100D, 1300D or 700D? Which one?

[StargeezerTim]

I am thinking of buying a second DSLR. It will be modded and mainly used for widefield with lenses, tracked on a eq5pro. I currently use a 100D with my scopes, guided, and I am very happy with it. (very light...)

I see the 700D has a flip out screen which might be useful, but I tend to us a phone or tablet to focus anyway, so it is not essential. All of the three cameras come in at a similar price. As far as I can see, they all have the same sensor.

Does anyone have any views about which of the three would be best for widefield? Are they all the same regarding noise levels?

Thanks, I look forward to your views. Tim. 

[Alien 13]

700D every time the flip out screen is far far far better than any app, tablet or PC at getting good focus.

Alan

[happy-kat]

I'm surprised the 700d is the same price or there abouts as it is not in the same range level it's above the other two.

The 1300d is digic 4+ the other two are digic 5. The 1300d has the least options.

[StargeezerTim]

12 minutes ago, happy-kat said:

I'm surprised the 700d is the same price or there abouts as it is not in the same range level it's above the other two.

The 1300d is digic 4+ the other two are digic 5. The 1300d has the least options.

Its about 20 quid extra compared to the others. Thats from HDEW, which are grey imports, but the warranty is invalidated when modding anyway.

[happy-kat]

In that case I would ignore the 1300d and choose between the other two

[happy-kat]

The 100d has weight on it's side and the 700d the flip screen.

[RichM63]

A 700D on an EQ5 Pro will never be an issue unless perhaps your lens is an 800mm F4 L.

[SilverAstro]

15 hours ago, StargeezerTim said:

Its about 20 quid extra compared to the others. Thats from HDEW, which are grey imports, but the warranty is invalidated when modding anyway.

Would it not be better to mod the 100 and rubbish its warranty (if any remains) than to sacrifice it on a shiny new 700, if you are comparing prices (value) you should do it on all or none ! ?

Yep, I also am wondering which.

 

[Jokehoba]

16 hours ago, Alien 13 said:

...the flip out screen is far far far better than any app, tablet or PC at getting good focus.

I apologise but I disagree. If you already have a PC connected for guiding, mount and imaging camera control, why limit yourself to a tiny screen on camera when you have a much larger one on the PC? Software can allow for a much greater zoom capability, often with focus-aids such as numeric/graphical FWHM display. I never use the screen on my 1100D any more, and always turn it off so it doesn't contribute heat (noise) to exposure.

Of course, without a PC you would have to reply on the camera screen, and so a flip screen would be a benefit.

[StargeezerTim]

18 hours ago, happy-kat said:

 

2 hours ago, SilverAstro said:

Would it not be better to mod the 100 and rubbish its warranty (if any remains) than to sacrifice it on a shiny new 700, if you are comparing prices (value) you should do it on all or none ! ?

Yep, I also am wondering which.

 

The 100d is already modded. I want another so i can have two rigs imaging at the same time. ☺

[Adam J]

I would not get any of those I would get the 600D second hand.

However, I would avoid the 100D as it has an issue with heating up badly during long exposures due to the compact size. As a result its noisy.

[SilverAstro]

31 minutes ago, StargeezerTim said:

The 100d is already modded. I want another so i can have two rigs imaging at the same time.

Ah ! I see, that puts a whole different light (!) on things, so any min. now you'll be wanting a 3rd so you can do a red, a blue & a green at the same time !

Ok, back to being serious : who is this HDEW and doesnt he do 100 / 1300 so that you are comparing like cost with like with 700 ? off to google for him > >

 

 

[Alien 13]

3 hours ago, Jokehoba said:

I apologise but I disagree. If you already have a PC connected for guiding, mount and imaging camera control, why limit yourself to a tiny screen on camera when you have a much larger one on the PC? Software can allow for a much greater zoom capability, often with focus-aids such as numeric/graphical FWHM display. I never use the screen on my 1100D any more, and always turn it off so it doesn't contribute heat (noise) to exposure.

Of course, without a PC you would have to reply on the camera screen, and so a flip screen would be a benefit.

