New scope help please...any suggestions!

[Markadams]

Hello:) my first post here!

I had a scope as s kid snd was really into astronomy. I'm 30 now snd have some spare money and time and would love it take it up again. No rush..I've been subscribing to Sky At Night magazine for 6 months now and bought a copy of Turn Left at Orion and using my dads binoculars.

The telescope will be kept in the loft conversion and I'll use it outside and at my local astronomy clubs nights out so very tight storage in the loft and a small space in the car for transporting.

I have about £600 to spend (I could maybe stretch to £700) and at my astronomy club I loved the look of the catrioptics - is that right? - like the skywatcher 127 mak I saw. This is because of storage and transport.

I'd like to see galaxies, nebulae especially and planets especially. Patrick Moore told me once to buy a reflector over 6" and I'd like to stick with that!

I've looked st second hand Nexstar 6 SE which is the other model I was taken with at the club and got a great review from one of the owners there who rated it.

Has anyone got any advice please or is there another scope I should be looking st?

Any help is much appreciated.

thanks Mark

[Markadams]

Sorry I should have said that I'd like a goto version:)

[ronin]

They are a popular scope, one visit to a club and literally 80% of the scopes present were 5-6" Mak/SCT goto designs. There was 10 scopes there and 8 were as described, made it easy to work out the %. Being that popular they must fit and satisfy a nice part of the market.

The SCT option may be a little better, they simply tend to be f/10 whereas a Mak is often f/13.

Owing to the somewhat extended focal length you lose on the eventual field, simple case that a 15mm eyepiece will give something like 100x so say 1/2 degree view, whereas a 15mm in one of my refractors gives 40x so about 1.25 degree view. Easy answer is but longish focal length eyepieces. A 30mm plossl will deliver 1 degree.

You will need dependable power, batteries are OK for about the first 3 or 4 times you use the scope after that they limit you a bit. Use new batteries every time so visit a £land for their packs. There are battery packs you can get, Li-Ionbut you may need to make suitable cables to get from one to the other.

They are not automatic, actually to some extent they are very manual, you supply data, you level and set it all up, you center the alignment stars, you have to read the manual , you even have to tell it where to go to, you have to know what to look at. Against some reasoning but you have to know where what you have asked it go to actually is. It is a good idea to have some idea of where it should slew to.

The long focal length and the tendency to highish magnifications mean a reasonable tripod is essential.

Expect to want additional eyepieces soon after purchase, start with a 30mm plossl or say 25mm BST, wide views/, then maybe an 18mm or 20mm plossl/BST.

Make a simple dew shield, card or foam and some self adhesive velcro.

They are fine for planetary imaging, not the best idea for DSO imaging.

[popeye85]

This is a great scope-sounds just like what you need and will leave to plenty left over to upgrade EPS and such. 

 

 

[Markadams]

Thank you both for that. Would you say that for nebulae snd galaxy viewing to look at something else?

Would the Nexstar be better than a mak?

I'm assuming a long focal length means a less wide view?

Thank you Mark

[Markadams]

Sorry to keep launching questions! 

A 8" dob seems to be highly rated for observing (I don't want to do ap at this time) so would that be better if they were portable enough? I've seen the flex tubes which are adjusted to a small size for transport which look good. Would I be able to carry down stairs with it ok snd fit in my car?

I just would need to figure out if goto was needed to keep in my budget - any thoughts please.

Thanks to you all!

[happy-kat]

If you are observing in your loft you need a telescope with the eye piece at the bottom not at the top. So a refractor or a sct/mak not a reflector. Lofts aren't ideal because of heat thermals, best if it is not heated would help.

Assuming you are poking out through an open velux/window.

[Markadams]

Sorry Kat I didn't explain myself well. It would be stored in our loft conversion so I'd have to take it down 2 flights of stairs. I was thinking of portability!

[happy-kat]

Gosh I would be looking for something that could be carried complete over my shoulder (If I could do it) I wouldn't be looking at something awkard to carry and heavy.

[alanjgreen]

Mark,

A nexstar SCT is a great scope. I went from a 130 reflector to a 8" SCT and the difference is mind blowing. Yes, you will see nebula and galaxies in a 8" SCT.

the nexstar has a good mount.

as ronin says, you will need to budget for dew shield and power pack if you go the Nexstar route. 

But you will have a scope that can give you years of use.

