TS Optics / GSO 2" diagonal thumbscrew disaster

[badhex]

Hello all, 

Unfortunately my new TS Optics / GSO 2" diagonal has developed a bit of a showstopping issue. 

Last night whilst observing, directly after locating my first target with a 2" 40mm EP the thumbscrew in the diagonal completely seized out of the blue, preventing me from removing the EP. I tried with fingers and even a bit of rubber sheet (removable rubber grip from my torch) to gain some traction but eventually and reluctantly had to resort to gripping the screw with pliers (plus a paper towel to try and prevent damage). I've thankfully managed to unscrew it enough to remove the EP which was my main concern, and I don't have another diagonal with me but I can still at least use it with the EP just snugly dropped into the barrel (carefully and not at zenith) for the next few days until I get home. 

Frustratingly, the pliers have caused a small amount of damage to the screw head. 

I have only had this diagonal a few weeks, always thumb-tightened the thumbscrews (clue's in the name) and the screw has never been loosened enough to come out of the body so crossthreading is not the culprit. I really take a lot of care with my astronomy gear as do we all, so it has to be either a shonky screw or an issue with the tapping in the hole.

Anyway, I'm going to contact TS but I'm a bit worried in case they point to the damage on the screw head and won't replace it, even though the damage happened as a result of removing the EP which was obviously necessary. 

Not sure if anyone else has any other advice or has encountered something similar? Thoughts and/or words of encouragement welcome! 

 

 

Edited June 15, 2022 by badhex

[wookie1965]

Can you send me measurements I have quite a few thumb screws I may have one to fit you can have free. 

[Carbon Brush]

Just wondering about the condition of the screw thread in the diagonal.

As it is nearly new and in warranty, maybe TS ought to replace the diagonal?

HTH, David.

[badhex]

Thanks both - actually I realise I wasn't very clear, but the screw is very much still stuck in the diagonal! I only managed to unscrew it just enough to be able to remove the EP. I suspect that the screw and or diagonal screw thread are somehow damaged, but it worked fine up until this point and then just seized completely out of the blue. 

TS should in my opinion be replacing either the whole diagonal or at least the EP barrel (which unscrews and could be replaced), its just a bit worrying that the thumbscrew is visibly damaged due to me using pliers to get the EP out. 

Edited June 15, 2022 by badhex

[Laurieast]

Can you photo the view of the screw inside the barrel, or any part of the threads?

Edited June 15, 2022 by Laurieast

[wookie1965]

Use a bit of candle wax then heat it up until it melts that will flow around the thread then try unscrew it again. Obviously make sure none gets on the mirror. 

[badhex]

8 minutes ago, wookie1965 said:

Use a bit of candle wax then heat it up until it melts that will flow around the thread then try unscrew it again. Obviously make sure none gets on the mirror. 

Unfortunately I'm literally in a cabin in the woods, in the middle of nowhere! So I don't have much stuff like candles etc. I did think about a dab of cooking oil, but once I get home I can get something like contact cleaner or wd40 on there if needed I reckon.

[Laurieast]

2 minutes ago, badhex said:

wd40 on there if needed I reckon

Take the barrel off first 

[badhex]

36 minutes ago, Laurieast said:

Take the barrel off first 

Haha yeah, I've removed the barrel before doing anything. 

TBH I'm reticent to do much more as I think this is surely a warranty job. Quite annoying as I don't have any tother diagonals with me! 

3 hours ago, Laurieast said:

Can you photo the view of the screw inside the barrel, or any part of the threads?

Thought I'd just posted this but seems like it didn't. 

I did manage with some effort to screw it in further, in case that loosened the whole thing up but as soon as you unscrew it, it tightens up again. Clearly something wrong with this end of the screw - looks rather dishevelled.

 

[badhex]

Have emailed TS to see what they say. Also tried calling but they seem to be very busy. Hopefully, they can just send me a new EP barrel/thumbscrew part rather than having to return the whole thing. 

In the meantime, I have at least been able to use it if careful, as it's quite a snug fit with both the 1.25" adapter and the 2" EP I have with me. Would have been pretty annoying otherwise given that we specifically came to the middle of nowhere for dark skies! 

[badhex]

20 hours ago, wookie1965 said:

Can you send me measurements I have quite a few thumb screws I may have one to fit you can have free. 

Paul, sorry I meant to reply to this to say thanks for the offer - very kind of you! Hopefully TS will sort it out but thanks anyway 🙂

[Louis D]

Be glad it didn't shear off completely in the threaded hole.  That is what happened to me with one of the two thumbscrews in my GSO CC.  Apparently, they use pot metal instead of tool or stanless steel for their screws.  I swapped out the remaining good screw for a cap head screw made from tool steel.  I have yet to extricate the stuck bit of screw from the other hole.  I recommend swapping out all GSO supplied thumb screws immediately upon purchase for high quality tool or stainless steel cap head screws.

[johninderby]

Stainless steel thumbscrews in the right size are readily available from Amazon or eBay.

