Tiny Clanger

XKCD has wisdom to impart on the topic. The resistor code mnemonic seems particularly appropriate :

I very often look down rather than up: Camels Ordinarily Sit Down Carefully , Perhaps Their Joints Creak. Possibly Early Oiling May Prevent Permanent Rust.

Which for some reason reminds me that I once set a class of 8 year olds the task of writing their own mnemonic for the order of colours of the spectrum . My favourite (it must be a good mnemonic, 'cos I remember it after 30 years ) was : 'Rabbits of yesterday gave back inky vests.' Not sure if that conceals a message about the illuminati though ...

That's a really helpful summary for someone like me, who is thinking about buying a portable mount at some point in the future. Thank you.

Somewhere on another thread I measured the extended 'scopes ground to eyepiece height in answer to a similar beginner/ child 'scope query. I use my heritage 150 on a short sturdy 3 legged table I made using scrap wood and 30cm long tubular metal legs . It saves me hauling my low garden table , which is cast iron and weighs a lot, around my bumpy lawn. When Jupiter and Saturn were low in the sky in the summer, and it was convenient for me as an adult to have the 'scope on a taller platform, I stood the scope on one of those portable workbenches , a cheap copy of a black & decker workmate. I find both solutions are plenty steady enough. The heritage 150 is 750mm focal length , so will give less magnification than a longer focal length 'scope with the same eyepiece, but that's not necessarily a bad thing, as it means your field of view is greater. It is therefore easier to find your targets and keep them in view. I do wonder if the goto facility is all that much of an advantage in engaging children (or adults for that matter) compared with some time spent doing background research on astronomy so when you show your child something, you can explain why the star is that colour, what M31 actually is, what is the difference between stars and planets , why does the Moon (and Venus ) look different shapes, how come the Moon has those craters ...

If the items within are OK, I doubt the damage to the packaging would get you any compensation. If the contents were damaged, I know what I'd do to get redress under UK law if the sender didn't sort it out in a co-operative and timely fashion, but via the US postal service and then on by other carriers to the UAE, sorry, I've no idea. In general though, wherever you live, wherever the item originates, the delivery company is employed by the vendor, so even if the item proves to be fine, I'd have a conversation with the vendor, mentioning that whilst their careful packaging protected the item, their chosen delivery company did that damage somewhere along the line. I've asked companies before I place my order with them if they intend to use a delivery co. I found to be spectacularly lackadaisical* in my area, and said if they do, I'll order elsewhere. Feedback to the vendor is the way to get better deliveries. Heather * That company was Yodel.

ERB's Mars books were my first encounter with sci fi, I still have my tattered paperback copy of 'Princess of Mars' (price : 2'6 ) The film made Deja Thoris a rather more modern princess than the book did, it was written in 1912, so no surprise really . I watched the film with trepidation, thinking the update might trample on my childhood joy for the book (which I dare not re read as an adult, some things are best left as happy, innocent memories ...) but it was good fun. I was impressed with the special effects which did a great job on the more alien looking Barsoomian inhabitants and creatures .

I confess to being tempted , atho' I'd prefer just an astronaut or two without all the rest, I already have more than enough baubles for a ceiling scraping tree !

Google jitsu got me this https://www.amazon.co.uk/Valery-Madelyn-Christmas-Shatterproof-Decoration/dp/B086X3XYFC/ref=sr_1_195?dchild=1&keywords=Valery+Madelyn&qid=1605459992&sr=8-195 but I bet various garden centres with seasonal displays of festive shiny stuff will stock them too

Welcome , from a fellow lontime Nikon photographer : I still have a battered F photomic hibernating in the cupboard and only just let go my darlroom kit . I am, however , restraining myself from even thinking about astro photography kit, I'm a simple observer. I have noted though that Canon cameras are the general favourites for astro DSLRs , so be prepared to go to the dark side 😀 Heather

Skippyinspace , I think your post should be used a cautionary tale for beginners who hope that spending loads of cash will automatically make astronomy easy ... Hope the 'read the flippin' manual' moment pays off , and your setup works with no glitches from now on . Heather Edited to add: I should say I'm a beginner myself, but of the low price/ low tech /much study variety

True, but the problem is not what people do with their own property, but how what they do spills onto neighbouring properties, and affects their owner's ability to do what they like with their own space. In that respect , careless light pollution is exactly like thoughtless noise pollution. I could easily listen to loud music outdoors by cranking up my hi fi output to the speakers and throwing the doors and windows open , but as a good neighbour, I use headphones. To do otherwise would be either the result of lack of awareness, disregard of other people's rights, or simple bloody mindedness. We need education ,prompting increased awareness of light pollution and itsnegative effects (not just on a minority hobby, but on wildlife too) in the general population . Anyone got David Attenborough's 'phone number ? Meanwhile, I just started reading 'The End of Night' by Paul Bogard, which is an interesting book on just this subject. I don't recall where I saw it recommended , it may even have been a thread on here, in which case, thanks whoever suggested it. Heather

