bit more time and the low contrast details begin to emerge.

60x or so is OK for looking at the Trapezium, especially on a still night. (It can be seen at 30x, possibly even lower, providing the atmosphere co-operates.) But high power makes some of the fine nebulous detail fade a bit.

Don't forget to try M78! It's a small and relatively dim target, but it too has a bit of shape to it. Try low power to find it initially.

Hmmm...you know after doing some research and looking at other images on the net from scopes, I wonder if I have been looking at M78 the whole time. I am very new at finding things in the sky so far. It looks very similiar to what I have been looking at. I can see 3 distinct stars and the haze around them when I look at this nebula through my scope even at 20mm.

I am supposed to go to a class next week outside with a pro astronomer to show us how to find everything and look at them through a scope of theirs.

[Ravenous]

On ‎20‎/‎01‎/‎2018 at 02:40, RRT26 said:

Hmmm...you know after doing some research and looking at other images on the net from scopes, I wonder if I have been looking at M78 the whole time.

Don't worry, that's not likely!

M42 is a big splat below the "belt" of Orion, and quite easy with binoculars. M78 is a very faint thing, small, but I mentioned it because (once your eye's had some practice) it does show a vague shape with a 100mm scope - under good conditions.

There's a finder chart for both on the page here:

https://freestarcharts.com/messier-78