Edited June 17, 2022 by johninderby

[badhex]

12 hours ago, Louis D said:

Be glad it didn't shear off completely in the threaded hole.  That is what happened to me with one of the two thumbscrews in my GSO CC.  Apparently, they use pot metal instead of tool or stanless steel for their screws.  I swapped out the remaining good screw for a cap head screw made from tool steel.  I have yet to extricate the stuck bit of screw from the other hole.  I recommend swapping out all GSO supplied thumb screws immediately upon purchase for high quality tool or stainless steel cap head screws.

Ouch. That was actually my fear, and why I was reluctant to use tools. My assumption was that the either the threads of the screw, or a poorly tapped hole in the barrel were to blame - according to the state of the screw tip it would seem to be the former which supports your point about poor quality screws being used, so I'm glad it's a least still in one piece. I can only hope that either the thread of the main barrel are still okay, or that they replace the damaged parts completely. 

 

Edited June 17, 2022 by badhex

[badhex]

12 hours ago, johninderby said:

Stainless steel thumbscrews in the right size are readily available from Amazon or eBay.

Thanks John, definitely worth investing in a few replacements/spares! 

[badhex]

Quick update from TS, they have asked me to send the whole unit back for repair or replacement, so fingers crossed it all gets resolved soon.

[Carbon Brush]

Please let us know how the replacement works out.
Maybe post something in the supplier review section?

Any supplier can have things go wrong.
It is how they put things right that separates the good, indifferent and awful suppliers.

David.

[badhex]

1 hour ago, Carbon Brush said:

Please let us know how the replacement works out.
Maybe post something in the supplier review section?

Any supplier can have things go wrong.
It is how they put things right that separates the good, indifferent and awful suppliers.

David.

Thanks David, I will do. I have dealt with the TS a lot as I'm in Germany so I have fewer supplier options available to me than the UK. I've also had (I think) two occasions where things were not right for one reason or another and both have been corrected satisfactorily. On one of those times I actually had my rather expensive purchase damaged slightly (only a bent thumbscrew) in transit, which was immediately replaced, and then received the original one back by accident with some internal correspondence attached which was... interesting. However, the issue was fully resolved, and I received a small gift voucher for the trouble, so I have no complaints. Hopefully this will also be resolved quickly and satisfactorily as well as with other times. 

[badhex]

Just coming back to this, in the end TS replaced the whole diagonal. I sent it last Thursday, and after a few email back and forth I received the replacement today. Fingers crossed this one doesn't have the same issues, although I will definitely try to pick up new steel thumbscrews just in case!

[DaveL59]

On most of my gear I've replaced the steel/metal thumbscrews with nylon ones, that way no risk of stripping the threads on the major components and no marking the barrels being locked down. Sure you'd wear them out faster but they're cheap and easy to replace esp when compared to needing to dismantle and re-tap components on the scope/focuser etc.

Partly why I went this route was on my TAL100RS the tapped hole for the thumbscrew to lock the finder into its shoe was largely stripped so it couldn't be relied on to hold the finder in place properly. I ended up drilling that out and tapping it to a larger thread but didn't want to have to be doing that again, not enough space/metal to work with.

Edited July 1, 2022 by DaveL59

[badhex]

So. As above, I got the replacement on the 1st, and it's had just a handful of outings since then. Like an idiot, I have not quite got round to replacing the thumbscrews yet... you can guess what comes next.

Last night when I was out, towards the end of the session I started to feel the screw getting tight, so I stuck with 1.25" EPs and left the adaptor in for the rest of the session. Looking at it today, the end of the screw was not in a bad condition like the last. I could feel that it was tight on the last few unscrews, but at least I got it undone using only hand force. I cleaned up the screw of any detritus, popped a tiny blob of grease on it and ran it back and forth a few turns. it now moves smoothly, but I'm getting some replacement thumbscrews ASAP. 

Given that they told me like this was a complete replacement (and it looked brand new) it does not bode well for the sending it back for another, and TBH I'm pretty tired of this nonsense so I'm giving up. I'll replace the screws and use it as a backup.

I am going to do what I probably should have done in the first place and get the Baader BBHS clicklock!

Edited July 28, 2022 by badhex

[Louis D]

I hate to tell you I told you so, but...

On 16/06/2022 at 20:01, Louis D said:

I recommend swapping out all GSO supplied thumb screws immediately upon purchase for high quality tool or stainless steel cap head screws.

[badhex]

10 minutes ago, Louis D said:

I hate to tell you I told you so, but...

Indeed, I can't argue with that! I kept saying to myself "must buy thumbscrews", and then when it started to seize I immediately thought of your post.

[Zeta Reticulan]

I always liked the bigger GSO thumbscrews. They were smaller at one time. I never knew they could have problems. Now I'm a tad concerned. 

[badhex]

Whatever they are made of now is a very lightweight, silver-white non-magnetic metal, possibly aluminium.