Jupiter with Io in transit - 2 Oct 2022

[geoflewis]

I had my 2nd session with my new ASI462 camera on the C14 last night. The seeing was better than last week, but still very in/out, with focus changing minute by minute, making it difficult to determine best focus. Io and it's shadow were in transit, so I opted for a series of 2 minute SER videos, which I de-rotated in WinJupos before grading in AS3!, with further derotation and stacking of the TIFFs in WinJupos. Sharpening was done using wavelets in Registax6.

The stacked image had a large blur where Io and it's shadow were in transit, so I pasted them back into the stacked and sharpened image from a single SER that represented the correct timestamp of the de-rotated image. Final colour saturation and levels adjustments were applied in Affinity Photo.

As others have reported, Io itself is somewhat lost due to poor contrast aginst Jupiter's bright cloud surface.

Thanks for looking, comments and feedback welcome.

 

Edited October 3, 2022 by geoflewis

[JeremyS]

Super, Geof 👍🏻

[geoflewis]

3 minutes ago, JeremyS said:

Super, Geof 👍🏻

Thanks Jeremy, much appreciated.

[neil phillips]

Very Nice Geoff. As to your question. It's not over sharpened. Contrasty. With lots of detail

[geoflewis]

1 minute ago, neil phillips said:

Very Nice Geoff. As to your question. It's not over sharpened. Contrasty. With lots of detail

Thanks Neil, I dialled the sharpening back a tad on this version from the one that I shared with you privately. It was a very subtle change, but I though the cloud edges were just a bit too well defined for a gas giant.

[neil phillips]

1 hour ago, geoflewis said:

Thanks Neil, I dialled the sharpening back a tad on this version from the one that I shared with you privately. It was a very subtle change, but I though the cloud edges were just a bit too well defined for a gas giant.

Looks good Geoff i may try two or three captures image de rotation at some point myself. it should help. You certainly nailed the amount of detail 

[geoflewis]

45 minutes ago, neil phillips said:

Looks good Geoff i may try two or three captures image de rotation at some point myself. it should help. You certainly nailed the amount of detail 

Thanks Neil

[Kon]

Nice capture and lot of nice details.

13 hours ago, geoflewis said:

The stacked image had a large blur where Io and it's shadow were in transit, so I pasted them back into the stacked and sharpened image from a single SER that represented the correct timestamp of the de-rotated image. Final colour saturation and levels adjustments were applied in Affinity Photo.

Could you provide a bit more info on the process please? I also have a couple of captures from that night that I would like to see if I can combine. Effectively you are running Winjupos that will introduce the blur. Do you just take a single frame which will be low res and then overlay it/blend it with the winjupos one?

 

[geoflewis]

24 minutes ago, Kon said:

Nice capture and lot of nice details.

Could you provide a bit more info on the process please? I also have a couple of captures from that night that I would like to see if I can combine. Effectively you are running Winjupos that will introduce the blur. Do you just take a single frame which will be low res and then overlay it/blend it with the winjupos one?

 

I knew that the transit would blur, hence I captured a sequence of only 2 min SERs rather than a longer run, to keep that down, but in addition I also captured a 1 min SER for what I knew would be close to the midpoint of the sequence. It was from this lower resolution stack that I cut and paste Io and it's shadow over the blurred part of the more detailed WinJupos stack.

 

[neil phillips]

6 hours ago, geoflewis said:

I knew that the transit would blur, hence I captured a sequence of only 2 min SERs rather than a longer run, to keep that down, but in addition I also captured a 1 min SER for what I knew would be close to the midpoint of the sequence. It was from this lower resolution stack that I cut and paste Io and it's shadow over the blurred part of the more detailed WinJupos stack.

 

Just to join in here for a sec. And a great job on controlling the moon shadow from Geoff. Just wanted to point out perhaps another benefit of video de rotation. I did 6 mins with 77000 frames. And no blur on the shadow. That surprised me as i remembered shadows blur. But thought video de rotation blurred too. It doesn't its fine. Its image de rotation that doesn't correct for it. Wonder how long video de rotation can work. I am going to experiment with 8 and possibly 10 min captures see how they fair ?