SCTs are great on planets and globular clusters, you will get great planetary views of Jupiter, saturn and mars.

personally, I would not go less than 8" as you will outgrow the scope sooner or even sooner  

when I had a C8 SCT, it used to sit on the front passenger seat, seat belted in of course. They are easy to transport.

please ask any other questions?

Alan

[alanjgreen]

4 hours ago, Markadams said:

The telescope will be kept in the loft conversion and I'll use it outside and at my local astronomy clubs nights out so very tight storage in the loft and a small space in the car for transporting.

It won't be long until you take over the dining room (like the rest of us).

think of all the things from downstairs that would be perfectly happy relocated in the loft conversion

[Stormbringer]

2 minutes ago, alanjgreen said:

It won't be long until you take over the dining room (like the rest of us).

think of all the things from downstairs that would be perfectly happy relocated in the loft conversion

like the dining table etc 

[Louis D]

Avoid anything on a GEM.  With the counterweights, it's like carrying two OTAs.  A dob mount isn't too bad to carry if you can hug it close to your body.  The Skywatcher Skyliner 200P FlexTube GOTO ticks most of your boxes.  At 8 inches, you'll be able to see many DSOs.  It's shorter focal length than an 8 inch SCT will allow you to see larger objects.  It's smaller secondary obstruction will also render contrastier planetary views than an SCT.  It collapses to take up much less room in storage or during transport.  It's also very close to your budget.   Certainly closer than an 8" goto SCT.  The US versions of these scopes (8, 10, and 12 inch versions) dominate the star party field along with 8, 10, and 12 inch SCTs here in Texas.  Looking through them, I thought the views were quite nice and the tracking superb for visual use.  They seemed easy to setup compared to the older 12 to 16 inch dobs with goto on the field.

[Markadams]

Thanks for all your replies. I'm a bit confused to be honest but nothing to do with your replies!

I suspect a dob might be too bulky as I want to take it on holiday and see dark star sites and we have two dogs which take up a lot of room in the car!

I love the 8SE but it's out of my price range even if second hand. 

I guess there's the 6SE (like I said I want a min 6"). Or there's the Skywatcher Explorr 150p EQ3 pro goto at £569 which is within budget.

It's anice problem to have and good looking through all the telescope retailers but there does seem to be a distinct lack of 6" scopes around.

Thanks for all your comments...please keep them coming:)

Mark

 

 

 

[happy-kat]

For ease what about the 150p on the Az4 and well within budget

link here

 

[rockystar]

I'm normally all for the 8" dob, but in your case, I'd probably suggest something else, as after the first 2 or 3 times of carting it down two flights of stairs, only for the clouds to roll in for the night, it will soon get tiresome.

how about a reflector? Skywatcher do a nice range of not too expensive scopes in the star traveller range:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/startravel/skywatcher-startravel-120-az3.html

It's an inch off desired, but I do believe SPM said 6" in a reflector and 4" in a refractor. This is nearly 5". It will show plenty and get you going, and if you do upgrade in the future, it could still be your camping scope.

[Cosmic Geoff]

If you are prioritising portability, light weight and usability then you definitely want a catadioptric on a GoTo mount.  As regards the 6se you are considering, the OTA and the mount head can be carried as an assembly.  An unexpected bonus of the 6se mount or 8se mount (they're the same) is that it's tall enough to be used comfortably with the legs fully retracted (for added stability), and in that configuration at the end of a session you can pick up the whole thing (OTA, mount and tripod) and carry it through a domestic doorway just as it is, without straining yourself. 

If you are going to regularly carry the kit up and down two flights of stairs I would suggest for health-and-safety reasons that you provide means for carrying it one-handed (so that you have a hand free to grab the banister). That should not be difficult with a modestly sized catadrioptic as it will probably pop into one of those strong but cheap bags you can buy at the Ikea checkout.  There are also purpose made carry cases for these scopes but the prices may shock you.

[JOC]

Dobsonians

I'm def. no expert, but I can provide some practical shifting advice based on my own telescope.

I've got the Skywatcher 200P dobsonian goto flextube 8"

I asked for advice just before Christmas the thread is here: 

IIRC on page 3 is a useful schematic of various mirror sizes of Dobsonian telescopes vs. a 6ft man posted by brantuk which is a really good guide.  A picture of my eventual purchase is on the last page. 