Postie (in shorts despite the chilly rain) just handed me this little package Thanks KP82 😀

Welcome Katie, Well done for having by passed all the angst of deciding which 'scope to buy by getting one as a gift ! 😀 Is the tree an evergreen ? If not as the leaves fall, your view might get a tiny bit better ... Heather

Yes, it's just despicable speciesism, six eyed sand spiders* are forced to buy two sets of 3 of these marvellous bargains to be fully equipped, , or a 4 and a 2, which means they will be unfairly financially disadvantaged compared with bees (5 eyes) . * Six eyed sand spiders afflicted with lisps are the world's most disadvantaged creatures .

Not something I've thought about for my kit, but if I did as well as photography kit ( expensive) and toolboxes (less so) I might investigate fishing equipment, anglers seem to cart loads of stuff around.

I reckon the clip locks and the handle on the pan tilt ( you turn the end of it to unlock and lock the movement of the p/t head) should be workable while wearing gloves (but probably not mittens !) , and once you have the binoculars set for infinity there won't be a reason to take your gloves off . To avoid tripping on that rough scrubland when there's no moonlight to watch your footing by, you might want to use a red light torch , red light will not wreck your eye's adaptation to low light as a white light torch would. No need to buy a special expensive torch for nights when there's no moonlight to watch your footing, any one you already have can be adapted with sticky tape and judicious use of a few layers of red cellophane e.g from a sweet wrapper , great excuse to buy and eat some 'Roses' or similar ... Some headtorches have the choice of red or white beam , which is handy, or should I say, hands free ?

You might find the handle of the pan tilt head on the monopod a bit inconvenient , and sometimes such a head will not allow you to set as steep an upward angle as you'd like for stargazing . I've used my telescope on my hefty pro photo tripod with a pan/tilt head just to see if it was feasible ... it was , but to get a high angle I had to mount the 'scope backwards on the head, i.e. with the horizontal handle not towards me as it usually would be, but pointing away from me. If it turns out the same for you with the binoculars on this monopod, you may be able to unscrew the head , and just mount the bracket straight onto the monopod and rely on tilting the whole thing, or substitute a cheap ball and socket head . The screw that attaches heads to tripods is (usually) standard assuming it is a removable one. A final thought : if you don't need to extend the monopod completely to get your binoculars to eye height, the best section to leave retracted is the lowest, thinnest one, it will be the wobbliest part of the setup. Good luck, hope you get to train your apparatus on clear skies soon ! Heather

Aperture is to do with the lens , either a camera lens or a telescope acting as a camera lens. The control on a camera body to change the aperture of a lens attached to it will not do anything to a telescope. Telescopes do not have the internal mechanics let alone the electrical contacts (which are specific to the camera brand) to link to the camera. Higher ASA = more sensitivity. Might help to watch some photography videos like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8T94sdiNjc&feature=emb_title

Glad my input was less pointless than I thought ! Coming back to your situation refreshed after I've been for a nice long country walk, I'll add a little more to the confusion ... You seem pretty much sold on a goto mount, so maybe solicit opinions of which of the models available below £300 ( a quick look suggests there are 2 skywatcher alt/az which, with tripod will be around £285 ish, there may be others available) would be best for you. I'm sure there will be people on here who have experience of both. Then, once you have made that decision, you can look to see not only what can be bought bundled with the mount as a package by the manufacturer, but also at any OTA (optical tube assemblies) from any manufacturer in the £200 ish range . You will have to take notice of the specified weight limit for the mount you choose, but that might be a good thing , narrowing the choices for you a bit. If a 'scope is available as an OTA only as well as (or instead of) in a package, it suggests to me that serious hobbyists will buy it, which says something about the 'scope. You won't get a single setup which is a perfect tool for observing every type of object whatever you spend, it's always going to be a compromise . I don't think going into a shop would help you to be honest : what would be a great way to help steer you to something you'll enjoy using would be to attend a local astro society observing evening and get to see the things actually in use ... but that's not going to happen soon either .... Heather