[geoflewis]

1 hour ago, neil phillips said:

Just to join in here for a sec. And a great job on controlling the moon shadow from Geoff. Just wanted to point out perhaps another benefit of video de rotation. I did 6 mins with 77000 frames. And no blur on the shadow. That surprised me as i remembered shadows blur. But thought video de rotation blurred too. It doesn't its fine. Its image de rotation that doesn't correct for it. Wonder how long video de rotation can work. I am going to experiment with 8 and possibly 10 min captures see how they fair ?

That is interesting Neil, as I would expect the moon and shadow to blur, as those are transient effects not travelling at the same rate as Jupiter's rotation. I'll be interested to see what you learn from longer video de-rotation attempts when a moon and/or shadow is in transit.

[CraigT82]

I did a video derotation on a 6 minute capture on that night too and the moon itself was streaked just as it would be using the image derotation tool, but the shadow wasn’t yet on the disk so can’t speak for that but I’d imagine it would be streaked too. I thought the same as Geof in that the moons are moving at a different rate to the jupiters rotation. 
 

The data I got was total rubbish and have junked it . Plus side was it was my first use of the new AZ-EQ6 which I bought months ago but not had time to use yet. Had it in AZ mode and it worked like a charm.

Edited October 4, 2022 by CraigT82

[Saganite]

22 hours ago, geoflewis said:

I had my 2nd session with my new ASI462 camera on the C14 last night. The seeing was better than last week, but still very in/out, with focus changing minute by minute, making it difficult to determine best focus. Io and it's shadow were in transit, so I opted for a series of 2 minute SER videos, which I de-rotated in WinJupos before grading in AS3!, with further derotation and stacking of the TIFFs in WinJupos. Sharpening was done using wavelets in Registax6.

The stacked image had a large blur where Io and it's shadow were in transit, so I pasted them back into the stacked and sharpened image from a single SER that represented the correct timestamp of the de-rotated image. Final colour saturation and levels adjustments were applied in Affinity Photo.

As others have reported, Io itself is somewhat lost due to poor contrast aginst Jupiter's bright cloud surface.

Thanks for looking, comments and feedback welcome.

 

That is a fine image Geoff.  I followed the transit throughout but could not pick out the Moon , whereas I have done so on other occasions.

Thanks for posting.

[CraigT82]

22 hours ago, geoflewis said:

I had my 2nd session with my new ASI462 camera on the C14 last night. The seeing was better than last week, but still very in/out, with focus changing minute by minute, making it difficult to determine best focus. Io and it's shadow were in transit, so I opted for a series of 2 minute SER videos, which I de-rotated in WinJupos before grading in AS3!, with further derotation and stacking of the TIFFs in WinJupos. Sharpening was done using wavelets in Registax6.

The stacked image had a large blur where Io and it's shadow were in transit, so I pasted them back into the stacked and sharpened image from a single SER that represented the correct timestamp of the de-rotated image. Final colour saturation and levels adjustments were applied in Affinity Photo.

As others have reported, Io itself is somewhat lost due to poor contrast aginst Jupiter's bright cloud surface.

Thanks for looking, comments and feedback welcome.

 

Really nice image Geof by the way! 

[geoflewis]

16 minutes ago, CraigT82 said:

Really nice image Geof by the way! 

Thanks Craig, pity your seeing didn't improve as mine did.

[CraigT82]

Ah I wouldn’t have know if it did I was only out there for 20 mins, got a bunch of new kit so just wanted to check everything worked ok really, then off to bed. 2 yr old likes to start his days at the crack of dawn!  

[neil phillips]

3 hours ago, CraigT82 said:

I did a video derotation on a 6 minute capture on that night too and the moon itself was streaked just as it would be using the image derotation tool, but the shadow wasn’t yet on the disk so can’t speak for that but I’d imagine it would be streaked too. I thought the same as Geof in that the moons are moving at a different rate to the jupiters rotation. 
 

The data I got was total rubbish and have junked it . Plus side was it was my first use of the new AZ-EQ6 which I bought months ago but not had time to use yet. Had it in AZ mode and it worked like a charm.

