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Hardware and software advice needed for upgrading to guided imaging

ianpwilliams

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Thalestris24

Thalestris24

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That makes sense. A lot of websites call the Synguider (which I did consider at one point) an autoguider, so I guess it's easy to mix up the terminology.

Well it's still an autoguider - it's just a standalone one! I guess it has PHD-type software built in plus it's own screen.

Louise

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Thalestris24

Thalestris24

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I meant the GPCam, seems he has the same one as us

Oh I'm sure the GPCam mono is ok. It's essentially the same as the qhy5l-ii mono - but cheaper! The latest dev release of PHD2 now supports it :). I believe you have to download and install drivers from the Altair Astro web site before you try connecting it. Like the qhy, I expect you have to use it in 8 bit mode in order to also use the ST4 port, should you wish to.

Louise

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ianpwilliams

ianpwilliams

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Great, let me know how it goes!

Out of interest, is there anything I need to consider when putting it all together? My plan is to connect the guide camera to the guide scope (hopefully straightforward), then attach the guide scope to the telescope hopefully reasonably in line with the scope and finderscope (not sure how I attach it though), then give a bit of slack to the ST4 and USB cables and then tape the cables to the telescope with gaffer tape. Does that all sound ok?

Also at some point I'll need to start thinking about what new steps I need to take during setup, as I have a step-by-step which I use which I would like to update. My method to begin with will be to have the guide cam connected to both the laptop and mount, meaning that I will use the SynScan for 1-star alignment, GOTO, and tracking, and then PHD2 software on the laptop for guiding. So that being the case, will it be a case of doing everything I normally would do (polar alignment, 1-star alignment, GOTO my target, forcussing with Bhatinov mask etc), basically going up to the point where I would start to image, and then at that point I would wake my laptop from sleep mode, get PHD2 running, focus on a star in PHD2 using the focusser on my guide scope, then ensuring it was guiding properly for a bit (how long?), and then starting to image? Is it going to be that straightforward, or are there other vital steps that I would need to take?

I did briefly read through that SGL sticky thread about guided imaging so I'll give that a proper read when I have time (there'll be lots of indoor testing I suspect), but I could still do with knowing what extra steps I need to take in order to get started with a proper guided imaging session.

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Thalestris24

Thalestris24

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Hi

Sorry, not done anything with the gpcam yet - it's still in the box!

Normally a small guide scope has a dovetail fitting and  just goes in place of the finder. Don't forget you have to run the PHD2 calibration before you can guide. Before that, it's a good idea to create a dark library in PHD2. I make x10 darks in the range of 1s - 10s (that's 10 at each time point. You only need to create the library once then select 'use dark library'.  Also, I find it useful to align the guider with the scope so that the guider scope / camera sees what the scope sees. Best done during the day on a distant object.

Do read through the PHD2 user guide and/or watch the video!

Louise

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ianpwilliams

ianpwilliams

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If I replace the finder with the guider then how will I do star alignment? If I was using ASCOM and controlling the camera via the laptop then I could align using that view. But because I'll only be using PHD2, I don't see how I would be able to see a view for star aligning.

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ianpwilliams

ianpwilliams

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I'm starting to wonder if I might be better off buying the laptop to mount cable and going down the ASCOM route. Then I could use the laptop for that Circ program for GOTO instead of SynScan, PHD2 for guiding, and BackyardEOS for camera control, which would then allow star alignment as I would be able to see the camera's view on the laptop screen. Otherwise it sounds like star alignment will be tough to do.

As for drift alignment I thought you had to be able to see the horizon in order to do that, and I can't do that where I am. But then I've read a few things where people have talked about PEC and other fine tuning such as drift alignment, who have then gone onto say that they don't bother with it, they just polar align and then let the guiding take care of the rest.

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D4N

D4N

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You want to be able to see the celestial equator (0° Dec) to the South and reasonably low to either the East or West to drift align. The celestial equator is generally pretty high in the South.

Your star align you can do with your imaging camera, just slew to something bright near your target and sync to it then slew to target. If your goto isn't accurate enough for this then you will either need to plate solve or use a finder of some sort. However if your zero point was right and you drift align the goto should be fairly accurate anyway.