My thought (as a relative beginner, and with zero personal experience of any of the 'scopes or mounts you mention) : Only you can be sure that goto is something which will be worth it for you . Clearly within any given budget, a scope and manual mount will be better quality than 'scope plus mount plus goto for the same price. If you choose a better quality 'scope with fewer bundled accessories, don't forget to price up the extras you will need to buy : expect to spend at least £30 to £50 for a finder or eyepiece . My approach has been to choose what I've bought not seeing it as a self contained one-off package, but as components for an evolving tool kit. I suppose it felt a natural way for me because I'm from a photography background. I dabbled a toe in serious telescopes with minimal outlay by getting a purely manual 150mm dob for £200, and using that for 3 months has shown me plenty of interesting things, and confirmed that spending on more kit is worthwhile for me. That probably doesn't help at all does it ! 😟

Ah, several post have appeared whilst I was searching out links and info: sorry to repeat what others already said , and it seems it may be that the 130 is not a jones - bird (or bird-jones, same thing !) 'scope, in which case it may be a bit better than I thought. My choice of 'scopes back in the summer was a heritage 150 by the way, and whilst it is not the ideal tool for looking at planets, the first thing I saw with it on the night I got it, was Saturn, tiny, but like a midget Xmas tree bauble, rings and all, hanging in the dark. It was worth £200 just for that ! Now I'm hooked, and have a 127 maksutov on order to add to the armory.

Welcome , it's lovely to see your daughter's interest in astronomy being encouraged ! The easy answer to your question is ... there is no easy answer. 😟 Believe me, I've done a great deal of research on the cheaper end of the market , and the packaged 'scopes all have compromises in order to achieve a competitive price point. So for instance, for around £200 you can get a very basic, simple dobsonian like the skywatcher 150 Heritage , which has an chunky MDF tabletop base, cheap finder ( replaceable) cheap eyepieces (ditto) a somewhat coarse focus arrangement (which can easily be improved with a bit of plumber's tape) no bells and whistles, but a 150mm (6" diameter) light collecting mirror. It's all about the optics, that's where the money went. Or , same price point, one of the 'scopes you asked about , the starsense 127 , which has a mirror a slightly smaller 127mm across, similarly cheap starter eyepieces and finder ( quite probably identical to the skywatcher ones actually, as both brands are part of a company called Synta ) and somehow also manages to include a full height adjustable metal tripod with accessory tray, Alt-azimuth mount, Barlow lens , 'phone dock and the starsense app. That appears to be a lot for the money, but you can be sure the tripod and head will be less sturdy and smooth working than is ideal, the 2x barlow will be optically poor and the jones-bird configuration is a cheap way to make a 'scope's focal length (and therefore magnification) greater whilst keeping the tube relatively and conveniently short . It involves an extra fixed lens in the focus tube, which is not an ideal arrangement, the extra glass reduces the sharpness of the image you see , and makes colimating ( accurately lining up) the mirrors difficult. I inherited a Celestron 114eq firstscope of this design, and whilst it looks the biz, sat on its lightweight tripod and eq mount it is a disappointing 'scope to use. Apart from the Moon, not much else impresses, and it is just not sharp. If the starsense app is what you feel the most important feature for you , then I'll echo what pixies said : you are limited to the packages celestron provides it with. The jump in price to one of the more traditional go to packages like a https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes/sky-watcher-startravel-102-az-gte.html would be well over your budget. You could always put your money into a more basic 'scope and try this app : https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.lavadip.skeye&hl=en_GB which works slightly differently, but would help you navigate the night sky, is not tied to Celestron and those specific packages. In that case I'd absolutely take the advice of FLO on their page https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes.html which has several choices around your budget. They will no doubt be out of stock at the moment, but FLO will answer your questions about likely delivery dates (or anything else 'scope related for that matter) quickly and as accurately as they can, and you can place an order to reserve what you want . That's what I did, and my new toy should be arriving this week, after a month of suspense ! Good luck with your search and decision Heather PS, before committing to a starsense app 'scope, do check to ensure it is compatible with your 'phone, and maybe your daughter's 'phone too if she has one : you can download it as a basic sky atlas tool before getting the code (with a telescope) to unlock the 'push to' facility ,so can check it out now.

Unfortunately I think the neighbour might notice if I cut her tree down !

I've bought stuff from Bristol Cameras recently, they are fine. Over the summer when 'proper' astronomy shops online had bare stockrooms, some camera shops had some small stuff available, I bought with no issues from Camarthen and Cardiff camera shops and Tring Astro as well . Remember that people on here are enthusiasts, opinions and standards of what is a satisfactory bit of kit will probably not be the same as the view of a child, and similarly the amount of money spent by enthusiasts is far beyond what most people would consider investing in a casual interest , for instance, opinions on eyepieces usually cite ones that cost £50 each as basic.