Well, I have run 5 separate 6 min captures and not one had any blur whatsoever. I then did image de rotation from three 6 min vid de rotations. And yes, blur occurred but not with the individual 6 min vid de rotations. All i can say is somehow the circles that line up on the moon and shadow on winjupos. Are somehow tracking. I don't know how but they are. 

My jupiter images posted on the 2nd. Are 6 min captures. If winjupos wasn't somehow correcting for it. It clearly would be seen. But the shadow and moon are reasonably tight. 

 

[CraigT82]

It’s interesting I wonder if it’s something to do with the image measurement for the video derotation, do you take your image from the centre of the long video Neil or somewhere else? I tried stacking the central 1000 frames and measuring that to run the video derotation but maybe that’s not the best way. 

[geoflewis]

I didn't know whether to post this as a separate thread, but I decided to process the earlier SERs captured as Io approached and then began it's transit. As it's essentially the same session, I opted to keep it all together. Just 3 images annimated using PIPP.

Just a bit of fun really.

[geoflewis]

3 hours ago, neil phillips said:

Well, I have run 5 separate 6 min captures and not one had any blur whatsoever. I then did image de rotation from three 6 min vid de rotations. And yes, blur occurred but not with the individual 6 min vid de rotations. All i can say is somehow the circles that line up on the moon and shadow on winjupos. Are somehow tracking. I don't know how but they are. 

My jupiter images posted on the 2nd. Are 6 min captures. If winjupos wasn't somehow correcting for it. It clearly would be seen. But the shadow and moon are reasonably tight. 

 

That's both interesting and good to know. I can't fathom how that would work, but who cares so long as it works

[Sunshine]

That’s a big big Jupiter you have there! my Jupiter is tiny, comparing. 
 

Wonderful capture!

[geoflewis]

6 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

That’s a big big Jupiter you have there! my Jupiter is tiny, comparing. 
 

Wonderful capture!

Thanks, I guess the C14 bring's it closer 😀

[neil phillips]

7 hours ago, CraigT82 said:

It’s interesting I wonder if it’s something to do with the image measurement for the video derotation, do you take your image from the centre of the long video Neil or somewhere else? I tried stacking the central 1000 frames and measuring that to run the video derotation but maybe that’s not the best way. 

I usually just stack about 30 to 50 % of the capture file for image measurement. When i put the video capture file into winjupos after running through PIIP all the time stamps auto populate. And it gives you a median reference time. It's that time i put into image measurement. And only one capture out of five was slightly off on the moon and shadow (still didn't blur? ) all the rest were bang on. Wonder if it's an update? I updated recently. will do a short 4 or 5

animation at some point. 

After more thought about this. I am wondering. if certain things i am doing is actually helping Craig. After coming out of winjupos i run it through PIPP again. Doing another quality sort reducing from 70 odd thousand down to 30.000.  I also reorder the frames when doing this. I've noticed this is done the movement of the moon shadow. Seems less to drift sideways. But moves side to side somewhat.  Which makes sense as the frames are being reordered.  But the side to side movement also does seem less extreme. So much so I am wondering if AS/3 is then locking on to a position. And hey presto 

No smear. It's only a theory. I am just as confused as you.  But it's working. So, i will keep doing it. 

Edited October 5, 2022 by neil phillips

[CraigT82]

Thanks Neil I shall give that a whirl and see what happens 

[geoflewis]

This has been a great discussion about best capture and processing techniques, really apprciate all the contributions from everyone.

So based on @neil phillips findings, I decided to use PIPP to join 4 x 2 min SERs from the end of my capture sequence. I ran that through AS3! at 10% to create a reference frame, which I then used to de-rotate the 8 min PIPP SER in WinJupos. Took this back int AS3! and grabbed best 5%, into Registax6 for wavelets, then Affinity photo for final colour saturation and levels tweaks, plus a slight denoise for a smoother look and feel. Et voila....

Nice round moon shadow, with no smearing, so I think the jury is in. No need for lots of separate SERs, just go long with the capture in good seeing, or join separate shorter SERs in PIPP and WinJupos de-rotate will handle it....

Thanks everyone, it's been a huge learning experience for me. I now doubt that I'll ever go back to using the ASI290MM for multiple R,G,B captures with all the headache of processing and combining those 15+ videos and then having to fix a smeared transit in post processing.