Some nights it just doesn't pay to go outside...

[frugal]

After being miserable all day, my wife comes home from book club at about 11:30 and says: "I'm surprised you aren't with all those stars out". Every time I had checked, it was either raining or cloudy.

Right the forecast says I am not going to get another clear spell for at least a week, so I put on my thermals, and take the camera and laptop outside. I get it all set up and then realise that where I have set it up on the east side of the house, Andromeda has just dipped below the roof line (poor planning on my part). I figure I am not going to have much time before it clouds over, so I pick a new target: Pleiades.

I point the camera in roughly the right direction. I reckon I have about an hour before it goes below the treeline. I spend a good 30 minutes with BYE trying to get a star in focus. There is no rhyme or reason to the FWHM values I am getting. I get a bad value, go forward one tick on the focus adjuster, get a slightly worse value, go back a tick, get an even worse value. I tried to take longer shots at lower ISOs to reduce the noise, everything I could think of. It took my 30 minutes of trying before I realised that with this lens I need to set the focus to Auto Focus on the lens before adjusting it from the laptop works... So I spent the past 30 minutes taking shots over and over again at exactly the same focus point... I love BYE, but sometimes it's lack of feedback is frustrating.

I finally started to get things in focus when I realised that I had not aligned the AstroTrac on Polaris. I had aligned it very carefully to the wrong star. Ho Hum. PIck the correct star and try again.

Nope despite my best efforts I just can not get it into focus. When it looks like it is in focus in Frame and Focus, they shots still come out poor on the image capture. In the end I assumed that it was a combination of poor seeing (only stars about 15 degrees above the horizon were even visible), and my poor focusing abilities. It did not help that the Y-masks I made up to try and improve focusing were all made for the other lens, and were too small to use on this lens. 

I guess a lot of tonight was my lack of preparation and planning and making a bunch of silly mistakes in my rush to get something. In the end I came away with nothing but the knowledge of what I did wrong.

[baggywrinkle]

Yes you get nights like that...but did you come away with having learnt something? If you did then all is not lost...

[nytecam]

Can I suggest, if you need to observe from various parts of you garden due to obstructions, marking the ground precisely wh:ere the tripod was successful setup. Then you can repeat a quicker setup :-)

[frugal]

Well, what I learned was that I need to prepare properly and not just run out and hope

As we have had so few good nights recently I want to get out and image as much as possible, however what I need to do is spend these nights preparing and experimenting with how to use what I have. Not go out expecting to take good ages, but rather go out with half a dozen different masks made up and experiment with which one works best. Spend and evening practicing the best way to frame shots. Maybe even find out how to put my own landscape into Stellarium so that I can take into account the houses and trees before I go outside.

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk

[Tinker1947]

Build some sort of Obby, so its all set-up this lessens the time to first light on any day, i used to look out and see some stars carry the mount out, the attach the scope, plug ever thing in, align it all and then the clouds come over, this happened 3 nights in a row on one occasion, now if its clear. remove the roof, turn on the power, i'm ready to go....you could always make it look like a doll's house for your daughter..

[Bubbles82]

Being prepared is a must but sometimes it still doesn't come together. I have learnt that it's these bad nights that make the good ones seem that much better:)

[all-on-black]

I had a similar experience last night. Due to the weather all day being absolutely awful I never expected a clear when I went into the kitchen to get a drink and saw Jupiter shining away.

I ran upstairs and got everything (3 trips up 2 flights of stairs!) and got everything outside, set up, went to polar align and found it to be overcast, and then raining! So, back inside frustrated, as I grabbed the last little box of bits, it was a clear sky again! Many naughty words were said!

So, I thought screw it, I'll grab my camera and shove it on a tripod and get some shots of Plaiedes.

It actually went ok, though my focus was way out as my lap top hasn't arrived so it was a bit of a guess, I did learn quite a bit in my processing and camera settings.

Here was my result..

Well done for getting out and trying Frugal, learning doesn't always involve getting images as you've just found out!

[frugal]

Build some sort of Obby, so its all set-up this lessens the time to first light on any day, i used to look out and see some stars carry the mount out, the attach the scope, plug ever thing in, align it all and then the clouds come over, this happened 3 nights in a row on one occasion, now if its clear. remove the roof, turn on the power, i'm ready to go....you could always make it look like a doll's house for your daughter..