My own experience with the 650D is that the camera screen shows many more stars than the PC screen in fact on Orion the nebula shows up very well and a t X10 it is possible to see very faint stars. I dont know the reason for this but I wonder if the direct live view output misses some of the in camera processing circuitry out.

Alan

[Jokehoba]

6 minutes ago, Alien 13 said:

My own experience with the 650D is that the camera screen shows many more stars than the PC screen in fact on Orion the nebula shows up very well and a t X10 it is possible to see very faint stars. I dont know the reason for this but I wonder if the direct live view output misses some of the in camera processing circuitry out.

Alan

So I guess each camera model differs in how effective using the built-in screen is for focusing. My bad experience was my first serious attempt at M31. I thought the focus was great - from the LCD, even at x10 - but all the stars turned out to be little doughnuts! That was 3 hours wasted but a lesson learned, and I've not used the camera LCD for focusing since.

[StargeezerTim]

1 hour ago, Adam J said:

I would not get any of those I would get the 600D second hand.

However, I would avoid the 100D as it has an issue with heating up badly during long exposures due to the compact size. As a result its noisy.

Where did you read about the 100d overheating? I've searched but been unable to find this issue on the web.

[spaceman_spiff]

I use second hand 550D and 600D cameras, the 600D is modded and is a great DSO camera - it's low noise, reasonably light (compared to my old Nikon) and cheap. I rarely use the flip screen since when I'm focusing The 550D has no flip screen but I use its 60fps movie crop mode for planetary. Good times!

[Alien 13]

1 minute ago, Jokehoba said:

So I guess each camera model differs in how effective using the built-in screen is for focusing. My bad experience was my first serious attempt at M31. I thought the focus was great - from the LCD, even at x10 - but all the stars turned out to be little doughnuts! That was 3 hours wasted but a lesson learned, and I've not used the camera LCD for focusing since.

The live view may be different on various models but the camera settings play a part too. I always focus the the dimmest star on the screen its then an on/off action, to complement this I adjust ISO so it is only just visible.

Alan

[StargeezerTim]

4 minutes ago, Jokehoba said:

So I guess each camera model differs in how effective using the built-in screen is for focusing. My bad experience was my first serious attempt at M31. I thought the focus was great - from the LCD, even at x10 - but all the stars turned out to be little doughnuts! That was 3 hours wasted but a lesson learned, and I've not used the camera LCD for focusing since.

I dont like focusing without my trusty Bhatinov mask, though that works better with scopes than lenses.

[Jokehoba]

2 minutes ago, StargeezerTim said:

I dont like focusing without my trusty Bhatinov mask, though that works better with scopes than lenses.

I used to use a (homemade) Bhatinov mask but found it difficult to judge when it was precisely lined up. It seemed to bounce around with the turbulent atmosphere. Perhaps my build quality wasn't up to scratch! 

We all have our preferred methods and it doesn't really matter which we choose as long as we are happy with the results. 

[Adam J]

On 04/09/2016 at 18:26, StargeezerTim said:

Where did you read about the 100d overheating? I've searched but been unable to find this issue on the web.

Gary Honis did a test on the 100D it is on his web page. 

http://dslrmodifications.com/SL1Review/SL1Review.html

Noise after 2-hours of exposures was so bad due to temperature increase he returned the camera. 

Look at the results for the 600D and you will see why I recommended it. 

""

Summary:

Based on my review and testing of the SL1 (100D) camera and earlier Canon camera models, these are my observations most applicable for astro imaging:

What I liked:

• Small size and weight of the SL1 camera body

What I didn't like:

• High temperature increase over two hours of continuous exposures.
• High standard deviation value of luminosity of final dark frame after two hours of continuous exposures.
• Lack of an articulating (swivel) display screen.
• Different size battery than used by other recent APS-C models.

Because the SL1 camera had a higher level of dark frame noise than recent APS-C Canon models when taking continuous exposures, I decided to return my SL1 kit to Canon. The advantage of having a smaller and lighter camera comes with the disadvantage of increased temperature and dark frame noise for long exposure deep sky imaging. I did not do my usual long exposure sensitivity tests, because I returned my SL1.

""