/Dan

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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Starfisher

Starfisher

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i have the  ASI120MC on a 9x50guider/finderscope and using it with phd2 and i did something wrong so i'm gonna re-install phd2. in the hope it will start guiding decently but im waiting first now for my 130PDS to arrive.

it is a nice cam because of the dual use for sure. but if phd2 is not gonna work out after reintstall , calibration,... . i go the stand-alone path and saving up for the lacerta MGENII wich is really good if i may believe from other AP's where i have spoken with.

the choice with what you want is yours.

you have to question yourself some things like : 

how many budget you will spend on it / having for it.

what will be your purpose ?

if it is only some pretty pictures of famous deep-sky objects without mosaics  : stay as less cable-less as possible and use a stand-alone guider , plus a remote shutter on your dslr or if you have the snap port on your mount (i have one on the az-eq6-gt ) u can use that to set the timings,... of your exposures by using the cable the delivered with it. and your synscan handpad.

  i have both options but the less cables the more fun. 

unless you wanna go for more scientific work ofcourse ( like dipping your toe into the photometry of variable stars for example) than you have more value of using cdc with an eqdir-cable to steer your mount. and once you start cabling you can use a pc-controlled guidecam,.... .

eqmod is btw not so freighting as you may think. the PA-tool is really accurate and you can add other programs to it like a mosaic-planner,...

this is my advice ofcourse. i'm only a starter since april this year but i can give you only the things i have had

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DanL

DanL

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Please someone correct me if I'm mistaken but I don't believe you need to buy that eqdirect cable for mount to pc connection. Your mount should have come with a rj11-rs232/serial cable which you can use to connect from the handset to the pc with a ftdi USB adapter (ftdi version is a bit smarter and you can install drivers to configure Com ports for the adapter).

Just need to connect up and set the handset to PC Direct mode in utilities menu option. Dedicated Eqmod cable is just another option that would bypass the handset and connect directly to the mount I think.

Whichever option you choose, ascom is brilliant imho once you've got it all set up [emoji4]

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ianpwilliams

ianpwilliams

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You want to be able to see the celestial equator (0° Dec) to the South and reasonably low to either the East or West to drift align. The celestial equator is generally pretty high in the South.

Your star align you can do with your imaging camera, just slew to something bright near your target and sync to it then slew to target. If your goto isn't accurate enough for this then you will either need to plate solve or use a finder of some sort. However if your zero point was right and you drift align the goto should be fairly accurate anyway.

/Dan

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

It sounds like South might be alright. East is not an option because the house is in the way, so that leaves West. But again it would depend on what reasonably low is.

And yes I should be able to star align using the camera, especially because I can zoom in on Live View. So maybe that'll be ok.

I'd have to read up on drift alignment though if I was going to try it.

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ianpwilliams

ianpwilliams

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As for the cabling, yes I have seen that it is possible to connect to the mount via the SynScan handset, although it does seem to be a bit of an unnecessary addition to the setup. I'd be quite keen on eliminating the handset altogether really, which would mean getting that cable. But to begin with I'll be using the handset anyway as I'll be doing everything (except guiding) using the mount. So hopefully it'll be a gradual transition over to not using the SynScan at all.

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MarsG76

MarsG76

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I use APT and love it.. does everything thats needed for a night of imaging... one thing I would strongly recommend is once you start autoguiding to guide on the same focal length that you're imaging at and pick a guide star as close to the object being imaged as possible... preferably where ever you can, a OAG. An OAG will guide out any faults at the same level that you're imaging at, including mirror or focusser shifts, andan OAG also takes care of a guide star as close to the object imaged also. If you use a guide scope and your guide star is too far off the target, unless your PA is spot on, the further the guide star is the more radial shift will be amplified.

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ianpwilliams

ianpwilliams

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In this thread here:

http://stargazerslounge.com/topic/188777-phd-guiding-basic-use-and-troubleshooting/

They seem to think that drift aligning might not be necessary for a short focal length scope, which I believe the 130PDS is. Although if I am going to do it then I'm considering buying the cable to allow ASCOM, which I'm considering doing anyway, because I think it's going to be right pain drift aligning but having to use the SynScan, and it would be nice to not have to use the remote timer with my camera and use the laptop instead. Although I guess I should be able to control the camera without ASCOM if I used my camera's USB cable and possibly BackyardEOS or something?

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ianpwilliams

ianpwilliams

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Ok I've decided to go ahead and buy the EQDIR adaptor cable for HEQ5:

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/astronomy-cables-leads-accessories/hitecastro-eqdir-adapter.html

This whole guiding thing is clearly going to drive me mad anyway, so I might as well dive in and try to do everything with the laptop, and throw the damn SynScan and camera remote out the window. I'll just have to hope that the laptop battery can hold out for a full session.

The next step is reading through the above guide and trying to not be too daunted by it all...

Incidentally I just tried replacing the alt bolts in my HEQ5 with replacement ones but it looks like there was no point in buying them. The bolt with the angled handle (which is supposed to go in the south side of the mount) doesn't work because the handle is too long - I'm at 55.94 which means the mount has to lean right back, so it's just not an option. And if I swap them around and try to use the bolt with the round handle at the south side, that bolt is too short to go in as far as it needs to go. So I've gone back to the original bolts, which is a shame.

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