Unfortunately depending on which bit of sky I want to look at, I need to set up in 3 different positions about the garden. Our house is a bit weird in that we do not have a front garden and a back garden, we have two side gardens, one of which has a 40' Eucalyptus tree in the middle of it

[Tinker1947]

Unfortunately depending on which bit of sky I want to look at, I need to set up in 3 different positions about the garden. Our house is a bit weird in that we do not have a front garden and a back garden, we have two side gardens, one of which has a 40' Eucalyptus tree in the middle of it

Go for southern views if you can what ever is in the N,E or W will past through the South.......

[cfpendock]

This is one of the most frustrating aspects of this game.  I have no possibility of any kind of permanent set-up, which means I have to set up from scratch every time.  But I am getting better.  The other night I:

Moved the mount outside

Attached weights

Attached scope, guide scope, cameras, focuser, dew heaters, cables

Balanced scope

Polar aligned

Started and connected software (Cartes du ciel, Astrotortilla, Maxim, Focusmax, Maxpilote, PHD, (having had to establish which com ports actually work)

Aligned scope roughly at target

Re-balanced 

Focused

Aligned scope precisely to target using Astrotortilla

Checked one 30 second binned shot to make sure everything correct, including taking scope tube caps off

Got PHD calibrated and guiding

Set pre-arranged sequence going using Maxpilote

All in 24 minutes.  

Got the first 5 minute exposure and noticed guiding not working.  Looked at the sky(!) and saw a big bank of cloud (not forecast).

The same four letter word several times, and put everything away just in time before a  rain shower arrived.

It's good to have a challenge....

Chris

[Tinker1947]

This is one of the most frustrating aspects of this game.  I have no possibility of any kind of permanent set-up, which means I have to set up from scratch every time.  But I am getting better.  The other night I:

Moved the mount outside

Attached weights

Attached scope, guide scope, cameras, focuser, dew heaters, cables

Balanced scope

Polar aligned

Started and connected software (Cartes du ciel, Astrotortilla, Maxim, Focusmax, Maxpilote, PHD, (having had to establish which com ports actually work)

Aligned scope roughly at target

Re-balanced 

Focused

Aligned scope precisely to target using Astrotortilla

Checked one 30 second binned shot to make sure everything correct, including taking scope tube caps off

Got PHD calibrated and guiding

Set pre-arranged sequence going using Maxpilote

All in 24 minutes.  

Got the first 5 minute exposure and noticed guiding not working.  Looked at the sky(!) and saw a big bank of cloud (not forecast).

The same four letter word several times, and put everything away just in time before a  rain shower arrived.

It's good to have a challenge....

Chris

Does start to wear then after a couple of years...

[PhotoGav]

Aaargh, I feel your pain! We all have those "oh my word, stars... I must get set up and take the perfect picture right now... Oh, it's cloudy / that bit of kit isn't working / why did I do it in a hurry and set up just slightly wrong and get these strange results / etc etc" kind of evenings.

The key is to learn from our mistakes and to persevere.

We will all achieve 'the perfect image' many times along the way - though our perception of 'perfect' is constantly being revised as we improve...!

There is a great deal to be said for a zen like mastery of not rushing out as soon as you see stars though... I'm trying to go by weather forecasts and plan my sessions. However, the unexpected clear sky last night did test my resolve as we had friends over for supper and etiquette suggests that one shouldn't jump up from the dinner table and start AP!!!

Clear skies to you all!

P.S. @Chris - 24 minutes set-up... Well impressed!

[cfpendock]

Thanks Gav - 24 minuts was exceptional - sometimes everything just works - often it can be considerably more than an hour, especially if I want to do a quick drift align for a target near the equator.

But I was well pleased with the other night because everything worked first time which is unusual.  i should have been suspicious!  Hence I was particularly annoyed that the weather didn't play ball.

And by the way, on closer inspection, the one sub I did get just happened to coincide with a satellite......

Chris

[Scott]

I'm thinking of something like this as a sort of lift on/ lift off obs until I get around to building one

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-5x2-5m-Green-Pop-Up-Gazebo-Waterproof-Canopy-Awning-Folding-Marquee-Party-Tent-/380629130724?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item589f439de4

[cfpendock]

I was thinking of one of these too.  They are quite big - my neighbour had one and it was completely waterproof.  Until it blew away.  I think that where I live even if I could put up a shed, it would have to be securely anchored - there are some posts on this forum where members have had disasters with high winds.  

Some ingenuity is needed, but I haven't come up with a solution yet.  So I will continue as for now, and I am sure that Frugal above will soon learn to perfect setting up  - certainly the disappointments so far will not have been wasted in terms of learning.  It's what this hobby is all about!

And good though they are, I never trust a weather forecast....