Now two flights of stairs - I live in a such a house and my bedroom is the converted loft - my final set of stairs has a twist in it too.  My telescope easily lifts off its base - you just unscrew a single hand driven bolt and refits just as simply.  On its stand it is scarcely shiftable - just about slide-able or very gently rocked and slightly rolled along from rubber stop to rubber stop on its base.  If you fancy a Dob. then consider a flextube like mine - those big long rods in the photo cause the top part of the tube to slide back along 9/10ths of their length and this makes the whole thing more transportable.  I guess the tube becomes about a metre+ long and I can easily (but carefully) lift it single handed.  The base becomes a similar weight, but it is an awkward shape for one person to move for any distance - maybe 100 yards outside before I put it down - its easier with 2 people, but I think for security the tube itself is actually better as a one person job.   For a special event could I carry it up/down my two flights of stairs?  In its two pieces (which is how I normally shift it around), yes - Maybe once/twice a week, but I'd need to be really dedicated to the cause (in fact I'd like to get it to the first floor and sit in on our balcony one night) and I haven't done so yet.  At the moment it's being kept in the porch which is nice because its like a kitchen mixer - you tend to use it if its on the bench and you can easily get to it.

On that basis I would consider that what I've got is probably at the top end of what you might like to consider in terms of size and if I were you and absolutely needed to keep it up two flights of stairs I think I'd been aiming at a bit smaller.  I hope this helps.

[Markadams]

Thank you for all of your posts - there's a lot of really helpful advice there and it's appreciated.
i did look at the flex 8" don but I think movement will be a problem and the dining room sadly isn't an option! It's a pity as that was my first choice for a while.
im happy to bide my time in looking at the moment but I think my options are a secondhand Nexstar 6SE or a really cheap 8SE! Or, reducing my 6" rule down and buying the Skywatcher 127 Mak.

I do like the look of the Skywatcher 150 P as suggested perhaps with the EQ3 pro goto. Does anyone have any experience of it? It seems portable enough but the 6" mirror that I wanted is still there:)

I am planning a trip to my nearest retailer to have a look and see what I make of them.
thanks again.
Mark

[alanjgreen]

Mark,

you may end up needing three trips down the stairs if you go for an EQ mount. One for the tripod, one for the mount + weights and one for the tube.

An Alt-Az mount has less bits.

the eyepiece can end up anywhere on EQ - great for photography less so visual.

get a demo if you go to a shop to see some scopes...

 

Alan

[LukeSkywatcher]

On 08/01/2017 at 21:08, happy-kat said:

Gosh I would be looking for something that could be carried complete over my shoulder (If I could do it) I wouldn't be looking at something awkard to carry and heavy.

Agreed. A nice big aperture scope, that is very portable (in one piece). 

"A nexstar SCT is a great scope. I went from a 130 reflector to a 8" SCT and the difference is mind blowing. Yes, you will see nebula and galaxies in a 8" SCT".

I did exactly the same (130p to 8" SCT) , and the difference truely is mind blowing.

 

[LukeSkywatcher]

36 minutes ago, alanjgreen said:

Mark,

you may end up needing three trips down the stairs if you go for an EQ mount. One for the tripod, one for the mount + weights and one for the tube.

An Alt-Az mount has less bits.

the eyepiece can end up anywhere on EQ - great for photography less so visual.

get a demo if you go to a shop to see some scopes...

 

Alan

Oh i remember the nights i used an EQ (i can count them on 2 hands and have fingers to spare).

3 trips indoors in my wheelchair. The eyepiece ending up anywhere but at my eye level.

No thanks. Alt-AZ all the way for me now (although i do own a small 5" Dob also) and use a small 90mm refractor on a camera tripod for solar observing (with safety filters).

 

[Markadams]

Thanks to you all; I could have made a serious mistake there. 

So I'm now thinking of a 6 SE which might take me over budget if I need any accessories with it or a second hand 8 SE if I can find one.....they seem to be going for £850-£900 which sadly is out of my league!

Either that or back to the 5" idea of a mak which wouldn't be bad at all.

Food for thought! 

Thanks again 

 

[iapa]

On 08/01/2017 at 21:52, Stormbringer said:

like the dining table etc 

No - you need to keep that to lay out all the bits you plan to use on any particular night.

Also useful for cleaning your bits and pieces too.

[iapa]

On 08/01/2017 at 21:08, happy-kat said:

Gosh I would be looking for something that could be carried complete over my shoulder (If I could do it) I wouldn't be looking at something awkard to carry and heavy.

Possibly a little more in the way of caveats there? 

At a push, minus weight bar, I can get an AVX over my shoulder.

Seriously tho', stair landings are an issue - we have a 90deg turn 7 steps up (or down) and Anything more than about 42" in length is just is not going down stairs with me.