Chris

[PhotoGav]

I'm thinking of something like this as a sort of lift on/ lift off obs until I get around to building one

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-5x2-5m-Green-Pop-Up-Gazebo-Waterproof-Canopy-Awning-Folding-Marquee-Party-Tent-/380629130724?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item589f439de4

We borrowed one of these from a friend for a garden party a couple of summers ago. We had it for one day and one night. It rained over night and the weight of water caught in the roof made it all collapse... Doh! Certainly wouldn't recommend putting expensive kit under it in winter.

And by the way, on closer inspection, the one sub I did get just happened to coincide with a satellite......

Mr Murphy please exit the building..!

[Tinker1947]

There are plastic sheds with roll off roofs one of the threads on here mentioned them......

[Scott]

We borrowed one of these from a friend for a garden party a couple of summers ago. We had it for one day and one night. It rained over night and the weight of water caught in the roof made it all collapse... Doh! Certainly wouldn't recommend putting expensive kit under it in winter.

Mr Murphy please exit the building..!

I certainly wouldn't recommend leaving one out in torrential rain or violent winds but I have used similar ones for day time set-up to keep light rain or dew/mist off until ready for use. There is also varying degrees of quality....but your point is certainly valid

[Dave_D]

Well, what I learned was that I need to prepare properly and not just run out and hope

Yeah... like setting up on a nice clear night and then realising you forgot to charge the camera battery... like i just did lol

[frugal]

Go for southern views if you can what ever is in the N,E or W will past through the South.......

Ah, yes, to the South... that would be top half of the wooded hill we live on I can see about 45 degrees from the top of the treeline to the Zenith.

[nytecam]

This is one of the most frustrating aspects of this game.  I have no possibility of any kind of permanent set-up, which means I have to set up from scratch every time.  But I am getting better.  The other night I:

Moved the mount outside

Attached weights

Attached scope, guide scope, cameras, focuser, dew heaters, cables

Balanced scope

Polar aligned

Started and connected software (Cartes du ciel, Astrotortilla, Maxim, Focusmax, Maxpilote, PHD, (having had to establish which com ports actually work)

Aligned scope roughly at target

Re-balanced 

Focused

Aligned scope precisely to target using Astrotortilla

Checked one 30 second binned shot to make sure everything correct, including taking scope tube caps off

Got PHD calibrated and guiding

Set pre-arranged sequence going using Maxpilote

All in 24 minutes.  

Got the first 5 minute exposure and noticed guiding not working.  Looked at the sky(!) and saw a big bank of cloud (not forecast).

The same four letter word several times, and put everything away just in time before a  rain shower arrived.

It's good to have a challenge....

Chris

Think you "set-up each time" guys need a medal for persistance but we all have cloud arrive unexpectedly and whilst you can get by visually from darting to cloudgaps it doesn't work with AP as the target area never clears until you point the scope somewhere else !!!  Don't use the forecasts - just check skies and downwind too where its coming from.  Euro IR weathersat run over 24hrs repeatedly gives clues for cloud clearance in your area

[lensman57]

Yeah... like setting up on a nice clear night and then realising you forgot to charge the camera battery... like i just did lol

I just dumped nearly 2 hours of data from last night, 300s subs of IC434 taken through an Apo @ F4.8 and a modded 1100d @ iso 400, due to horrible noise. This was a test for the modded camera btw. Last week I had the same problem with an Atik CCD. Has somebody deliberately introduced noise into the sky at the moment?

Regards,

A.G

[cfpendock]

Got another good set-up last night - around 30 minutes.  And no clouds this time.  Superb.  

Came to switch off and put the kit away at midnight and found I had forgotten to switch on the CCD cooler.... ****!

Chris

[PhotoGav]

More speed, less haste!!!

[mickshere]

I had a similar experience last night. Due to the weather all day being absolutely awful I never expected a clear when I went into the kitchen to get a drink and saw Jupiter shining away.

I ran upstairs and got everything (3 trips up 2 flights of stairs!) and got everything outside, set up, went to polar align and found it to be overcast, and then raining! So, back inside frustrated, as I grabbed the last little box of bits, it was a clear sky again! Many naughty words were said!

So, I thought screw it, I'll grab my camera and shove it on a tripod and get some shots of Plaiedes.

It actually went ok, though my focus was way out as my lap top hasn't arrived so it was a bit of a guess, I did learn quite a bit in my processing and camera settings.

Here was my result..

Well done for getting out and trying Frugal, learning doesn't always involve getting images as you've just found out!

Very nice.      What size lens, apeture and exposure time did you use?  ta